SermonIndex Audio Sermons
Image Map
Discussion Forum : Miracles that follow the plow : Intresting Experience this last saturday!!

Print Thread (PDF)

Goto page ( 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 Next Page )
PosterThread
sermonindex
Moderator



Joined: 2002/12/11
Posts: 37585
"Pilgrim and Sojourner." - 1 Peter 2:11

Online!
 Intresting Experience this last saturday!!

This message is for everyone but especially for 'Todd' because he encouraged me to go to the Toronto Airport Christian Fellowship in Toronto. And considering I live in toronto I made the 1 and 1/2 hour trek by bus to get there.

I was going into the place with quite an open mind. (some background: the TACF has had a 'revival' since 1994 and there have been many manifestations and things that happened that made alot of people consider if it was even from God.)

The first thing I noticed when I can in was two guys at the front of the church before the service, one person was waving his arms up and down and pointing upwards, and the other person was infront of him hopping back and forth and then once in awhile launching himself higher with his arms and letting out a yell. Thats weird and I didnt see how it had anything to do with God.

The worship was pretty good, mostly contemporary tunes and there was alot of repition but it was done tastefully.

Then a guy comes up to the front and starts talking about his thing called: 'soaking time' and a 'soaking kit'. So I listened not really understanding at all what he was talking about, but little by little I pieced together what these terms mean.

1. Soaking time - is during worship or after you just lay on the ground on your back and somehow Gods presence comes over you and you soak, sometimes shake and God shows you visions, etc. That would explain why some people where just laying on the ground during worship :-? hmm
They are saying this is the way God is imparting his spirit and blessing the chrisitans now.

2. Soaking Kit - This is a package you can buy with instructions and worship cds from TACF so you can start a 'Soaking room' in your own home or church. They have a vision to have 1000's of soaking rooms around the world.


So at this point I am thinking this is way to non-biblical, non-christian, what in the heck is going on here! lol

then this guy calls another person up to give a testimony about soaking, and he comes and starts to speak and the person with the mic that is holding it up to him is also wrapping his arm around him. And when this guy is talking he has a convulsion and says 'Whoa' and then the other guy holding the mic has a convulsion or shaking in his head in sequence. so its kind alike this:

"Hey man, 'whoa' (convulsion) you have to try this soaking thing its really great 'whoa' (convulsion) God is blessing me so much with it"

and personally I can talk alot more about what else happened but it just gets worse and it really grieves my heart and Gods. This so called "revival" is a mockery of the word and also of God. Its so plain to disern it. Todd I respect you and others that are in agreement or are more openminded to the things that are happening in Christianity. But I have to tell you and warn you as a brother in Christ that you have to get yourself away from these false teachers and false manifestations (they are not from God). I dont want to argue about it, its just what I feel God has shown me by his SPIRIT that dwells in me and the plain counsel of God's WORD. Its doctrines of demons and its false.

I encourage you (and everyone else who reads this post) to listen to these two CRUCIAL messages by carter colon:

[url=http://www.therevivalweneed.com/xoops/modules/mydownloads/visit.php?lid=1453]Discerning the Fellowship of Jesus Christ[/url]

[url=http://www.therevivalweneed.com/xoops/modules/mydownloads/visit.php?lid=1724]Run For Your Life[/url]


_________________
SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2003/7/8 20:03Profile
crsschk
Member



Joined: 2003/6/11
Posts: 9192
Santa Clara, CA

 Re: Intresting Experience this last saturday!!

Whoa,Indeed.
That was mighty courageous of you Greg. To go see for yourself all that we have been hearing about.
Frankly, I didn't know this was still going on there, but I guess that I am sadly not surprised.
After reading all that you wrote, I can only say that it grieves me as well....I pray that the Lord will use this site in such a way as to bring Glory to Himself. The preaching here NEEDS to be heard. I just wrote out a rather long post to reply to the ongoing Bonnke discussion and had been hesitating whether to post it or not.I think I will now.
From the nominal, comfortable, Sunday going only church to the whacky manisfistations, "itching ears",blasphemy......this just makes me sick.
Where is the narrow road?
I believe it is here, in these great men of God of the past and thankfully for the few that are still faithful.I have to agree with Mr. Ravenhill, about being accused of taking all this to seriously. So be it. Let us be labled, legalist, fundementalist, "Old fashioned", "living in the dark ages" whatever. Even if the labels are misapplied. It's not to men we have to give an accounting to anyway.
I am praying for you Brother.
_/crsschk\_


_________________
Mike Balog

 2003/7/8 21:00Profile
Maria
Member



Joined: 2003/6/8
Posts: 77
USA

 Re:

Quote:
"I have to agree with Mr. Ravenhill, about being accused of taking all this to seriously. So be it. Let us be labled, legalist, fundementalist, "Old fashioned", "living in the dark ages" whatever. Even if the labels are misapplied. It's not to men we have to give an accounting to anyway."

