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Joined: 2004/4/29
Posts: 92
Addis Ababa, Ethiopia

 Re: sis medki

As you have said many brethren here are compelled to go to that region for God’s work. I don’t know why God made that area a burden to many of us here. Look at our own country it is in a worse condition than that region but God is turning the faces of many here towards that region. A sister who labor with me in prayer will land on Qatar shortly and God promised her that he would use her in that region. This is just a confirmation of what the Holy Spirit said to you. By the way, I’m not an actual Felasha but as you said spiritual Felasha. We call those tribes that are taken the Felasha or Bethe-Israel (Means in our language the house of Israel) Beth means house in our language like beth-el the house of God. Felasha or Felese in our language has the same meaning- do you know that our language come from the Hebrew and Arab-it is called Amharic. I’m afraid I am out of the original topic here-maybe I should have PMed you this.

Your sis. Mek.

Mekdes Tsige

 2007/2/19 2:26Profile


Ready for war
By Con Coughlin
Last Updated: 12:29am GMT 25/02/2007

There may not yet be gas masks in the street in Tel Aviv but no one should underestimate Israel's determination to prevent a nuclear Iran

Down on the seafront in Tel Aviv, where crowds of young Israelis are to be found taking advantage of the unseasonably warm spring sunshine this weekend, it is hard to imagine that Israel is confronting what is arguably the gravest threat to its survival since it emerged from the ashes of the Holocaust 59 years ago.

Statement of intent? A banner carried during demonstrations in Tehran

The apocalyptic rantings of Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and the menace posed by the ayatollahs' outlawed nuclear programme are a million miles from the minds of the couples lounging in the sun sipping cold beers, or engaged in vigorously competitive games of beach volleyball.

Apart from the occasional noisy interruption as a patrol of Cobra military helicopters passes overhead on its way to Gaza, or the sullen presence of the naval patrol vessels anchored offshore on the lookout for waterborne suicide bombers, these carefree souls seem blissfully unaware of the storm clouds of war gathering over the political horizon.

"We have nothing to fear from the Iranians," Amiram Levi told me. "If they become too much of a threat we can deal with them just as we dealt with the Iraqis when they tried to build a nuclear bomb."

Amiram, a 20-year-old computer science student at Tel Aviv University, was of course referring to the daredevil raid made by Israeli fighter jets against Iraq's Osirak nuclear reactor in 1981, which destroyed at a stroke Saddam Hussein's dreams of turning his country into a nuclear superpower.

advertisementMost Israelis believe their country will do the same again if the outside world fails to call a halt to Iran's controversial uranium enrichment programme, which few in Israel doubt is ultimately aimed at giving the ayatollahs a nuclear weapons arsenal to fulfil Ahmadinejad's pledge to erase the Jewish state from the map.

Having already suffered a near-apocalypse in the form of the Holocaust, the Jewish people have no intention of being the hapless victims of Ahmadinejad's genocidal designs. Ehud Olmert, the Israeli Prime Minister, last month gave his most explicit warning to date that Israel was prepared to use military force to prevent Teheran from obtaining a nuclear weapon: "The Jewish people, with the scars of the Holocaust fresh on its body, cannot afford to allow itself to face threats of annihilation once again."

That single sentence sums up the consensus among most of the Israeli people. If the wider world is not prepared to take pre-emptive action to stop Iran from fulfilling its nuclear ambitions, then Israel is ready to act alone.

Normally, in times of national emergency, such as the build-up to the 2003 Iraq War, Israel is bustling with precautionary activity - civil defence organisers handing out gas masks and ensuring the bomb shelters are ready.

But today there is scant evidence of anyone preparing for a potential war. The only gas masks on display are those used by children for fancy dress, while recent press reports that the super-rich residents of Herzliya were building their own state-of-the-art nuclear bunkers were greeted with derision by less well-off citizens.

In contrast, the country's political, military and intelligence-gathering infrastructure has thrown all the resources it can muster at the challenge of neutralising Iran's nuclear capability.

"The amount of effort we are putting into this single issue is unprecedented in the history of the State of Israel," said a senior Israeli security official who works on the strategic committee that has been set up to deal with the Iran threat, which is personally chaired by Olmert.

The committee's main function is to ensure the closest possible liaison on the latest intelligence and military developments. It is also responsible for maintaining a close dialogue with countries supportive of Israel's concerns, particularly the United States, which has seconded officials to work alongside the Israelis.

The committee has yet to have any contact with Britain, although it is hoped that a dialogue will begin "in the not-too-distant future".

