if my pastor or the evangelist on the street was the first preacher to give a "Hellfire and Brimestone" sermon I would understand someone questioning it's validity....but Jesus gave us this truth. that's what he preached. we follow Him, we live by His truth, His Gospel.
if it condemns you or annoys you, and you would rather not hear a message on hell and judgement it could be a tell tell sign on the condition of your heart. (i say that with love) If it fills the heart with fear instead of hope and a burden for the lost and a desire to be like Jesus then you have a serious heart condtion to consider....


notice a message from our Lord, Jesus Christ.

-Luke 17:28-30, "Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot; they did eat, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted,they builded;
But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained 'fire and brimestone' from heaven, and destroyed them all.
Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of Man is revealed."

-Luke 13:3, "I (Jesus) tell you, nay; but, except you repent, ye shall all likewise perish."

-John 3:16, "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life."

Hear the balance of the Gospel....
*Jesus showed us the example of them who did not believe...
*and the destiny of them who will not believe...
*and the hope of those who do believe.

Jesus preached it ....why won't you!
God Bless

p.s.
speak the truth in love....that will change the world

[i][color=0000CC]Holy Spirit have your way on this subject, and conduct us in brotherly love in its discussion ... In Jesus name ... Amen[/color][/i]

[color=CC0000] i say this little prayer beforehand because i'm kinda punch drunk from gettin into threads like this but feel an unction ... i'm just stating some things i think i understand about this subject, so any disagreements please be gentle :-D ... Just trying to share in the spirit of Rom. 8:28 ...

First i'm in agreement with what bro Robert said about King Jimmy's quote;
"True hell-fire preaching is simply seeking to put the gospel in its eternal perspective. A gospel message that is blind to eternity is not a gospel message."

This really hits home in my more recent acute awarness about the painful, inescapable eternity of hell if one winds up there ... But first i think we need to be aware of a confusion that surrounds the word ...

i know that hell is associated with Sheol, and Hades, which i understand to be the holding place of the spirits of mankind after death, the holding places spoken of by David often, and Christ in what many concider a parable (tho i think it real) of the rich man and Lazarus in Luke 16, and the place when Christ rose He kicked the bottom out of for all saints once there, and because of His rising saints that subsequently die go directly to heaven to be with Him, reasoned from the fact that whenever He comes back for us according to 1Thes.4: 13-18 those dead in Him come back from heaven with Him ... Whew! ...

This understanding about hell as Hades seems validated by Rev. 20:13 and in 14 itself is cast into THE ULTIMATE HELL, which in actuality is properly called "the second death" & "the lake of fire"(associated with Gehenna, the valley of Hinnom) which according to Rev. 21:14 "burneth with fire and brimstone" ... Hence the terminology "fire and brimstone" preaching" ... In my ubderstanding the difference between hell as Sheol and Hades to the unsaved denotes the actual place of the holding of their spirits only until their resurrection to the Great White Throne Judgment, and while Luke 16 denotes that their is pain to such spirits in this place it' gotta be like a walk in the park compared to what happens after resurrection, when they are reunited with their flesh, and then because their names are not found in the Lambs Book of Life are now thrown into "the lake" with an actual body that will never die and fully capable with all nerve endings in tact to experience the place where the fire and the worm never cease, the place where the damned will experience for eternity the wrath of a forever bound satan, the fallen angels and demons ... i call this scary and folk need to be warned, although many of today's scientifically minded folk think it insanity to believe such as this, and many saints would rather not even broach the subject let alone preach it ...

In my almost 30 years of being saved i don't think i've ever heard a real fire and brimstone message, tho i witness to folk "fire and brimstone" ... For one thing today preachers and laity alike seem to be afraid of the Revelation dismissing it as not being necessary to the Church, so over time telling people that without salvation in Christ you're headed straight to hell (in actuality - the lake) just seems a bit to archaic, barbaric and unpopular ...

Anyhow i'd like to attempt adressing two of lovegrace's questions ...

[b]Quote;
"1. Who did Christ preach to when He gave a 'fire and brimstone' message?"[/b]

i'm amazed of how most saints think Christ's ministering to us stopped in the Gospels, when the last thing He said to us is in actuality the Revelation ...To me, in this "fire and brimstone" context, His message is to US His Church since the term is found in the Revelation of (the risen) Jesus Christ, which God gave unto Him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass ... As i also believe He meant US to not only study this message for ourselves, but that we are to discuss it together, it's to be preached from our pulpits, and certainly shared as a warning to the unsaved, in tandem with our proclamation of the Gospel, for Jesus also said of it, "Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the time is at hand."

[b]Quote;
"2. What was the purpose of it? (i.e. Always to Fear God, or are there other purposes of a 'fire and brimstone' message)"[/b]


i've been taught (and i can see this) that the Revelation is meant as a consolation to the believer, and certainly as a warning to the unbeliever ... This is how i use it in both instances ... [/color]


[b]THE BEGINNING OF THE 1000 YEAR REIGN OF CHRIST;
Rev.20[/b]
[1] And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
[2] And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
[3] And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
[4] And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years. This is the first resurrection.
[6] Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

[color=CC0000] i use this in ministering assurance to the saved, and warn the unsaved that they want to be in the kingdom of God within the grace period before this first ressurection because ...[/color]

[5] But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished.