Amen! This is easy to say, but as my mother said to me this evening, "too many of us are afraid to be disliked." I mean, it's natural that we want everyone to think we are nice, open minded people... but the fact is, if we desire to be in Christ, we will NOT be liked by those who do not LIKE Christ!

"He was despised and forsaken of men, A man of sorrows and acquainted with grief; And like one from whom men hide their face He was despised, and we did not esteem Him." Isaiah 53:3

THIS is the Jesus that we have been called to follow after.

"The one who says he abides in Him ought himself to walk in the same manner as He walked." 1 John 2:6

Do we really want revival? Do we really want to pay the price?

"They were stoned, they were sawn in two, they were tempted, they were put to death with the sword; they went about in sheepskins, in goatskins, being destitute, afflicted, ill-treated (men of whom the world was not worthy), wandering in deserts and mountains and caves and holes in the ground. And all these, having gained approval through their faith, did not receive what was promised." Hebrews 11:37-39

"Blessed are you when men hate you, and ostracize you, and insult you, and scorn your name as evil, for the sake of the Son of Man. Be glad in that day and leap for joy, for behold, your reward is great in heaven. For in the same way their fathers used to treat the prophets." Luke 6:22-23

The problem is, a lot of us have been brought up in churches, schools or homes that teach that we are to be happy and liked, and "nice" and open and and and... but

Jesus said:
"Woe to you when all men speak well of you, for their fathers used to treat the false prophets in the same way." Luke 6:26

I'm NOT saying that we go around with grumpy "woe is me" faces. And I'm NOT saying we throw ourselves into places of suffering and mistreatment. I'm only saying that we all need to accept the fact that we aren't always going to be accepted by those, even in the professing church. I know how painful this is, trust me... but it's something we have to accept. If we don't, we will find ourselves giving into things little by little and before we know it we will be just outside the will of God. Hopefully you get my point.

No offense to Greg, but I don't think it is neccesary for any of us to "try out" or be "open minded" about these ministries... below is something I typed on another post a while ago:

I think it's in Another Gospel or The Redeemer is Returning to Zion where David Wilkerson says concerning false teachers: "They may start out right but they are TRANSFORMED by the gospel they are preaching."

This is so true! May God help us if we ever begin to nose around doctrines that are not from His heart!! As Carter Conlon says in "Run For Your Life," "CURIOSITY KILLED THE CAT!!"

These ministries, even though they are not truth, are very, very powerful.

"And Jesus answered and said to them, "SEE TO IT that no one misleads you...For false Christs and false prophets will arise and will show great signs and wonders, so as to mislead, if possible, even the elect. Behold, I have told you in advance." Matthew 24:1, 24-25

"BEWARE of the false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly are ravenous wolves." Matthew 7:15


NONE OF US ARE ABOVE FALLING... and no matter how much knowledge we have, if we give the flesh opportunity, we might slip!


"But put on the Lord Jesus Christ, and MAKE NO PROVISION FOR THE FLESH in regard to its lusts." Romans 13:14

"I know your deeds and your toil and perseverance, and that YOU CANNOT TOLERATE EVIL MEN, and you put to the test those who call themselves apostles, and they are not, and you found them to be false." Revelation 2:2

"From Your precepts I get understanding; Therefore I hate every false way." Psalms 119:104

My heart has been so grieved over these things lately..

Don't be discouraged, y'all! He is worthy to be praised! Following after and seeking TRUTH (which is the only thing can possibly unify anyway) will be worth it in the end! Like Len Ravenhill says, I don't think God is going to tell us when we get to heaven that we were too serious about this Gospel here on earth.


"For whoever is ashamed of Me and My words, the Son of Man will be ashamed of him when He comes in His glory, and the glory of the Father and of the holy angels." Luke 9:26

"For consider Him who has endured such hostility by sinners against Himself, so that you will not grow weary and lose heart." Hebrews 12:3

Blessings in Christ!