Nor should anyone be in any doubt as to the extreme sense of urgency that is driving the Israeli government's activity. To ensure that the country has the best available resources at its disposal, Olmert announced last week that Meir Dagan, the head of Mossad, Israel's overseas intelligence service, had been asked to postpone his retirement until at least the end of 2008.

Dagan, the son of Holocaust survivors, has already served six years in the post, during which time he has become Israel's leading expert on Iran's nuclear programme. "The last thing I want is to have to change horses at a time like this," Olmert remarked after Dagan agreed to serve the extra term.

On the military side, Olmert has also taken the significant step of handing responsibility for preparing Israel's response to the Iranian challenge to the commander of the Israeli Air Force, Eliezer Shkedi.

Shkedi, a former F-16 fighter pilot who saw active service in Lebanon during the 1982 invasion and shot down two Syrian MiG fighters, is in charge of Iran Command, the unit responsible for dealing with any possible threat the Iranians might pose to Israel's security.

As part of the defensive preparations for a missile attack, the Israelis recently conducted a successful test-firing of the new Arrow anti-missile defence system, a development that has mainly been funded by the Pentagon.

The Arrow is the successor to the American Patriot missile system used to shoot down Saddam's Scuds during the 1991 Gulf War. But where the Patriot attacks the incoming missile as it nears its target, the Arrow is designed to intercept a hostile missile much earlier, in the upper atmosphere.

From Israel's perspective this is a crucial advance, especially if the Iranians were to attempt to fire missiles armed with nuclear warheads. "There's no point shooting down a nuclear missile once it's over Israel - the devastation would be just the same," an Israeli military officer explained this week. "The idea is to take it out long before it hits Israel."

That would mean such a missile exploding somewhere over Iraq or Jordan, thereby potentially causing widespread devastation in those countries.

"No one has done much thinking about what might happen if you exploded a nuclear weapon in the upper atmosphere," added the officer. "It's probably something people should look at."

But ensuring Israel has an effective defence against an Iranian missile attack is crucial. Iran has made it clear it will respond to any attack against its nuclear facilities, and its Shahab-3 ballistic missiles have the range to strike throughout Israel.

As for Israel's offensive plans against Iran, the Iran Command team's task is to demonstrate that Israel has the capability to act unilaterally.

"No one is going to take this threat seriously until the State of Israel can demonstrate to the outside world that we have the ability to deal with this menace on our own," said a senior security official who serves on Iran Command.

"The only way we can put pressure on the outside world to deal effectively with Iran's nuclear programme is to demonstrate that we can do this ourselves.

''Of course, we hope it doesn't come to a military solution, and we hope that this can be resolved through diplomacy. But Iran's track record is not good."

For the Israelis, taking out Iran's nuclear facilities is a very different proposition to the 1981 attack on Iraq's nuclear reactor. Back then, the Israelis had the element of surprise - the last thing the Iraqis expected to see was a squadron of Israeli warplanes in their airspace.

Iraq's nuclear programme also posed a relatively straightforward target in that all the facilities were concentrated at the Osirak complex, south of Baghdad. A few well-targeted bombs released in a single air raid were sufficient to do the job.

The Iranians, on the other hand, learning the lessons of the Osirak debacle, have scattered their resources around the country. Obvious targets, such as the controversial uranium enrichment complex at Natanz, are set in specially constructed bomb proof bunkers that would require high-precision, bunker-busting bombs to inflict any serious damage.

Yet another challenge is presented by the recent arrival of the Russian-made Tor M1 anti-aircraft missile system as part of an arms deal signed between Moscow and Teheran last year.

"Of course, attacking Iran is not going to be easy, but we cannot just sit here and let the ayatollahs develop a nuclear weapons arsenal," said a senior Israeli defence official. "Doing nothing is just not an option."

Israeli defence officials are understandably coy about revealing precisely how far advanced their plans are for launching air strikes against Iran in light of the current diplomatic offensive at the United Nations to halt Teheran's enrichment programme ending in failure.

But that the Israeli Air Force, as The Daily Telegraph exclusively discloses today, is negotiating with US coalition commanders in Iraq for permission to fly through US-controlled air space suggests Israeli military planners have overcome most of the key technical hurdles, such as in-flight refuelling and target selection.

"One of the last issues we have to sort out is how we actually get to targets in Iran," an Israeli officer involved in the military planning told me. "The only way to do this is to fly through US-controlled air space in Iraq. If we don't sort these issues out now we could have a situation where American and Israeli war planes are shooting at each other."

