| Poster | Thread |
| | Re: How To Be A Popular Preacher Today | | "Now, John answered Him, saying, 'Teacher, we saw someone who does not follow us casting out demons in Your name and we forbade him because he does not follow us'.
But Jesus said, "[color=CC3300]Do not forbid him, for no one who works a miracle in My name can soon afterward speak evil of me.[/color][b][color=CC0033]For he who is not against us is on our side".[/color][/b]
[b]Mark 9:38-40[/b]
Those are Jesus' Words, not mine.
neil |
|  2006/12/12 11:41 | | murdog
Member
Joined: 2006/2/4
Posts: 352
Fort Frances, Ontario
| | Re: | |
I know that you cannot tolerate wicked men, that you have tested those who claim to be apostles but are not, and have found them false. Revelation 2:2
But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them--bringing swift destruction on themselves. 2 Peter 2:1
As I urged you when I went into Macedonia, stay there in Ephesus so that you may command certain men not to teach false doctrines any longer 1 Timothy 1:3
For such men are false apostles, deceitful workmen, masquerading as apostles of Christ. 2 Corinthians 11:13
At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other, and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, Matthew 24 10:12
Murray
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Murray Beninger
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| | 2006/12/12 15:33 | Profile | EVAVGELIST
Member
Joined: 2006/11/23
Posts: 113
PERRIS CA
| | Re: | | In todays world it seems like so many people want to be pulpit police officers.
Genesis 50:19 19 And Joseph said unto them, Fear not: FOR AM I IN THE PLACE OF GOD?
It seems like today people want to be in the place of God.
What do they preach? If you want to convince someone that they call themselves true Apostles and you found them liars, PROVE IT. Show me what they teach, show me what Scripture they disobey and show me all the false doctrine. Lastly back up all your claims with the BIBLE.
EVERYTHING ELSE IS JUST NAME CALLING. BLA BLA BLA
Evangelist
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JOSHUA MEYERS
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| | 2006/12/13 0:52 | Profile | AshleyJnr
Member
Joined: 2006/6/17
Posts: 45
Guolburn, NSW Australia
| | Re: | | Hmm..
Just wondering, is possible that false prophets will not actually seem to disobey scripture?
Isn't it likely that they may just leave the bits that they do disobey out??
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| | 2006/12/13 6:07 | Profile | murdog
Member
Joined: 2006/2/4
Posts: 352
Fort Frances, Ontario
| | Re: | | Evangelist,
I do not apologize for wanting to sit under sound doctrinal teaching.
Are you not aware of the teachings that are propagated by the modern day preachers as scriptural? Or the things they leave out in their sermons such as sin, repentance and hell?
I am not calling anyone names. It does concern me that these men and women are willing to exchange the souls of men for money and comfort in the here and now.
I am referring to people who teach the prosperity gospel or just a watered down gospel. And both are no gospels at all.
"But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned!" Galatians 1:8
Murray
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Murray Beninger
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| | 2006/12/13 8:12 | Profile | Yeshuasboy
Member
Joined: 2006/6/10
Posts: 668
Northern Rockies, BC, Canada
| | Re: | | Larry King: What if you're Jewish or Muslim, you don't except Christ at all?
Joel Osteen: You know, I'm very careful about saying who would and wouldn't go to heaven...I don't know.
Ya know, in all honesty, I really hope that this man repents of saying such cowardly foolishness. Could you imagine Paul, Peter, John, etc. saying such words?
How can you teach that kind of doctrine and call yourself a Pastor or even a Reverend?
However...there was another man who was one of the pastors at the Toronto Vineyard who recently wrote an article and posted it on the net, apologizing for his involvement with that movement. And I say, Praise God for granting him repentance :-D ...for He came calling sinners to repentance...Praise God...alot of religious folk think they're pretty good people...Well, only God is good (Luke 18:19)
Praise God,
richie
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Richie
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| | 2006/12/13 9:30 | Profile | Chariot
Member
Joined: 2006/1/12
Posts: 57
| | Re: | | Quote:
In todays world it seems like so many people want to be pulpit police officers...back up all your claims with the BIBLE...EVERYTHING ELSE IS JUST NAME CALLING, BLA BLA BLA
Hello Evangelist,
There seems to be a subtle inconsistency about your post, in that you do exactly what you set out for others to prove there not doing - name calling. Aren't we told that false teachers will arise and that they are to be marked? I agree that great pain and care should be taken to ensure that this is done in a godly way
But i digress. There are legions of sites that 'police the pulpits,' - admittedly some better than others - toiling, with extensive citations from the preacher in question, to determine that a false gospel, teaching, or anything else that needs to be marked is done biblically. If you don't agree with what they find or the conclusions they draw, that is another story.
I've often wondered, is not the rise in discernment ministries a direct correlation of the growing tide of false doctrine being drummed from the pulpits and over the airwaves?
I believe that what Olsteen teaches has done untold damage to the body of Christ. His message is overly tailored to blunt the double-edged SWORD. If you would like proof i would be happy to direct you to the many sites specializing in this. A few saints on this thread have already done this however.