--Maria


_________________
Stephanie

 2003/7/8 21:41Profile
crsschk
Member



Joined: 2003/6/11
Posts: 9192
Santa Clara, CA

 Re:

Quote:
No offense to Greg, but I don't think it is neccesary for any of us to "try out" or be "open minded" about these ministries.



Hmmm..don't think that is really the case here.
Will have to let Greg answer for that. It seems to me that someone who is right there and can give a first hand account can only help us all. I think that you can still leave your presupositions at the door without letting your guard down, "open minded" dosen't necessarily have to be "empty minded".


_________________
Mike Balog

 2003/7/8 22:04Profile
Maria
Member



Joined: 2003/6/8
Posts: 77
USA

 Re:

Quote:
"Hmmm..don't think that is really the case here."

My point is that it's dangerous. These ministries are powerful and it is normally not in one's best interest to subject themself to this -- I was not trying to attack Greg or anything because I know where he stands and I pretty much agree with him. But the point remains we should take Paul's advice and "flee from these things, you man of God, and pursue righteousness, godliness, faith, love, perseverance and gentleness." 1 Timothy 6:11

Besides, I thought Greg said on another post that he had already seen video footage?? Maybe I'm wrong about this.

Quote:
"open minded" dosen't necessarily have to be "empty minded".

While you are right, my point still remains. No matter how much knowledge we have, we are not above falling... I'm just saying that I don't recommend everyone doing that. Greg heads this site and that's fine if he wanted to do that, to share his insight with all - but it would probably not be a good thing for everyone to do this.

Besides, there is plenty of material out there from people who have been in these ministries - Many, like Greg have gone and reported first hand what they have seen - but it makes no difference to most. Most hold to "well that was his opinion..." and "everyone should check it out for themselves."

If it's on video, on internet and everywhere else what is going on, there is no reason for all of us to go and subject ourselves to that. I've had people get on me for mentioning Benny Hinn as a false prophet because I have never been to a crusade -- but I don't NEED to go to a crusade because I have watched video footage of him blaspheming God. To go would be unwise in this case.

Please read what I wrote in context. I do not think I have all the answers or anything... just sharing my thoughts.

--Maria
P.S. Maybe it would be best not to emphasize that one statement where I mentioned Greg - what I wrote was not directed to him personally.


_________________
Stephanie

 2003/7/8 22:57Profile
crsschk
Member



Joined: 2003/6/11
Posts: 9192
Santa Clara, CA

 Re:

Looking back at it, probably not the best choice of words. Meant nothing by it....There are some disadvantages to communicating through these forums sometimes because of the delayed response, unlike a normal conversation, where there is give and take.

I could not agree with you more about the dangers, about the fact that you don't have to be present to know that these things are true.

What you stated about Benny Hinn for instance.
I have both been to his crusades and to a "teaching conference" as well. At that time I was a babe in my walk, and when I first started hearing opposing arguments against him, my intial reaction was "How dare they!, Look at all the people being healed and saved because of his ministry", I pretty much had bought into the whole "touch not the annoited of the Lord". But as I began to delve into it more, I realized I had to have an open mind towards why there was so many voices crying out against what he was teaching and saying. What was THERE motive? Was it personal? Was it out of concern? Again, I was young in my walk then, so at the same time it was impressed on me that I need to test EVERYTHING by the scriptures. I can still remember the day, with tears in my eyes, standing at my door as my wife came in and telling her we had been duped, mislead, that most of these teachers we had been following were filling us with false doctrine. I had been telling her prior to this that I had some concerns and her reaction was about the same,
"what do they know?" So, I was concerned about her response, fortunately she was open to what I had discovered. It's not an easy thing to come to a realization that you have been following a lie.
You feel stupid, gullible,angry.You begin to think, "who can you trust?"
So, is it dangerous? Absolutely.I guess what I was trying to get at earlier is, when you have "been there, done that" that it carries a lot more weight than just, as you said "well, thats just your opinion"....No! That's not my opinion, that's my experience!

In one sense, I guess we are both right. God Bless you for your strong stand against false teaching! It needs to be said, without a doubt.
I feel empathy for those who are being mislead, because I have been there, I pray that their eyes may be opened as mine where.

Lastly, towards the end of the original post here, there is a strong rebuke! One that I am sure we would both agree on.