The pace of military planning in Israel, which has markedly accelerated since the start of the year, is being driven by Mossad's stark intelligence assessment that Iran, given the rate of progress on uranium enrichment at Natanz, could have enough fissile material for a nuclear warhead by 2009.

This is, it should be stressed, only an assessment as opposed to hard fact, and the Israeli assessment is starkly at odds with those made by other Western intelligence agencies, and by the Vienna-based International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA), the UN-sponsored body responsible for monitoring nuclear development activities worldwide.

Last week, Dr Mohamed ElBaradei, the head of the IAEA, said his assessment was that Iran was still five to ten years away from developing a nuclear warhead, a view that is generally supported by the British and American intelligence communities.

But the Israelis are insistent that their assessments are more realistic. "The problem is that no one really knows what is going on in Iran," said a senior Israeli security official working on Iran's nuclear brief. "Iran has consistently lied to the outside world about what its true intentions really are, and we can't allow a situation to develop where the Iranians, like North Korea, announce they have an atomic bomb, when all the so-called experts said they didn't have the capability or expertise to do it."

Israeli officials point out that IAEA inspectors are not allowed access to the main underground chamber at Natanz where uranium enrichment will soon be taking place on an industrial scale. They are also convinced that the evidence so far accumulated by IAEA officials shows that Iran has a clandestine nuclear weapons programme.

"No one who knows about this - and this includes the experts in London and Washington - is in any doubt that Iran is secretly trying to build a bomb," said the security official. "The only issue at stake is how long it will be before they get one."

If that is the case, then the only question that remains is how much longer the Israelis are prepared to wait before they take matters into their own hands.

For the moment, the Olmert government seems prepared to let the United Nations process play out, even though Israeli officials make no secret of their disdain for the way ElBaradei is handling the crisis. "He doesn't seem to care one way or another whether the Iranians get a bomb. All he wants is a quiet life," said one senior government adviser.

And there is no doubt that the Israelis would prefer their superpower protector, the United States, to do their dirty work for them if the UN-sponsored diplomacy fails to bring Teheran to its senses. But the bottom line is that if, within the next two years, the Iranians are still maintaining their rate of progress on the nuclear front, the Israelis are ready and able to act on their own if need be.

"After the September 11 attacks, we now live in an age of pre-emption," said a senior Olmert adviser. "The Jewish people have not forgotten the last time the world watched and did nothing. We are determined that shall never happen again."

 2007/2/25 3:19


Why don't we ever pray for Palestine?

I agree, however, Palestine is not an enemy. As messed up is the Churches mind is on this subject, Israel is not Gods' chosen people (I am aware that many will not like me saying that). God has only one chosen people. And I can't understand why people don't get this verse into their thinking.
Galatians 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

In other words, "There is NO SUCH A THING as a Jew, NO SUCH A THING as a Greek,.......... for you are all one in Christ Jesus.

My prayer is that the Palestinian people get more land, and make East Jerusalem their Capitol.

We should pray for the peace of the state of Israel and the state of Palestine.

 2007/2/25 12:34


Israel is not Gods' chosen people

then you worship a fork tongued god who is a liar.......and if you believe that God goes back on His Word, and His Covenant promises, than what makes you so sure He won't go back on the promises made to the people that follow the Messiah? and give these promises to say...muslims, hmm?

If don't believe that the Jews and the Nation of Israel figure into the end time prophesies, I don't know what Bible you're reading.

nice prayer, too bad they cant stop killing one another, too bad that Israel doesnt have a real partner for peace in the region.

 2007/2/25 14:06

Joined: 2003/11/23
Posts: 4529

 Re: Israel

Thanks, Bartle...

"Pray for the peace of Jerusalem: they shall prosper that love thee." - Psalm 122:6



 2007/2/25 14:32Profile

Joined: 2004/6/15
Posts: 1924


indeed there is no Jew nor greek in Christ. however this pertains to the means of salvation, namely the same Faith which Abraham had. to be a Jew is not enough, without Christ, the Jew is as any other heathen, hellbound. however there is clearly a work specifically for the Jews and one for Gentiles while we are on this side yet. for example, the temple must be rebuilt and made functional again as it wa sin the days of old, only the Jews can do that. No gentile, though Christian can do that at all. also bro Bartle is right in that Israel still is God's (the Father) chosen people. In His eyes, palestine is a part (as is Jordan and some of lebanon) and so He will restore Israel to her former borders with Jerusalem as the capital (right now it is tel-aviv) from which Christ will rule.