[color=CC0000] ... and that they don't want to die in this grace period without acknowledging Christ as their personal Savior because they will not be a part of the first ressurection and will most assuredly fall into the awful category of the Great White Throne Judgment because ...[/color]

[b]THE END OF THE 1000 YEAR REIGN OF CHRIST;[/b]
[7] And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
[8] And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
[9] And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

[10] [b]And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.[/b]

[11] And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.
[12] And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
[13] And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

[b][14] And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
[15] And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.[/b]

The term "fire and brimstone" preaching originated from the famous sermon of Johnaton Edwards "Sinners in the hands of an angry God". This particular sermon was so anointed that men and woman clutched the pews for fear of slipping into hell and over 500 were saved in one night. But of course we just want to preach the "truth in love"? The gospel message is repent or face eternity in hell. Is this the truth? Yes...well what better way to show love than speak this truth!

However this should not be a debate about style or content. If one was to read the very same sermon of Johnaton Edwards and imitate the "style" of todays "fire and brimstone" preaching the same dramatic effect would I suspect not happen. What is missing? The anointing of God on a surrendered vessel, demonstrating Christ alive to a dying generation. Another Gospel has infilitrated the church (Gal 1:8) and we are left with a weak, insepid, prone to backslide christians.Over 80% of new converts these days are backsliding while in Finneys days over 85% of converts NEVER backslid. What is missing? Again I say the anointing of God and a pure Gospel.We are in the days of the "another gospel" Paul spoke off. Do not be duped. We may say as John the baptist "Is this the Christ or do we look fo another". Mat 11:4 Go and show John again those things which ye do hear and see: The blind receive their sight, and the lame walk,the lepers are cleansed, and the deaf hear, the dead are raised up, and the poor have the gospel preached to them.

Christ has not changed. This the effect of a true gospel. When a movement arises in the church and we wonder is this the Christ the answer remains the same.

Oh how we need a move of God to show God to be real to a lost generation forging on to hell unchecked by this generations inefective "other gospel".

May God get us out of our debating bunkers and make us (ME!) true soldiers of Jesus Christ.

_________________
Garrett O'Regan

oddly enough the Pharisees and religious leaders of Jesus' day had a perfect understanding of the language and meaning of every word jesus spoke. they were quite familiar with the culture of the day for it was there culture too.
they studied well the wrightings of Moses and the prophets but still missed the boat because of the condition of thier heart!
The simplicity of the Gospel...so simple that even a fool could understand it.
the carnal man cannot recieve the things of God...not even in the original Greek. it's still the Spirit that makes known the things of God!

we complicate the truth of Christ, at times, by trying to dilute it with theological gobbly goo...and intelectual rhetoric.

shallow waters with enough trash floating in it can look very deep....until you try to jump in head first!

Quote:

I think the phrase "hell, fire, and brimstone messages" puts a bitter taste in the folks of mouth is because we immediately imagine some self-righteous, holier-than-thou man with beeds of sweat rolling down his brow, preaching with elation that he is going to heaven, while you are going to hell. Such men should evoke such a taste in our mouth, and such preaching should be looked down upon.

However, true Biblical hell-fire preaching comes from a broken man who knows that if it were not but for the grace of God, he would be going to hell with those whom he is preaching to. Such a man is not gleefully proclaiming the endless misery the lost soul shall suffer, rather, he proclaims it out of a sense of mourning. He hates that he has to do such, and if given the choice, would not do it.

True hell-fire preaching is simply seeking to put the gospel in its eternal perspective. A gospel message that is blind to eternity is not a gospel message.


In Gods' eyes and here is where I believe division came in, started and looks like it is here to stay. In Gods eyes we are all brothers and sister/brethrens, and we must learn first and foremost how to be a brethren before we can be a friend and then a spouse, if this is what the Lord wills to do. In the world we learn first how to be a friend and then once we were saved we learned how to be a brother or a sister.

How does it go, (Laying down your life for a FRIEND) Where is that verse? Are you my brother, are you my sister? In Heaven we will all be brothers and sister to each other. May I be your Sister? Can you be my brother?

Brothers and Sisters let us love one another without the façade, without the insinuation without stirring the pot if you will, but if we must stir it, and if the water is bitter, then lets throw in some sticks and make it sweet so that we can all drink of it.

"I know, I know Obe1 that it does not look good at first, but When God is done with it,
it will look good in the spirit".

It always does.

The article on hellfire and brimstone is indeed sobering. It is not within human nature to ponder on such truth as our fallen Adamic nature rebels against such reality. However, Brownlow North in his book "The Rich man and Lazarus" enunciates on this truth in such a gripping way that it cannot be lightly dismissed. I am wondering if anyone out there has listened to the recording made of the screams of the damned when a drill was put down in Siberia 14 kilometres into the earth and the screams were heard. This apparently can be listened to on the net. Whether the recording can be substantiated I do not know, however, I have listened to it and it is frightening. Verifyable or not, it must serve as a reminder that Jesus knew that Hell is a real place and that safety in Christ is the only answer.

_________________
Chris Newnham

I don't know about the fire and brimstone pastors, but these pastors that get up there and holler like there calling the cows in or maybe was a marine drill sarge are about to drive me totally nuts, I love to watch my Christian TV but it getting harder to find a Charles Stanley anymore, Maybe they think like my Dad did by screaming at me I will get the message better, but with me it's just the opposite, I have always heard want someone to listen"Whisper" :-)

_________________
Bill

I can understand what you mean. Still, a preacher must be faithful to his text. If he reads "oh yeah..ha..ha.. heeeree God will "throw" sinners in hell ouchie hee hee...anyways- my dog..." This is absolutely wrong. You must be faithful to the tone of the scriptures.

_________________
Kristy