God Bless
Rob |
| | 2006/12/13 9:58 | Profile |
| | Re: Richie of Kamloops | | Brother,
let me preface this by saying that I'm not a big fan of Joel Osteen, just so you know, not a big fan of Toronto and the stuff thats going on up there, and in all honesty, I'm not a big fan of some posters around here, may God bless them all.
But your going wrong in your posting by calling a man "cowardly", and in essence a "fool(ishness)".
Didnt you pick up that Larry King's question was a "bait" question? This is a secular program with a secular audience, and they are just looking for the opportunity for a Christian "pastor", "preacher", whatever you want to call him, to pronouce judgement and hellfire on a secular audience, so they can turn around and say, "see! This is a "christian".....and THIS is the Gospel?
The first words uttered by Jesus at the start of His public ministry was "Repent, the Kingdom of Heaven is near you". Repent, as you know can mean "turn", "turn away"...and that "they" turn to God and be healed, and another way to use "heal" is "to be saved".
The Good News, the Gospel is "repent, the Kingdom of Heaven is near you". GOOD NEWS. to Larry, I would explain, that the curtain leading into the Holy of Holies was ripped in two, and that everyone, thruout the world can now enter into the Holy Of Holies....the "Kingdom of Heaven is near you".
It means if your god is money, turn away from this God and turn to Jesus, because the god that is money will fail you, if your god is feeding the flesh, turn from this repent, BECAUSE the Kingdom of Heaven is NEAR YOU, and it is joy and peace everlasting, it is eternal life.
Joel used the words "very careful", he didnt say "afraid". Now Richie, you ever been in front of a secular audience? You have to be careful about the words you choose, you have to speak with unction, to use the Word, to make people ENVIOUS of so great a salvation, make them ENVIOUS of the JOY we have IN CHRIST.
It's a tightrope, especially in front of a 21st century media soaked secular audience. I saw James Dobson being interviewed by Larry King, and I wasnt that pleased , for reasons that I will keep private, but Larry didnt pose such a question to him, they talked about political stuff and the so-called "culture wars", which, in my opinion have nothing to do with the Gospel.
In fact the 109th Congress, this last session did nothing except hypervetilate about Terry Schiavo, stem cell research and the same sex marriage debate. "Culture Wars", that was it.
You speak of what Paul would have said, what do you think what Paul meant in First Corinthians 19 thru 23?
"To those not having the law, I bcame like one not having the law (though I am not free from God's law but am under Christ's law) so as to win those not having the law".
"To the weak, I became weak, to win the weak".
you can read thru that Passage yourself, and pray on it, if you so desire.
But they, the secular audience out there is weak, some dont even believe in God, or that the Bible is the Word of God, its like pearls to swine, and if a guy goes out there Holy Ghost guns blazing and calls down hellfire, in a question that is a "bait" question, he is doing Christ no service.
Mind you and I will say this again, I am no follower or fan of the ministry of Joel Osteen, but I'll tell ya what, and this thread is perfect example: in my Bible, on the upper margin of page 1768, I wrote "sermonindex" above this verse of Romans:
"Therefore, let us stop passing judgement on one another. Instead, make up you mind not to put any stumbling block or obstacle in your brother's way".
Romans 14:13
(in context Paul is speaking of those who eat meat or not, on both sides of this passage, you can look at that yourself)
okay, I'm done. May God bless you today is my prayer. neil |
| | 2006/12/13 13:15 | | roman
Member
Joined: 2005/4/18
Posts: 41
| | Re: | | Quote:
You speak of what Paul would have said, what do you think what Paul meant in First Corinthians 19 thru 23?
"To those not having the law, I bcame like one not having the law (though I am not free from God's law but am under Christ's law) so as to win those not having the law".
"To the weak, I became weak, to win the weak".
you can read thru that Passage yourself, and pray on it, if you so desire.
But they, the secular audience out there is weak, some dont even believe in God, or that the Bible is the Word of God, its like pearls to swine, and if a guy goes out there Holy Ghost guns blazing and calls down hellfire, in a question that is a "bait" question, he is doing Christ no service.
Leonard Ravenhill said something like this (sorry cant quote verbatim) "If Jesus preached what these preachers preach today He would not be crucified." In the same way I would say "If Paul preached this type of message to Gentiles & Jews, he would not be persecuted."
The way I see this presentation of the gospel is not of being like them (as stated above) but its more of "fear of man." Fear of how people will react ... fear they will be hurted ... fear they might turn away from Christians or Christianity.
If Paul had become like the Gentiles & Jews in this manner of preaching the gospel, they would have not persecute & even desired his death. What's offending in saying "Jesus the Way, the Truth & the Life no one comes to the Father except through Him." It is offending to the people who are perishing.
No matter how you speak the word of God in love, people will still be hurt because they can not accept the truth. The same way people were hurt in the preaching of Jesus & Paul. If we preach the Word in love & purity and people get hurt, I believe we have clean hands before God. But if we hurt them because of our fleshly preaching, then we are accountable to God; much more if we coat the gospel.