Palestine was a part of Israel when the Father moved the Jews into that land. the philistines lived in that region hence the name palestine (it was only given that name by the romans) so really there will be no peace there until God establishes it. since the philistines (whose descendants are the palestinians) had no right to that land, and still don't mind you (hence God calling the Jews to wipe them out) God will finish off what the Jews failed to do which is to eradicate them. of course repentance is always open.

you can pray for them to get land but what God promised to Abraham will not be given to any other. Israel may not be God's chosen people at your house but God made a covenant with abraham which He will in nowise revoke.

Farai Bamu

 2007/2/27 0:15Profile

Joined: 2006/3/22
Posts: 963
Wheaton, IL


Suggested reading: [url=]Brother Andrew - Light Force[/url]

Ian Smith

 2007/2/27 0:18Profile

 Re: Israel


What I'm about to say is [u]not replacement theology[/u]. If you are thinking that what follows [i]is[/i] replacement theology, then challenge me in the other thread, please. *

Also, this is long, but (I think), necessarily so.

You said

for example, the temple must be rebuilt and made functional again as it was in the days of old, only the Jews can do that.

Please, first, show me more than one Old Testament scripture for this - maybe three - specifically referring to the [i]third[/i] temple?

Also, if there is anything about who will build it, please direct me.

Here are the scriptures which I associate with the third temple.

[color=006666]John 2:13 - 22 (NKJV)
Now the Passover of the Jews was at hand, and Jesus went up to Jerusalem. And He found in the temple those who sold oxen and sheep and doves, and the moneychangers doing business.

When He had made a whip of cords, He drove them all out of the temple, with the sheep and the oxen, and poured out the changers' money and overturned the tables. And He said to those who sold doves, "Take these things away! Do not make My Father's house a house of merchandise!"

Then His disciples remembered that it was written, "Zeal for Your house has eaten Me up." (Psalm 69:9)

So the Jews answered and said to Him, "What sign do You show to us, since You do these things?" Jesus answered and said to them, [b]"Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up."[/b]Then the Jews said, "It has taken forty-six years to build this temple, and will You raise it up in three days?" [b]But He was speaking of the temple of His body.[/b]

Therefore, when He had risen from the dead, His disciples remembered that He had said this to them; and they believed the Scripture and the word which Jesus had said.

Ephesians 2:11 - 22
Therefore remember that you, once Gentiles in the flesh -- who are called Uncircumcision by what is called the Circumcision made in the flesh by hands -- that at that time you were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world. But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ.

For He Himself is our peace, who has made both one, and has broken down the middle wall of separation, having abolished in His flesh the enmity - the law of commandments in ordinances - so as to create in Himself [u]one new man[/u] [i]from[/i] the two, making peace, and that He might reconcile them both to God in one body through the cross, thereby putting to death the enmity. And He came and preached peace to you who were afar off and to those who were near.

For through Him we both have access by one Spirit to the Father. Now, therefore, you are no longer strangers and foreigners, but fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God, having been built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ Himself being the chief corner in whom the whole building, being joined together, grows into a holy temple in the Lord, in whom you also are being built together for a dwelling place of God in the Spirit.

1 Peter 2:1 - 10
Therefore, laying aside all malice, all deceit, hypocrisy, envy, and all evil speaking, as newborn babes, desire the pure milk of the word, that you may grow thereby, if indeed you have tasted that the Lord [i]is[/i] gracious. Coming to Him, a living stone rejected indeed by men, but chosen by God, precious, you also as living stones are being built up a spiritual house - a holy priesthood - to offer up spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ.

Therefore it is also contained in the Scripture,

"Behold, I lay in Zion
A chief cornerstone, elect, precious,
And he who believes on Him will by no means be put to shame."

Therefore, to you who believe, [i]He is[/i] precious; but to those who are disobedient,

"The stone which the builders rejected
Has become the chief cornerstone,"


"A stone of stumbling
And a rock of offense."

They stumble, being disobedient to the word, to which they also were appointed.

But you [i]are[/i] a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, His own special people, that you may proclaim the praises of Him who called you out of darkness into His marvelous light; [u]who once [i]were[/i] not a people but [i]are[/i] now the people of God[/u], who had not obtained mercy but now have obtained mercy.

John 10:14 - 16
"I am the good shepherd; and I know My [i]sheep[/i] and am known by My own. As the Father knows Me, even so I know the Father; and I lay down My life for the sheep. And other sheep I have which are not of this fold; them also I must bring, and they will hear My voice; and there will be one flock [i]and[/i] one shepherd.

Hebrews 12:22 - 24
But you have come to Mount Zion and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, to an innumerable company of angels, to the general assembly and church of the firstborn registered in heaven, to God the Judge of all, to the spirits of just men made perfect, to Jesus the Mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling that speaks better things than [i]that of[/i] Abel.

