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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : Any Brother who says he is without Sin is a What?

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rookie
Member



Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4807


 Re:

After thinking about some of the things that I wrote...

I am sorry for not being more careful in the words and thoughts that I have shared here.

First, Christ did not have a carnal mind, a mind that was not able to understand the things of God. Christ had a spiritual mind, a mind that could percieve all things that the Father taught Him through the Holy Spirit.

John 8:28 Then Jesus said to them, “When you lift up the Son of Man, then you will know that I am He, and that I do nothing of Myself; but as My Father taught Me, I speak these things.

Please forgive me

In Christ
Jeff


_________________
Jeff Marshalek

 2007/4/10 0:32Profile
philologos
Member



Joined: 2003/7/18
Posts: 6566
Reading, UK

 Re:

Quote:
Please forgive me


Done!
much love to you...


_________________
Ron Bailey

 2007/4/10 2:22Profile
crsschk
Member



Joined: 2003/6/11
Posts: 9192
Santa Clara, CA

 Re: Wonder full

Quote:
After thinking about some of the things that I wrote...



What a heart warming note. Dear brother it is a [i]constant[/i], how I could but pray for more of this kind of thinking. I know a great many errors have been spoken throughout the years here, a short travel back would perceive so much in far different light.

As strange as it sounds, left off here last night with a sort of 'sweet grievousness' and I think it was due to how much I still do not understand ... indeed [i]we know in part[/i]. This morning the residue remained and found myself once again in the draw of John reading with the backdrop of your prior comments but actually with a difference... Rather than setting out to prove anything, you know the seeking for ammunition way we can often go about things in 'rebuttal' ... honesty requires that there likely was some of that though not in hostility... But the amazing thing that began to dawn afresh is to imagine just a bit of ... need to rephrase it;

To know what He knew and to suffer what He suffered.

How mightily difficult is it to keep back what you [i]know[/i]. To be silent and misunderstood for that silence and more so when the silence is broken. All the early years before John the Baptist. What little we know of his childhood years other than the remarkable account of Him discoursing with the teachers at the age of twelve. And not only that those who heard Him were astonished but His own ... eking out a little bit of that which He seemingly had held back; [i]And he said unto them, How is it that ye sought me? wist ye not that I must be about my Father's business?[/i] Luk 2:49

All these things as that backdrop coming in and hearing John so beautifully stating ...

[i] In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not. And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth. No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath [u]declared[/u] him.[/i]

Right on through, by the time I got to chapter 3 and can I add just one more time how amazing it is that the book of John still arrests and is constantly fresh even some 8 years later ... that for instance this jumped out 'new';

In telling Nicodemus how,

[i]Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again. The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit. Nicodemus answered and said unto him, How can these things be?

Jesus answered and said unto him, [b]Art thou a master of Israel, and knowest not these things?[/b][/i]

That question alone seems worthy of it's own wonder and perhaps examination.

Pardon the digress, but thank you brother. Am humbled by your humbling and forthcoming. You are a dear brother, may the Lord continue to use us to draw each other out into His perfect will and understanding. Much love to you Jeff.


_________________
Mike Balog

 2007/4/10 10:02Profile
rookie
Member



Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4807


 Re:

I was trying to find the threads pretaining to original sin so I could read over them and I found this article by Andrew Bonar which speaks to this thread...

Indwelling sin.

And I John saw these things and heard them.
And when I had heard and seen, I fell down to worship before the feet of the angel which shewed me these things. Then saith he unto me, See thou do it not : for I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren the prophets, and of them which keep the sayings of this book ; worship God.
Rev. 22: 8, 9
'I, John ' — I, who was just a fisherman on the Lake of Galilee, called to follow Christ— 'I saw all these great things.' Then we may see great things yet, as John did! It is interesting how many traits of John's character we find in this wonderful Book of Revelation. He tells us that when he saw his Master after so many years, he fell at His feet as dead, as much with delight as with fear. Then he tells us he 'wept much' when no one was found worthy to open the book; and how honestly he tells things about himself that are not to his credit. It is a great proof of grace when a man can do this—not only say he is a sinner, but tell things he did that were wrong. Our text tells us of the second time that John did this. The angel peremptorily commands him to rise: 'Why worship the servant when the Master is here?' From this incident let us learn the doctrine of indwelling sin in a believer's heart.

I. Indwelling sin as a doctrine.—A believer is entirely free from guilt. God cannot point to a spot of sin on a soul that has believed on Jesus. The believer is also free from the dominion of sin; but he is not free from the existence of sin in the heart. Never till we see Christ as He is shall we be free from the presence of sin.

'One look of Jesus as He is
Will strike all sin for ever dead.'

