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rookie
Member



Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4821
Savannah TN

 Re:

Sister Lynn quoted:

Quote:
. For the promise that he would be the heir of the world was not to Abraham or to his seed through the law, but through the righteousness of faith.'



2Cor. 3:7 But if the ministry of death, written and engraved on stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of the glory of his countenance, which glory was passing away, 8 how will the ministry of the Spirit not be more glorious? 9 For if the ministry of condemnation had glory, the ministry of righteousness exceeds much more in glory.

Paul is teaching about the covenant made with Abraham as you quoted above. He uses the words to describe what God gave to Abraham as what comes "through the righteousness of faith."

In 2 Corinthians 3, Paul compares the covenant given on Mount Sinai to the New Covenant. He uses these words to describe each "ministry."

9 For if the ministry of condemnation had glory, the ministry of righteousness exceeds much more in glory.

All righteousness is expressed by the Son through the Holy Spirit.

John 16

7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth. It is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you; but if I depart, I will send Him to you. 8 And when He has come, He will convict the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: 9 of sin, because they do not believe in Me; 10 of righteousness, because I go to My Father and you see Me no more; 11 of judgment, because the ruler of this world is judged.

The Spirit teaches us about His righteousness because He is now with the Father. He has always been the Spiritual Rock.

Abraham rejoiced as you have quoted...Genesis 15

After these things the word of the LORD came unto Abram in a vision, saying, Fear not, Abram: I am thy shield, and thy exceeding great reward.

Is not Christ the totallity of the exceedingly great reward?

God Bless
Jeff


_________________
Jeff Marshalek

 2007/6/14 2:44Profile
rookie
Member



Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4821
Savannah TN

 Re:

Sister Lynn wrote:

Quote:
Because, Jesus said there would be few who would find the narrow way and this seems to be true in every generation, also. And, I think we have to accept He was most certainly speaking to the lost sheep of the house of Israel when He said that.



Zech 8

12 “For the seed shall be prosperous,
The vine shall give its fruit,
The ground shall give her increase,
And the heavens shall give their dew—
I will cause the remnant of this people
To possess all these.
13 And it shall come to pass
That just as you were a curse among the nations,
O house of Judah and house of Israel,
So I will save you, and you shall be a blessing.
Do not fear,
Let your hands be strong.’

A remnant is saved in this time also. Yet how many will be born in the 1000 year reign of Christ?

God Bless
Jeff


_________________
Jeff Marshalek

 2007/6/14 6:35Profile









 Re: Israel

Jeff said

Quote:
Is not Christ the totallity of the exceedingly great reward?

Yes!

Quote:
... Yet how many will be born in the 1000 year reign of Christ?

Is there any scriptural basis for believing there will be time for repentance after He returns?

 2007/6/14 8:13
rookie
Member



Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4821
Savannah TN

 Re:

Sister Lynn asks"

Quote:
Is there any scriptural basis for believing there will be time for repentance after He returns?



Is 65

17 “For behold, I create new heavens and a new earth;
And the former shall not be remembered or come to mind.
18 But be glad and rejoice forever in what I create;
For behold, I create Jerusalem as a rejoicing,
And her people a joy.
19 I will rejoice in Jerusalem,
And joy in My people;
The voice of weeping shall no longer be heard in her,
Nor the voice of crying.
20 “No more shall an infant from there live but a few days,
Nor an old man who has not fulfilled his days;
For the child shall die one hundred years old,
But the sinner being one hundred years old shall be accursed.
21 They shall build houses and inhabit them;
They shall plant vineyards and eat their fruit.
22 They shall not build and another inhabit;
They shall not plant and another eat;
For as the days of a tree, so shall be the days of My people,
And My elect shall long enjoy the work of their hands.
23 They shall not labor in vain,
Nor bring forth children for trouble;
For they shall be the descendants of the blessed of the LORD,
And their offspring with them.
24 “It shall come to pass
That before they call, I will answer;
And while they are still speaking, I will hear.
25 The wolf and the lamb shall feed together,
The lion shall eat straw like the ox,
And dust shall be the serpent’s food.
They shall not hurt nor destroy in all My holy mountain,”
Says the LORD.

