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 Re:

I'll let you know if I figure it out, lol >;')

Thanks for the scripture and your interpretation.

 2007/4/27 5:46
UniqueWebRev
Member



Joined: 2007/2/9
Posts: 640
Southern California

 Re: Revelation

Corey!

Never, I repeat never, put yourself down. Not good for you.

Anyway, I wrote a bunch on this on the other thread on Revelation started by SonofThunder!

Look over there too.

Blessings,

Forrest


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Forrest Anderson

 2007/4/27 7:57Profile
JaySaved
Member



Joined: 2005/7/11
Posts: 1131
Kentucky

 Re:

Forgive me if I have missed it Forrest, but why don't you include Revelation 20:7-9 when discussing Gog and Magog?

Especially if you are looking for a time period in which it will take place. Notice in these verses that it states that Gog and Magog will happen "when the thousand years are ended" (v. 7) they will "surround the camp" (v.9) and "fire will come down from heaven to consume them" (v. 9)

Rev 20:7-9 "And when the thousand years are ended, Satan will be released from his prison and will come out to deceive the nations that are at the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them for battle; their number is like the sand of the sea. And they marched up over the broad plain of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city, but fire came down from heaven and consumed them,"



 2007/4/27 11:47Profile
UniqueWebRev
Member



Joined: 2007/2/9
Posts: 640
Southern California

 Re:

Quote:

JaySaved wrote:
Forgive me if I have missed it Forrest, but why don't you include Revelation 20:7-9 when discussing Gog and Magog?

Especially if you are looking for a time period in which it will take place. Notice in these verses that it states that Gog and Magog will happen "when the thousand years are ended" (v. 7) they will "surround the camp" (v.9) and "fire will come down from heaven to consume them" (v. 9)

Rev 20:7-9 "And when the thousand years are ended, Satan will be released from his prison and will come out to deceive the nations that are at the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them for battle; their number is like the sand of the sea. And they marched up over the broad plain of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city, but fire came down from heaven and consumed them,"






Yes, thank you, Jay Saved.

I'm looking for a discrepancy in the old prophecies, where there is a hint that the two different endings of Amos and Isaiah 29 are not the same.

And there's a prophecy somewhere I can't find again that deals with taking care of the enemies of Israel to give them more room for the remainder of the Jews to come home.

I know the quotes you mention, and yes, they are apt, but not quite what I had seen.

Alas that my memory is so bad, and I take terrible notes! Damn that devil and his car accident! And confuse my carelessness, too. And Bless the Name of God that He chose to heal me as much as He has.

But darn it, I never had to take notes before the accident - detail memory freak, not photographic, but highly retentive. And if I take them, I lose them! Notes, I mean.

I still remember the details of complicated loan transactions from twenty years ago, and I can't even find stuff in my own house now. But, fortunately, I read a lot of the Bible before the accident! A lot more since, and intense study, but it doesn't stick the same way after a couple of hours max study per day. My brain has a low recharge capacity. The less I do, the better I do, which doesn't get you very far very fast!!!!

Oh well!

But thank you, my dear Brother.

Blessings,

Forrest


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Forrest Anderson

 2007/4/27 14:31Profile
pastorfrin
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Joined: 2006/1/19
Posts: 1406


 Re:

Hello All,
Hope this helps.

Differentiating Between The Gog/MaGog War And Armageddon

J. Dwight Pentecost points out, that there are a number of considerations which make it very plain that we are dealing with two great wars rather than one during the Tribulation.

1. In the Gog/MaGog war, definite allies of Gog are mentioned as opposing Israel – “MaGog,” “Mescheck,” “Tubal,” “Gomer” (Turkey), Ethiopia, Libya, (see Ezekiel 38) and Egtpt ( see Daniel 11:42], while at Armageddon all nations are engaged against Jerusalem (Joel 3:2; Zeph. 3:8; Zech. 12:3; and 14:2).

2. Gog comes from the north (Ezek. 38:6, 15). While at Armageddon, the armies come from out of the whole earth.

3. Gog is the head of his armies at his invasion (Ezek. 38:15), but at Armageddon,
the Beast is at the head of the invasion (Rev. 19:19).

4. There is a protest against Gog’s invasion (Ezek. 38:13), but at Armageddon there is no such protest because all the nations of the earth have joined themselves with the Beast in his attack against Jerusalem.

5. Gog is overthrown by divine intervention through the convolutions of nature (Ezek. 38:22}, but the armies at Armageddon are destroyed by the sword which goes out of Christ mouth (Rev. 19:15).

6. Gog’s armies array themselves in the open fields (Ezek. 39:5), while at Armageddon they are seen in the city of Jerusalem.