"For there are many insubordinate, both idle talkers and deceivers, especially those of the circumcision, whose mouths must be stopped, who subvert whole households, teaching things which they ought not, for the sake of dishonest gain."......."Therefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in faith, not giving heed to Jewish fables and commandments of men who turn from the truth." Titus 1:10,13

_/crsschk\_


_________________
Mike Balog

 2003/7/9 0:54Profile
sermonindex
Moderator



Joined: 2002/12/11
Posts: 37585
"Pilgrim and Sojourner." - 1 Peter 2:11

Online!
 Re:

Quote:
I believe it is here, in these great men of God of the past and thankfully for the few that are still faithful.I have to agree with Mr. Ravenhill, about being accused of taking all this to seriously. So be it. Let us be labled, legalist, fundementalist, "Old fashioned", "living in the dark ages" whatever. Even if the labels are misapplied. It's not to men we have to give an accounting to anyway.


Awesome quote brother, let us be serious or as maria said: 'Do we really want revival? Do we really want to pay the price?' and 'Like Len Ravenhill says, I don't think God is going to tell us when we get to heaven that we were too serious about this Gospel here on earth.'

Quote:
No offense to Greg, but I don't think it is neccesary for any of us to "try out" or be "open minded" about these ministries


I think I would rephrase a part of this: 'any of us' to 'all of us'. I think it is important for some people to go to these meetings and discern, or as I had in my mind 'Test Everything. Hold on to the good. Avoid every kind of evil' 1 thess 5:21-22. Carter Colon has been to many of these types of meetings and obviously just as crrsschk and all of us it: 'that it grieves me as well'. All Christians need to know about the depth and problem that there is in some of the church and it needs to be dealt with. We can't be ignorant of the fact that alot of the church is slipping into false doctrines, it's not a time to be selfish but prayerful and to be able to help reconcile people in these movements to the truth. I am praying and hoping with all my heart that this site will be somewhat of a witness to help people trapped in these teachings.

Quote:
I think that you can still leave your presupositions at the door without letting your guard down, "open minded" dosen't necessarily have to be "empty minded".


I have read the book "war on the saints" by Jessie Penn Lewis and Evan Roberts (the leader of the welsh revivals). In the book it states the problem with having an 'empty mind' which can lead to oppressions. I can into the meeting with my mind active testing all things not with my mind passive. I dropped all the things I heard about the movement and tested it afresh and God confirmed the same thing that I have read against this movement.

Quote:
These ministries are powerful and it is normally not in one's best interest to subject themself to this


There is alot of truth in that statement maria and I agree if you are ignorant of spiritual warface, etc then it can be a very dangerous situation to be in. :-o

Quote:
While you are right, my point still remains. No matter how much knowledge we have, we are not above falling


Very true again! these are not things to be flippant with and to joke around about.

Quote:
Benny Hinn


AWW man here is a whole other discussion coming up.. whew.. all I will say at this point is that as a babe in christ, benny hinn was actually a blessing to me.. hmmm try swallowing that one!


_________________
SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2003/7/9 11:37Profile
crsschk
Member



Joined: 2003/6/11
Posts: 9192
Santa Clara, CA

 Re:

Thanks Greg,
Your response is edifying and what we all have come to expect from you, O Great Webmaster!(JUST KIDDING!) (I think that was more for me, I need to lighten up a little)
No, that dosen't change the seriousness of the issues whatsoever....

Benny Hinn.....
My experience obviously was quite different. As I was transitioning out of all that stuff and listening to Christian radio, I remember a lot of confusion. One of the things that Benny used to teach was about the will of God. How we should never pray "if it be thy will" because we should KNOW what His will is. Needless to say, that brought up all kinds of contradictions with more than a few scriptures...(Big red flag!)