The Word of God is a sword.
Hebrews 4:12 (KJV) For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.
Revelation 1:16 (KJV) And he had in his right hand seven stars: and out of his mouth went a sharp two edged sword: and his countenance was as the sun shineth in his strength.
"Lets have fear of God and not fear of men."
In brotherly love,
roman
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| | 2006/12/20 1:51 | Profile | sermonindex
Moderator
Joined: 2002/12/11
Posts: 39795
Canada
Online! | | Re: | | I just wrote a article on this same topic:
[b]THE CHURCH THAT WOULD NOT SUFFER! by Greg Gordon[/b]
https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=13855&forum=16
Here is a excerpt:
Quote:
ANCIENT AND MODERN
To any careful observer of the church in our day we realize there is a great disparity between the modern day example and the apostolic original. Here is anonymous article written in the 1700s depicting some of these disparities very vividly. Oh for a reviving of the true apostolic spirit in the Church is the crying need of our day, or perhaps the only answer for the Church in this day:
Ancient and modern preachers. The difference between ancient and modern preachers taken from the Scriptures. If any think me to severe to the Clergy, let them study the examples of Christ and his apostles, and compare the picture.
Ancient: CHRIST call'd his preachers to renounce their wealth, And set a glorious pattern in himself, Who, tho' he did possess all things in store, Yet for our sakes, became exceeding poor.
Modern: Some preachers now, large salaries do fix, So that, by preaching, they may now grow rich, So far departing from their blessed Lord, They worship mammon and a golden god.
Ancient: CHRIST told them, to be wise, they must be fools, And that not all the knowledge of the schools, Could ever teach one soul the way to heaven, That this is only by his spirit given.
Modern: But now, some go unto the schools of men, Expecting heavenly wisdom to obtain, And that, by reading books, they may acquire The holy spirit, the baptismal fire.
Ancient: CHRIST charg'd his followers, titles to contemn And, often faithfully, admonish'd them Not to be called RABBI, learned, wise, But all ambitious selfishness despise.
Modern: Now, some are call'd Archbishops and Prelates, Reverend Doctors, learn'd, wise, and great, The reverend parson, and master of arts, Old pharisaick pride, in all its parts.
Ancient: CHRIST told his followers, to be meek and mild, As low and humble as a little child, That they must not aspire to lofty seats, But must come down and wash each others feet.
Modern: Now some, in garments long, do love to stand, With college flourishes, they wave their hands, Read their writings, and then call it preaching, Old orthodox apostolick teaching. Now money, schools and books supply the place, Of humble love, and sanctifiing grace, When money fails, these teachers often flee, The reason is, because, they hirelings be. When any now, are call'd of GOD, to teach, And by his spirit, are sent forth to preach, These learn'd scholars soon, will them degrade, Lest their cheap preaching should spoil their trade.
Ancient: CHRIST told his followers that they must expect, The world would hate them treat them with neglect, That as they hated him without a cause, So they would hate his followers and his laws. Fools in the eastern of the world.
Modern: No, say some modern preachers, 'tis not true, The world will love us and respect too, We are commanded for to live in peace, We will not then disturb their carnal ease.
Ancient: CHRIST told them, a distinction they must make, That they, the sheep and goats, must separate, That, as the sheep were separate from wolves. They must not be by worldly maxims rul'd.
Modern: No, say some teachers, this is a mistake; Therfore, we now will join the church and state. Tho' this is very far from GOD'S design, This jargon union, they attempt to join.
Ancient: CHRIST oft declares, the help of man is vain, And, that except a man be born again, And that except we all converted be, GOD'S kingdom we can never, never see.
Modern: Some hold, that there is yet some power in man, And that by creeds, and modes, and forms he can, Profess, confess, and plead, and, by degrees, The holy, angry, jealous GOD, appease.
Ancient: CHRIST says he is the way, the truth, the life, That, our of him, we have no strength or light. We have no faith, no hope, no might, at all. He is our joy, our hope, our all in all.
Modern: Why then, among the herdsmen, is such strife, When all of them can't bring a flea to life. Striving, both night and day, to proselyte, And yet cannot make one hair black or white!
Ancient: CHRIST'S followers, of old, were of one heart, Did, with their worldly int'rest, freely part; Neither did any say, ought was his own; It all in common stock was freely thrown.
Modern: Some christians now, so selfish they are grown, It is with trouble, we can get our own, And sometimes are obliged to complain, Unto the laws, our rights for to obtain.
Ancient: Christians all took their names from CHRIST, their head, All party names, from them, entirely fled, No Parthians or Medes with them were known, No other names, but christians, they would own.
Modern: Christians are so divided, in our days, The want of true religion it betrays, Presbyterian, Churchmen, Baptist, Quaker, Methodist, Universalist, and Shaker. It makes me almost sick, To see the names Iv'e writ, My pen I now will quit, And will not waste My paper.
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SI Moderator - Greg Gordon
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| | 2006/12/20 2:48 | Profile |
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