In this section of Scripture it states that a sinner will be cursed...

20 “No more shall an infant from there live but a few days,
Nor an old man who has not fulfilled his days;
For the child shall die one hundred years old,
But the sinner being one hundred years old shall be accursed.

In terms of what I said about how many will be born during the 1000 year reign of Christ,,,I was talking about the remnant, once entering into the millenium rule of Christ, enjoying that reign, and having children who also get to experience that time. According to the Scripture above, not many will die during that 1000 years. Just think of how many will actually see Christ...

Just a thought

Jeff


_________________
Jeff Marshalek

 2007/6/15 2:09Profile









 Re: Israel


Hi Jeff :-D

It has never occurred to me that people might be born during the 1000 year reign of Christ. :-o

That passage you quote from Isaiah, is interesting though, because it I can see why you would assume that sinners would still be being born, taking the reference in v 20 you quoted.

However, the way I have read any reference to sinners during that time, is that they will have been destroyed at the beginning of it, by the word from His mouth when He arrives, and all saints will be with Him.

I don't think one can take the references to the ages of people, as being something confined by time any more, but rather a reference to the age they were when they fell asleep in Christ (if they are now alive in Him).

We know more about
17 “For behold, I create new heavens and a new earth;
And the former shall not be remembered or come to mind.'

from Revelation, and though we know that Christ ate (Luke 24:42, John 21:13), He also had said:

Mark 12:25
For when they shall rise from the dead, they neither marry, nor are given in marriage; but are as the angels which are in heaven.


So, either the millenial reign will be in the old earth with the old heaven, where births and marriages will continue to produce sinners (and wars), or, it will be on the new earth, where sinners are dispatched at the outset, no more are born, and [i]that's[/i] why there will be [u]peace[/u].

I don't [i]think[/i] it can be both peopled with sinners [i]and[/i] without strife.

 2007/6/15 5:57









 Re: Israel


Hi Jeff,

I know you've been preaching these last two Sundays :-) How was it?


I'm linking this thread to posts by RobertW which explain (potted version) something of the history of Jews in and out of the Church, because I've found them helpful to understand more detail.

[b]'All Israel will be Saved?'[/b]

[url=https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=17227&forum=36&start=100&109]https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=17227&forum=36&start=100&109[/url]

 2007/6/17 12:18
CJaKfOrEsT
Member



Joined: 2004/3/31
Posts: 901
Melbourne, Australia

 Re:

Quote:

dorcas wrote:
So, either the millenial reign will be in the old earth with the old heaven, where births and marriages will continue to produce sinners (and wars), or, it will be on the new earth, where sinners are dispatched at the outset, no more are born, and [i]that's[/i] why there will be [u]peace[/u].

I don't [i]think[/i] it can be both peopled with sinners [i]and[/i] without strife.



Firstly, to look at the chronology, the heavens and earth are cast into the lake of fire after the millennium. Secondly, Satan will bound during the millennial reign of Christ. Sinners will be restrained by the enforcement Law going forth out of Zion, and the absence of the tempter in the earth. However, when Satan is freed, there will be many who will be resentful of the fact that they were unable to fulfil their earthly lusts, during the time of the reign of the "dictatorial Christ", and will be more than willing to join him in his attempted insurrection.

The fact that this insurrection will begin, in spite of there being a period where men will learn war no more, having beaten their swords into plowshares, will be the final evidence the wars proceed from men's lustful hearts, spontaneously.

Of course this is my own speculation of what would logically fit the events described in Revelation, but one must consider the logic of God, who crammed 1000 years into seven verses, with the only details given being Satan's bondage, Christ's reign with the resurrection martyrs by his side, no one else being raised from the dead until after Satan's release, rise and fall. The question I would love to ask Him, is why be so sparse in the details?


_________________
Aaron Ireland

 2007/6/17 13:01Profile









 Re: Literal translating

Not speculation Aaron, you're right ~ it's plenary inerrance.
He need not say things a thousand times. Just "they who have ears" is repeated through-out Revelations. We choose to spiritualize where 'we' choose and to literalize where we choose. But doing justice to His Word is to seek it out, by cross-referencing, not twisting verses around in our heads with just our intellect or imagination alone. There are O.T. passages enough that speak of the 1000 yr.s and why the folks living then will be young to old - giving birth and not in resurrected bodies.

