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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : Born Again By What Means

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rookie
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Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4807


 Re:

Quote:
How many does it take to believe the in Christ Position?



The 'in Christ" position was the predestined plan of God to save those who live by faith. For those who obey the Holy Spirit, for those who walk in the light as He is in the light, the love for the Father is perfected in us.

Brother Phillip, has Jesus taught you about the relationship that is found in Psalm 119?

In Christ
Jeff


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Jeff Marshalek

 2007/11/1 23:29Profile
rookie
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Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4807


 Re:

As an anchor, this was the first verse of this thread...

1 Peter 1

23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.


Solomon writes...

Proverbs 2:

6 For the LORD gives wisdom;
From His mouth come knowledge and understanding;
7 He stores up sound wisdom for the upright;
He is a shield to those who walk uprightly;
8 He guards the paths of justice,
And preserves the way of His saints.
9 Then you will understand righteousness and justice,
Equity and every good path.
10 When wisdom enters your heart,
And knowledge is pleasant to your soul,
11 Discretion will preserve you;
Understanding will keep you,

Then going back to Proverbs 1 we find this....

23 Turn at my rebuke;
Surely I will pour out my spirit on you;
I will make my words known to you.

In these parallel Scriptures we find that the purpose for God pouring out His Spirit on man is to "make my words known to you."

Paul also taught that the transformation from the old man to the new required a renewing of the mind. He always prayed that the believer would grow in understanding and knowledge.

Rom. 12:2 And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God.

Rom. 11:33 Oh, the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable are His judgments and His ways past finding out!

1Cor. 14:20 Brethren, do not be children in understanding; however, in malice be babes, but in understanding be mature.

1Cor. 15:34 Awake to righteousness, and do not sin; for some do not have the knowledge of God. I speak this to your shame.

2Cor. 2:14 Now thanks be to God who always leads us in triumph in Christ, and through us diffuses the fragrance of His knowledge in every place.

2Cor. 4:6 For it is the God who commanded light to shine out of darkness, who has shone in our hearts to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.

You see just as Paul writes above to the saints, Solomon wrote also...

6 For the LORD gives wisdom;
From His mouth come knowledge and understanding;
7 He stores up sound wisdom for the upright;
He is a shield to those who walk uprightly;
8 He guards the paths of justice,
And preserves the way of His saints.

From God's mouth comes knowledge and understanding which is able to preserve the way of His Saints.

In Christ
Jeff


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Jeff Marshalek

 2007/11/2 0:40Profile
Christinyou
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Posts: 3710
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 Re:

Ephesians 1:1-23 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, to the saints which are at Ephesus, and to the faithful in Christ Jesus: Grace be to you, and peace, from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ. Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ: According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will, To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved. In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace; Wherein he hath abounded toward us in all wisdom and prudence; Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself: That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him: In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will: That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ. In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise, Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory. Wherefore I also, after I heard of your faith in the Lord Jesus, and love unto all the saints, Cease not to give thanks for you, making mention of you in my prayers; That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him: The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints, And what is the exceeding greatness of his power to us-ward who believe, according to the working of his mighty power, Which he wrought in Christ, when he raised him from the dead, and set him at his own right hand in the heavenly places, Far above all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this world, but also in that which is to come: And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church, Which is his body, the fulness of him that filleth all in all.

This is not predestination to Salvation, this is presdestination unto being in Christ and conformed to His Image.

This is our inheritance in Christ Jesus the Lord.

Ephesians 1:17-20 That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him: The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of His inheritance in the saints, And what is the exceeding greatness of His power to us-ward who believe, according to the working of His mighty power, Which He wrought in Christ, when he raised Him from the dead, and set Him at his own right hand in the heavenly places,

We are also the inheritance of Jesus Christ in the Saints wrought in God the Father.

Not predestinated to salvation but predestinated to the Adoption of Son's. The wonderful mystery revealed first to Paul in the fulness of time, that is Christ in you the Hope of Glory.

What does this scripture mean? Colossians 1:25-28 Whereof I am made a minister, according to the dispensation of God which is given to me for you, to fulfil the word of God; Even the mystery which hath been hid from ages and from generations, but now is made manifest to his saints: To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory: Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus:

"Christ in you the Hope of Glory". This great truth Paul burned to communicate to the whole world; and for holding it, and in making it known, he had involved himself in all the difficulties which he had with his own countrymen; had suffered from want, and peril, and toil; and had finally been made a captive, and was expecting to be put to death. It was just such a truth as was fitted to fire such a mind as that of Paul, and to make it known was worth all the sacrifices and toils which he endured. Life is well sacrificed in making known such a doctrine to the world.