Galatians 4:19 - 31
My little children, for whom I labor in birth again until Christ is formed in you, I would like to be present with you now and to change my tone; for I have doubts about you. Tell me, you who desire to be under the law, do you not hear the law?

For it is written that Abraham had two sons: the one by a bondwoman, the other by a freewoman. But he of the bondwoman was born according to the flesh, and he of the freewoman through promise, which things are symbolic.

For these are the two covenants: the one from Mount Sinai which gives birth to bondage, which is Hagar -- [u]for this Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia, and corresponds to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children[/u] -- but the Jerusalem above is free, which is the mother of us all.

For it is written:

"Rejoice, O barren, who do not bear!
Break forth and shout,
You who are not in labor!
For the desolate has many more children
Than she who has a husband."

Now we, brethren, as Isaac, are children of promise.

But, as he who was born according to the flesh then persecuted him [i]who was born[/i] according to the Spirit, even so, now.

Nevertheless what does the Scripture say?

"Cast out the bondwoman and her son, for [u]the son of the bondwoman [b]shall not be[/b] heir with the son of the freewoman[/u]."

So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman but of the free.

Galatians 6:12 - 16
As many as desire to make a good showing in the flesh, these [i]would[/i] compel you to be circumcised, only that they may not suffer persecution for the cross of Christ.

For not even those who are circumcised keep the law, but they desire to have you circumcised that they may boast in your flesh. But God forbid that I should boast except in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world has been crucified to me, and I to the world.

For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision avails anything, but a new creation. And as many as walk according to this rule, peace and mercy upon them, and upon the Israel of God.[/color]


Please be patient (with me), as this is only [i]part[/i] of my thesis.

* [url=][/url]

 2007/2/27 7:06

Joined: 2004/6/15
Posts: 1924


Sis Dorcas
well i think you have some valid questions here which i will try my best to answer. thank you for your graciousness in all this (and in other discussions) which allow for reasoning together.

Please, first, show me more than one Old Testament scripture for this - maybe three - specifically referring to the third temple?

Well i'm not entirely sure of where in the N.T. that is. i had thought of daniel's mention of the abomination of desolation. some would say but it seems that was fulfilled in Antiochus Ephiphanes, one of the Seleucid kings of Syria. but then Christ speaks of this same event in the gospels which means it had not happened, or been fully fulfilled. then came Titus in 70 A.D. i'm not sure if Titus did set up an image of himself or Zeus like Antiochus did (can someone answer that?)but if he didn't, then perhaps this desolation is yet to happen. at any rate, there is a group of Jews which has been labouring over the last several decades i think on replacating every article in the temple and preparing it for use in a third temple. Evidently the Jews for whatever reason seem to think that there will be a third temple. Then also we have this from the writings of Paul in 2 Thessalonians 2

[b]He will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God or is worshiped, so that he sets himself up in God's temple, proclaiming himself to be God. [/b]

this doesn't sound like what Titus did and it seems to speak to a later time about a man who will proclaim himself to be God (like Antiochus Epipiphanes, the surname Epiphanes means "God made manifest") and performs miracles (like one of the beasts in the Revelation, Rev 13)which deceive people.It seems the temple in question here is not the one which Titus destroyed but another one altogether. also there is no mention of the destruction of this particular temple which i think differs it from the one destroyed by Titus.

the scriptures you quoted about Christ tearing down the temple and rebuilding it in 3 days are very valid and in proper argument from this end.

But you are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, His own special people, that you may proclaim the praises of Him who called you out of darkness into His marvelous light; who once were not a people but are now the people of God, who had not obtained mercy but now have obtained mercy.

we are grafted into the tree even though we are wild branches but we do not become Jews in the sense of having been born a Jew. This doesn't make us any less but there are some things which we can't do because we are not Jews as per the laws of Moses. The reason why it was such a wicked thing when Titus entered the temple was because no Gentile was permitted to do so by the law. of course in heaven God will live with us and there will be no need of a temple but until such time, the laws governing the temple and all pertaining to it on this side of eternity stand.

hope that helps and let us indeed reason together and be corrected so we come to a right understanding of these things.

God bless

Farai Bamu

 2007/2/28 20:01Profile

Joined: 2006/8/17
Posts: 286

 Re: Israel

Pray for the safety of Israel.

I felt the same way after hearing the featured sermon by David Wilkerson.

Hey Bartle,

Did you post this after listening to that sermon?

Leonardo Santana

 2007/2/28 20:22Profile

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