From experience: When we attended the teaching conference in L.A. At one point, kind of out of the blue he started saying "The Holy Spirit is here! The Holy Spirit is here! Everybody line up against the walls, come on everybody" I can remember thinking "this is kind of weird" So, somewhat reluctantly we lined up and then they had us face the walls, they had everybody move towards the front a few at a time to receive the "annointing"
(by the way I have come to loathe that word, because of the abuses, not the original meaning)
When I got there it was Rex Humbard (spelling?) who put his hand on my forehead, with the "catchers" behind me, I don't recall what he said, but I thought "this is a man of God, what an honor to be receiving this" so with a slight shove I was expecting to be "slain in the Spirit" and felt ....nothing, not a single thing, but not to be embarrassed or thought not "spiritual" I kind of just went along with it and let them set me on the ground. It left me with an impression, an impression that something wasn't quite right, another red flag. The other thing I remember was the whole money issue. About people who God was telling him could give $1,000 dollars each, a certain number of people, I don't recall how many.
Talk about extortion, at the time I thought, well "He is a man of God, so this must be from the Lord" even though I had more doubts rising up.
There was a touching moment though, when in the midst of all this money raising,a young guy came up and offered up his gold watch to Benny, with tears in his eyes, then a few people came up to offer this poor guy their watches to him. Touching, in that this guy was obviously giving from his heart. Looking back on it, it's grievious
because of the methods he used to draw peoples money from them.
More could be said and it gets old after awhile.
But this is some of my experience.

_/crsschk\_



_________________
Mike Balog

 2003/7/9 17:35Profile
todd
Member



Joined: 2003/5/12
Posts: 573
California

 Re: Intresting Experience this last saturday!!

Ok. First, I give you credit for making the trip out there. But if you simply went there and observed it would be no wonder that your state now is worse than the first. My encouragement/challenge was not to simply go and observe with an open mind, though that's a start. they key to the whole thing is loving the actual people and being open minded and humble enough to engage with them before or after in conversation and/or maybe prayer.

Quote:
"The first thing I noticed when I can in was two guys at the front of the church before the service, one person was waving his arms up and down and pointing upwards, and the other person was infront of him hopping back and forth and then once in awhile launching himself higher with his arms and letting out a yell. Thats weird and I didnt see how it had anything to do with God."

First, what's wrong with weird? There is tons of "weird" stuff in the BIble. I don't feel the need to reference anything because it's all over the place. It seems like you didn't go with such an open mind after all. It seems you were asking "why" instead of "why not?" Your initial thoughts were "guilty until proven innocent" instead of "innocent until proven guilty." that's not just, that's not fair, and that's not loving. and besides, that wasn't even part of the "service." have you never jumped around and yelled? have you never been weird? why coudln't you assume that they were seeing a vision or just worshipping God? Did you ever ask them about it?

Quote:
"So at this point I am thinking this is way to non-biblical, non-christian, what in the heck is going on here! lol"

What is unbiblical about soaking in the presence of the Lord? It's just sounds to me like different terminology for "waiting" or "meditating" or just "being" in His presence? I would really appreciate some Scripture that would contradict this type of thing.

Quote:
"and personally I can talk alot more about what else happened but it just gets worse and it really grieves my heart and Gods. This so called "revival" is a mockery of the word and also of God. Its so plain to disern it."

I dare you to prove any of this. Your opinions/intuitions/feelings do not constitute proof. You may think it's implied that these things are only your opinion but you are stateing them as fact. i suppose you may, if you dare, say that the movement is a mockery of God (at least the way you know HIm) and that is not so easy to prove or disprove. but where we can be objective about this is when you say it's a mockery of His word. Please, if you have proof for this, espeicially from your experience there, bring it forth.

Quote:
"Todd I respect you and others that are in agreement or are more openminded to the things that are happening in Christianity. But I have to tell you and warn you as a brother in Christ that you have to get yourself away from these false teachers and false manifestations (they are not from God). "

I appreciate your acknowledgment of respecting me, but is it only in word? DO you respect me enough to take seriously what i say? to be fair and up front with me? why, aside from your feelings and convictions, are you sure enough that all of the teachers and manifestations are false that you can make such bold claims?

Quote:
"I dont want to argue about it, its just what I feel God has shown me by his SPIRIT that dwells in me and the plain counsel of God's WORD. Its doctrines of demons and its false."

Well I suppose you don't have to "argue" about this anymore. But you brought it back up again and made some extrememly bold cliams with little backup. So i felt it necessary to express myself as well. the ball is in your court and if you want to leave it alone that's your decision. again, as far as the "plain" counsel of God's word, make it plain for me to see. as to the rest, very bold.

if you did stay around and ask questions but just didn't mention it i think it would be good to elaborate on that. i am very interested to hear their defense of your accusations. have you given them a chance?

I have listened to both of those messages.