This truth of the great mystery revealed to Him personally by Jesus Christ Himself, that is "Christ in you the Hope of Glory".

Galatians 1:15-17 But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb, and called me by his grace, To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood: Neither went I up to Jerusalem to them which were apostles before me; but I went into Arabia, and returned again unto Damascus.

By Christ Himself: Galatians 1:11-12 But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man. For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.

In Christ: Phillip


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Phillip

 2007/11/2 0:43Profile
rookie
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Posts: 4807


 Re:

Brother Phillip wrote:



Quote:
This is not predestination to Salvation, this is presdestination unto being in Christ and conformed to His Image.



I agree with you 100%.

Now what does it mean to you to be "conformed into the image of His Son."

In Christ
Jeff


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Jeff Marshalek

 2007/11/2 0:47Profile
Christinyou
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Posts: 3710
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 Re:

Romans 8:35-39 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are accounted as sheep for the slaughter. Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us. For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Galatians 5:22-26 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law. And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts. If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit. Let us not be desirous of vain glory, provoking one another, envying one another.

Rom 3:24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

Rom 8:1 [There is] therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

Rom 8:2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

Rom 8:39 Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

This is my conformity to the image of Christ, it is the Son of God Himself that is now my life for He truly is birthed in me, and my Father is seeing His plan that was formed before the foundation of the world come to fulfillment by the Christ that is in me. God never intended me to be a self unto self but He intended me to be a Self into Christ. No created being could be a son, unless He is birthed by a Father, which I am.

My Father has birthed me and is conforming me to the image of His Son in Love.

Christ Liveth in me: Phillip


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Phillip

 2007/11/2 2:31Profile
rookie
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Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4807


 Re:

Brother Phillip wrote:

Quote:
This is my conformity to the image of Christ, it is the Son of God Himself that is now my life for He truly is birthed in me, and my Father is seeing His plan that was formed before the foundation of the world come to fulfillment by the Christ that is in me. God never intended me to be a self unto self but He intended me to be a Self into Christ. No created being could be a son, unless He is birthed by a Father, which I am.



There are people I know that can quote Scripture, yet some do not have the testimony of how that Scripture made a difference in their life.

There are people I know who can recite doctrines, yet some do not have the testimony of growing in the knowledge and understanding of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

There are people I know who can repeat the thoughts of other men when they have testified what Christ has done in their life, but when asked what Christ has done in them, they stand naked.

In the many discussions that I have had with you brother Phillip, you have either quoted Scripture or posted other men's teachings. When I have asked," but what about you," you always say that it is Christ who takes your place in this life. I have not heard how Christ has renewed your mind. I have not heard how He has changed you personally. I have not heard how He has taught you to walk in the light as He is in the light. I have not heard about how He has gifted you with spiritual gifts. I have not heard any testimony of how He is using you in the church you belong to.

Luke 8:16 “No one, when he has lit a lamp, covers it with a vessel or puts it under a bed, but sets it on a lampstand, that those who enter may see the light.

As Denny Kenaston has asked, What about the Lord's testimony?

Your brother in Christ
Jeff


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Jeff Marshalek

 2007/11/2 4:26Profile
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Joined: 2007/1/30
Posts: 1230


 Re:

phillip,God bless you and I do realize Christ lives in you and me.
But [not to be contentious] you never answered my question.
I will rephrase it.

Is there one scripture that specifically says "Christ birthed in you"?

I read the 99 verses you posted and ,unless I missed it,not one of them said anything about Jesus being birthed or born.[in the believer]

If it is just a "pet" saying then so be it.



thanks
David

 2007/11/2 12:52Profile
Christinyou
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Joined: 2005/11/2
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 Re:

Jhn 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

Jhn 3:7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.

1Pe 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the
Word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

Who liveth and abideth forever?

John 1:1-4 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. In him was life; and the life was the light of men.

Is not Christ the Word of God? He is who we must be born again by. The Spirit of Christ from above. Rom 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

1Pe 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the
Word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

Jhn 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

Christ here acquaints Nicodemus, and in him all persons, That there must be a change from nature to grace, before there can be a change from grace to glory; for though he was a Jew, a doctor, and one that had good thoughts of Christ, looking upon him as an extraordinary person, one that had received power from God to work miracles; yet Christ assures him, that nothing short of the regenerating change would bring him to heaven.