'If we say we have no sin we deceive ourselves.' If we say the root of sin is out of us we deceive ourselves. In Rom. 7:21 Paul says, 'I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.' 'Law' means a powerful tendency, like a law. There are always remains of the old nature, and in the old nature there is always deceit. 'It doth not yet appear what we shall be.' We are only on the way to complete deliverance.

II. Indwelling sin illustrated by our text.—John was now about ninety years old. For seventy years he had walked close with God. We should have thought that indwelling sin was dead in him. But indwelling sin is often benumbed, but not dead. Paul had no sooner come down from Paradise and the third heavens than God says, 'It will be needful to send him a messenger of Satan, lest he be exalted above measure.' God did not say, 'I will strike his sin dead,' but 'I will keep it down.' There was indwelling sin still in Paul's heart. This disciple John, who had got on so far in the divine life, tells us that when he had been allowed to listen to and see, all that is recorded, and had heard the invitation to the Marriage Supper of the Lamb, he fell at the angel's feet to worship him. Soon after this, John was walking through the New Jerusalem and saw its wondrous walls, its gates of pearl, the redeemed in their robes of white. Would you not have thought that his indwelling sin would be withered up now? 'When I heard these things, I fell down at the feet of the angel,' etc. He had forgotten for a time the glory of the Master, wondering at the glory of the servant. We need to watch to the very end. Satan knows there is tinder in your heart, and he tries to throw in a spark. The beloved John is not perfect yet, though he has been through New Jerusalem.

III. Why does God leave a root of sin in our heart.— He does not take away the existence of sin, but He does take away its dominion. It is like Psalm 110:2: 'Rule . . . in the midst of thine enemies.' The consequences of indwelling sin being left in us are—
(1) To keep us from leaning on our personal holiness. We cannot point to one day of perfect obedience, to one work of perfect holiness. Till the last moment we have to stand upon the blood.
(2) To make us press onward to the day of Christ. 'When He shall appear, we shall be like Him.'

IV. How we are to deal in the meantime with this indwelling sin.—Sin in a believer is as really sin as in any other. I do not know that indwelling sin waxes weaker and weaker. But here is what we are to do.
We are to think of the indwelling Spirit; for as surely as we have indwelling sin we have the indwelling Spirit. Then we have help always at hand. It is like Christ in the ship. We think often we must meet trouble or temptation alone, forgetting the indwelling Spirit. He is not asleep, He is there in the ship, but He waits till we come to Him, and, as it were, awake Him. It is thus we get the victory over indwelling sin.
Another way is to feed faith. 'They overcame by the blood of the Lamb, and by the Word of His testimony.' Nothing startles the devil like holding up the blood. He flees from it. Give every now and then a look to Christ, and if you look to Him He will look to you. Be of good cheer, believer! In spite of indwelling sin we shall not be shut out of heaven, and at length He will present us 'without fault before the throne of God!'

In Christ
Jeff


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Jeff Marshalek

 2007/4/22 9:22Profile
Blunt
Member



Joined: 2007/3/14
Posts: 50


 Re: What I mean is....

Learn to explain what you Know by using less words...

You guys should take all of this Knowledge and teach a sunday school class w/ 3-5 year olds.

Everybody on this thread have TONS of Biblical Knowledge.....But...It sounds like they are reading out of a commentary.

Theology is cool and fun BUT......we will not need the practice of theology when we are in the kingdom. .....Because .... umm..."we will see him as he is".Yup I am a repenting Intellectualist.

 2007/5/18 16:04Profile
philologos
Member



Joined: 2003/7/18
Posts: 6566
Reading, UK

 Re:

Quote:
You guys should take all of this Knowledge and teach a sunday school class w/ 3-5 year olds.

I actually taught a Sunday School class for many years, however we don't get many 3-5 year old here on the site.


_________________
Ron Bailey

 2007/5/18 17:51Profile









 Re: Any Brother who says he is without Sin is a What?

Blunt's original question was:

Quote:
My question is can a believer really live a completely "SET APART " Life and still sin?

The answer to that question is No.

 2007/5/18 20:08
vico
Member



Joined: 2005/5/25
Posts: 258


 Re:

Quote:
The answer to that question is No.


I'm thankful for the Word of God. And for the Holy Spirit that gives revelation in the Word. :-)

 2007/5/18 20:19Profile
rookie
Member



Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4807


 Re:

Compliments wrote:

Quote:
My question is can a believer really live a completely "SET APART " Life and still sin?



How many according to Scripture are "completely" set apart in this life?

In Christ
Jeff


_________________
Jeff Marshalek

 2007/5/18 20:37Profile
vico
Member



Joined: 2005/5/25
Posts: 258


 Re:

(I think this brothers got it!) ;-)

 2007/5/18 21:24Profile





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