7. Gog’s armies are destroyed outside of Jerusalem on the mountains and in the valleys (Ezek. 39:2-4), while the Beast and his armies are destroyed in the city of Jerusalem itself (Zech. 12:2; 14:2).

8. The Lord calls for assistance in executing judgment on Gog (Ezek. 38:21), while at Armageddon He is viewed as treading the winepress alone (Rev. 19:15;
Isaiah 63:3-6).

9. The invasion by Gog will be sudden and will come with relatively little warning
(38:11), while Armageddon will be no sudden and unexpected event.

Thus, as Dwight Pentecost has suggested,
“Two diverse movements (wars) must be acknowledged.”

It should be noted in regard to the Gog/MaGog war, that this great conflict has nothing to do with the conflict described in (Rev. 20:8), the war that is described there takes place after the Millennium (Rev. 20:7), while the conflict which is described in the passages above and latter in Daniel clearly take place before the Millennium. “Gog” is obviously a reference to an evil, angelic prince who possesses Satanic dominion over those nations who have arrayed themselves against Israel – much in the same way that the “Prince of Persia and the “Prince of Grecia” (Greece) [ described in Daniel (i.e., Dan. 10:13-20) with whom Michael, the archangel of God, fought] possess. Evidently, Gog will be loosed with the devil one final time after the Millennium (please see Rev. 20:7-8).

From Antipas Papers Chapter 15, Part 4 by S.R. Shear

http://www.antipasministries.com/

 2007/4/27 18:09Profile
JaySaved
Member



Joined: 2005/7/11
Posts: 1131
Kentucky

 Re:

pastorfrin, thank you for that information. However, both wars are referred to as Gog and Magog. In fact the mention of Gog and Magog in Rev. 20 is one of the "Achilles heels" of Dispensationalism. In fact, Dispensational teachers must got out of their way and deny the simple meaning of the verses in order to preserve their system.

We must remember that the first century reader who had a knowledge of Ezekiel would instantly make the connection between these two verses through the words 'Gog and Magog', 'surrounding the saints' and 'fire destroying the enemies'.

There are too many similarities to claim these are two different wars.

By the way, why is it that the Dispensational teachers must say that 'Gog/Magog' is before the thousand years? Because their system begins to unravel if it isn't...and that is very telling.

 2007/4/27 21:21Profile
UniqueWebRev
Member



Joined: 2007/2/9
Posts: 640
Southern California

 Re: Gog/Magog - Antipas Papers

Pastorfrin,

Thank you so much for the referances.

I'm surprised I had forgotten the Antipas Papers, which although extreme in political speculation are very well researched.

I may have seen this there, but I've been aware of it for several years, and only found the Antipas site this year.

Seems strange to still be receiving their newsletter. Still, their perspective is unique, passionately political, and I don't put anyone past anything when it comes to Politicians & Company, here in America, or elsewhere.

From history, I know that what they write about there is merely a repetition of what has happened in the past, and consider what they say to be possible, but I don't dwell on it, especially since I can do nothing about it.

What do you make of their work?

Forrest


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Forrest Anderson

 2007/4/28 4:21Profile
UniqueWebRev
Member



Joined: 2007/2/9
Posts: 640
Southern California

 Re: What I'm looking for:

Quote:

JaySaved wrote:
pastorfrin, thank you for that information. However, both wars are referred to as Gog and Magog. In fact the mention of Gog and Magog in Rev. 20 is one of the "Achilles heels" of Dispensationalism. In fact, Dispensational teachers must got out of their way and deny the simple meaning of the verses in order to preserve their system.

We must remember that the first century reader who had a knowledge of Ezekiel would instantly make the connection between these two verses through the words 'Gog and Magog', 'surrounding the saints' and 'fire destroying the enemies'.

There are too many similarities to claim these are two different wars.

By the way, why is it that the Dispensational teachers must say that 'Gog/Magog' is before the thousand years? Because their system begins to unravel if it isn't...and that is very telling.




Jay, I'm looking for something I saw in several dual prophecies that don't match how the Gog/Magog of after the Millenium ends.

It has to do with Israel getting space from the Palestinians, and all of Israel's past enemies, from the Exodus period, with God's help through Michael, not Jesus.

And not being a dispensationalist - mostly I don't see a great deal there that affects prophecy, seemingly being a way that God changes how He teaches man, and deals with His coveneants. As I said in another post, Dispensationalism, to me, is like God 101, 102, 103, 104....

I don't understand your objection, not having studied the matter, but I'm sure the dispensationalists do.

Anyway, if I find what I am looking for, I'll put the basics together, and post it for comment.

Blessings, as always, dear Brother.

Forrest


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Forrest Anderson

 2007/4/28 4:36Profile





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