One thing He's made clear, is the events surrounding His second advent. Three times more than for His First.

Rev 20:7-9 [u]And when the thousand years are expired[/u], Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, and [u]shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth[/u], Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them. End of Story.


Those mentioned in the previous few verses before these, are those who are resurrected and rule and reign with Christ for that 1000 yr.s in their glorified bodies over people who were not resurrected because, though they didn't worship the beast, or his name or the number of his name, and weren't saved yet, they were looking for some promise of a Messiah ... the true one. So there surely will be folks here for the resurrected Saints to "rule and reign" over with Christ. These .....

Rev 20:4-6 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshiped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years. But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the [u]first[/u] resurrection. Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the [u]first[/u] resurrection: [u]on such the second death hath no power[/u], but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Then after the 1000 yr.s, comes the second resurrection & "second death" ....
Rev 20:10-15 And the devil that deceived [u]them[/u] was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night forever and ever. And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. And [u]whosoever was not found[/u] written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

No sense adding to or taking away from such simpley laid out descriptions.

Lord Bless.

 2007/6/17 14:29









 Re: Israel


I am, at last, reading in the Old Testament again, and making a great deal more sense of some of it, than I did the last time. 8-)


At the top of p4, Compliments quoted from Ezekiel 12. I remembered this when I came to something in Ezekiel 11.

Then fell I down upon my face, and cried with a loud voice, and said, Ah Lord GOD! wilt thou make a full end of the remnant of Israel?

14 Again the word of the LORD came unto me, saying,

15 Son of man, thy brethren, [i]even[/i] thy brethren, the men of thy kindred, and all the house of Israel wholly, [i]are[/i] they unto whom the inhabitants of Jerusalem have said,

Get you far from the LORD: unto us is this land given in possession.

16 Therefore say,

Thus saith the Lord GOD;

Although I have cast them far off among the heathen, and although I have scattered them among the countries, yet will I be to them as a little sanctuary in the countries where they shall come.

17 Therefore say,

Thus saith the Lord GOD;

I will even gather you from the people, and assemble you out of the countries where ye have been scattered, and I will give you the land of Israel.

18 And they shall come thither, and they shall take away all the detestable things thereof and all the abominations thereof from thence.

19 And I will give them one heart, and I will put a new spirit within you; and I will take the stony heart out of their flesh, and will give them an heart of flesh:

20 That they may walk in my statutes, and keep mine ordinances, and do them: and they shall be my people, and I will be their God.

21 But [i]as for them[/i] whose heart walketh after the heart of their detestable things and their abominations, I will recompense their way upon their own heads, saith the Lord GOD.



I'm not sure if this is, historically, the earliest chronological mention of the new heart and spirit, but from God's point of view, it is unmistakably associated with a return to the land of Israel for those claiming the name 'Israel' upon themselves.

 2007/8/7 14:43









 Re: Israel


For those following across the threads on this topic, I am still in Ezekiel, and will respond to a question about that, in the relevant thread, when I'm ready.

I just wanted to share this quotation, which was posted by appolus in a thread called 'We are the Temple', in the Scriptures and Doctrine forum.



[i]Slowly, all through the universe, that temple of God is
being built. Wherever, in any world, a soul, by free-willed
obedience, catches the fire of God's likeness, it is set into
the growing walls, a living stone. When, in your hard fight,
in your tiresome drudgery, or in your terrible temptation, you
catch the purpose of your being and give yourself to God, and
so give Him the chance to give Himself to you, your life -- a
living stone -- is taken up and set into that growing wall.
Wherever souls are being tried and ripened, in whatever
commonplace and homely ways, there God is hewing out the
pillars for His temple. Oh, if the stone can only have some
vision of the temple of which it is to be a part forever, what
patience must fill it as it feels the blows of the hammer, and
knows that success for it is simply to let itself be wrought
into what shape the Master wills.[/i]


... Phillips Brooks (1835-1893), The Law of Growth [1902]

 2007/11/3 16:53





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