 2003/7/10 0:29Profile
jobee
Member



Joined: 2003/8/1
Posts: 7


 Re:..if you have any proof of this, especially from your experience

Todd,
if i may, i wish to relate something of my own experience. My experience is not of the church at Torrento, but there are enough similarities for me to consider that this may be relevant enough to deserve your consideration.

First a context, for the scriptures talking about false manifestations, in particular 2 Thessalonians 2 ; 2 Timothy 4 and the other that in particular, comes to mind is in Revelations 13:13-14.

the words false / counterfeit / lying.
There is within this, an implication that I find is important- especially in dealing with this particular issue.
That the signs themselves, the manifestations are real, but that as profiting the believer, they do nothing.
John 6:63- the flesh counts for nothing, but what is of Spirit imparts life. And that life is the life of God. The words of Jesus, are Spirit, being of God. And Jesus is the way the truth the life, so His words are HIM, they give true life.
We are transformed, as we behold our Lord Jesus- to behold to look at intently, to perceive increasingly clearly, to understand, to see.
If you look up the word ' know', in a Vines dictionary, there are so many layers and shades of meaning- i hope that i do not express myself badly by saying that, it is more about the difference between the mental ascribing to a form, kinda like a one dimensional image, and the transformational growth, that comes from a true change that comes from deep within.
10 years ago.
My experience was of power that touched my body, and definitly made me feel good. But there was this question in the back of my mind that would not go away. The experience was so real, and i soaked in the presence of the spirit for hours at a time.
But i wondered, why, with so much of God did i not change? Surely if the manifest presence of God was surrounding me and filling me, if i stayed in that presence for so long that afterwards, i could not walk but only stagger- and sometimes barely crawl- i was so full with God, why didn't i change?

Jesus said to the pharisees 'stop judging by mere appearances, and make a right judgement! [John 7:24] , and you judge by human standards, I judge no-one, but if i do judge, My decisions are right, because I am not alone. I stand with the Father. [John 8:14-17].
So obviously i cannot judge anything by the appearance of it either way. It seems to be only one Judge and that God, since He made all it is according to Him after all....
The Spirit of truth cannot dwell in a lie.
A lie is a nothing, is nothing. It is empty and void, powerless and worthless. It is death, empty of the life that dwells only in the Spirit of truth.
It in itself is the opposite of God who is Truth, and opposing God, by its appearance, that deceives -the deceiving is the taking away the truth of life, and the life that is given by the Spirit of truth, is also taken away.
Left then with an image [ the sense and meaning of O.T.idol] that seems good, but is not what it seems.
The appearance of a thing does not equal the sum of its parts.
The image does not equal the essence of a thing, and the essential thing to know, is essentially the of Spirit thing.

My experience of God, in the last three years, has been, so dramatically different.
Another quote from John - that we are given the Spirit of truth, who leads us into all truth.
My experience is of, The God who loves me enough to challenge me ruthlessly, in the presence of Him, there is little place for my former religion of ....
'all for me, all for me
but i'll say its all You Lord,'

-and no place but for the pain of real change.
That time 10 years ago, was lying signs and wonders, i knew nothing of God, and i was utterly deceived as to what was God, it was nothing, no-matter how dramatic, the healings, the manifestations, my heart was still unbroken and desperately wicked- so those manifestations affirmed my state, i thought that i was o.k. because of the signs.

I do not know, if it was because they [the signs and wonders themselves] were false, or if it was because the falseness was entirely of me. See that is the thing, that being false myself, i simply could not receive the truth.
I know i was false, so safely that is all i can know.
The point to all of this? Well when it comes down to it, God can make a Paul out of Saul, and only He knows, in this what is true, and what is a lie and most importantly Todd, this question is for you.
Is there any change?
Please realise in this i am not in any way saying that you are as i was, but rather - does these things bring change.....?
This is my continuing question, i do not ask you as such, but rather pass it to you, and pray for the grace given to me- of a 1000watt light, from which there is no hiding that if you need to ask this question too, that God might trully honour you.
So that we may know Him, that we might be granted the spirit of revelation of truth, that in truth He we can behold.
With eyes unveiled and hearts afire, we in ever increasing measure may perceive in Spirit and truth, Jesus Christ our Lord.
God bless JOBEE

:-D

 2003/8/3 10:53Profile





©2002-2020 SermonIndex.net
Promoting Genuine Biblical Revival.
Affiliate Disclosure | Privacy Policy