'Tis not enough that we be new dressed, but we must be new made; that is, thoroughly and universally changed, the understanding by illumination revelation, the will by renewing the mind, the affections by sanctification, the new life by regeneration of Christ in you, or we can never be happy in the enjoyment of Him in heaven; for heaven, which is a place of the greatest holiness, would be a place of the greatest uneasiness to an unregenerate and an unholy person: the contagin is universal, deep, and inward, therefore such must the change be. Rebirthed, Born Again from above.

Who is our glory?

Colossians 1:27-29 To whom God would make known what is the riches of the ((((glory)))) of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of (((((glory:))))) Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect ((((in Christ Jesus:)))) Whereunto I also labour, striving according to His working, which worketh in me mightily.

Who's working?

The Christ in us is our Glory, our perfection, the only way a man can be presented perfect is, by the Christ in Him. How does He get their?
"You must be born again". Born of what and separated unto whom? By God's Incorruptable Seed rebirthed in the Believer, now as son's by the Seed of the Son birthed in the believer, separated unto God.

Hbr 4:12 For the word of God [is] quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and [is] a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

Christ is the Word. In other words, Jesus Christ is quick and powerful and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of the soul and spirit and the body also and the discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

How are we in Christ? "Made of God".

1 Corinthians 1:29-31 That no flesh should glory in his presence. But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption: That, according as it is written, He that glorieth, let him glory in the Lord.

All of Paul's Writings cry out the birthing of Christ in the Believer. Eight times Paul tells us to follow him, why?

To fulfill the word of God. Colossians 1:25 Whereof I am made a minister, according to the dispensation of God which is given to me for you, to fulfil the word of God;

1Cr 4:17 For this cause have I sent unto you Timotheus, who is my beloved son, and faithful in the Lord, who shall bring you into remembrance of my ways which be in Christ, as I teach every where in every church.

1Cr 11:1 Be ye followers of me, even as I also [am] of Christ.

Paul is the only one that has to do with the believer in Christ, if you want an answer to your question Study what he has written, for he wrote: 1Cr 8:6 But to us [there is but] one God, the Father, of whom [are] all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom [are] all things, and we by him.

And: Act 17:28 For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also
(((((His offspring.)))))

Only Paul can answer your question by the revelation of the Holy Spirit and the Christ in you.

""Is there one scripture that specifically says "Christ birthed in you""

No. But many that bring "Christ in you the Hope of Glory" truth.

In Christ who liveth in me: Phillip

Galatians 2:20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; ((((((yet not I, but Christ liveth in me:)))))) and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

Does He live in you? Do you live your life by the Faith of the Son of God?


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Phillip

 2007/11/2 23:52Profile
rookie
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 Re:

Brother Phillip wrote:

Quote:
No. But many that bring "Christ in you the Hope of Glory" truth.



Do you see again that you have added to Scripture?

Only the love of the truth can deliver one from the deception of man's doctrines...

In Christ
Jeff


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Jeff Marshalek

 2007/11/3 9:33Profile
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 Re:

1 John 3:7-9 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous. He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil. Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for His seed (life force, sperma of God) remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

Adams original sin can never be commited again by a born again believer. The works of the devil is out and The works of Christ are in, "ye must be born again to see the things of the Kingdom of God."

Who's Seed is in us? Who are we born of?

1 Peter 1:22-23 Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently: Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

Who is the incorruptable Seed? Born again by who? The living and abiding Word of God. Who is the Word? Jesus Christ who was in the beginning with God.

If you rightly divide these scriptures, how can you not See the Seed of God, Jesus Christ in you as your life.

I answered NO, only because there is no scripture exactly as the question was stated. There is plain truth that Christ is birthed in us and He is now our life.

Rom 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

1Pe 1:11 Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.

Who was in them? If the Spirit of Christ, then the incorruptable Seed of the Father. Who's Seed is in us?

Rom 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

If you are His, who's Spirit do you have. Being Born Again of Spirit and Water of Life, that is Jesus Christ the Son of God.

How? Same as Mary. Matthew 1:20-21 But while he thought on these things, behold, the angel of the Lord appeared unto him in a dream, saying, Joseph, thou son of David, fear not to take unto thee Mary thy wife: for that which is conceived in her is of the Holy Ghost. And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins.

That which is conceived in you and I is Jesus by the Holy Spirit and we are now also son's of God.

In Christ who liveth in me: Phillip


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Phillip

 2007/11/3 20:02Profile





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