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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : Born Again By What Means

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PosterThread
rookie
Member



Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4807


 Re:

Brother Phillip wrote:

Quote:
When Christ is born again in the believer, we get all of Him. When we are baptized into the Holy Spirit our Comforter Teacher, we get all of Him.



Paul wrote to the Galatians 4:

19 My little children, for whom I labor in birth again until Christ is formed in you, 20 I would like to be present with you now and to change my tone; for I have doubts about you.

These people began in the Spirit but what happened to them?

In Christ
Jeff


_________________
Jeff Marshalek

 2006/4/12 9:50Profile
rookie
Member



Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4807


 Re:

Brother Steve wrote:

Quote:
In these traditions, the ceremony is seen not as a specific channel of divine grace but as an expression of faith and obedience of the Christian community.



I believe the Lord intended it to be a "divine channel of grace." Jesus is Lord of the Sabbaoth. What might He reveal to one concerning faith and obedience?

In Christ
Jeff


_________________
Jeff Marshalek

 2006/4/12 9:57Profile









 Re:

Quote:

ROOKIE WROTE:

Brother Steve wrote:

Quote:
In these traditions, the ceremony is seen not as a specific channel of divine grace but as an expression of faith and obedience of the Christian community.



I believe the Lord intended it to be a "divine channel of grace." Jesus is Lord of the Sabbaoth. What might He reveal to one concerning faith and obedience?

In Christ
Jeff



xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Stever's response:

Interesting, because last night I turned on EWTN (Eternal Word Television Network), the 24 hour Catholic Cable Channel. A priest was explaning the Eucharist and why only Catholics have access to it. Since they believe in Transubstantiation in that when they take the wine from priest, and the take the bread from the priest, that the wine actually becomes Christ's Blood, and the bread actually becomes Christ's flesh. They also explained that the Ordainded Catholic Priest is the only one that can bring this hokus-pokus about. Without the Catholic Priest, according to them, the whole thing is worthless. Why? Because they believe that by doing something physically, God is honoring that, and actually draws Christ to the Eucharist ritual. They believe that the Priest is the one that actually brings to life in the Catholic believer Christ's flesh and blood in the taking of the wine and the bread!

The Catholics can believe whatever they please, but I will continue to take Communion in remebrance of Christ, and in what He did for me on the Cross and at the resurrection. If He wishes to bless me because of that, I am willing to accept the blessing. However, the main reason that I take it (Communion) is that Christ commanded all believers to continue to do this, until He comes again and all believers will take Communion with Him.



God bless,

Stever

 2006/4/15 1:57
Christinyou
Member



Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3708
Ca.

 Re:

Quote; Jeff wrote: "These people began in the Spirit but what happened to them?"


They were being coaxed back into the Jewish way of worship and the keeping of the Law.

Paul is persuaded that they will overcome in Christ Jesus, and helps them understand how to do it, and what would happen to those that were trying to put the yoke of bondage upon them again, and keep them from the liberty in Christ. The ones that troubled them receive there judgement.

Galatians 5:1-10 Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage. Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing. For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law. Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace. For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith. For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love. Ye did run well; who did hinder you that ye should not obey the truth? This persuasion cometh not of him that calleth you. A little leaven leaveneth the whole lump. I have confidence in you through the Lord, that ye will be none otherwise minded: but he that troubleth you shall bear his judgment, whosoever he be.

In Christ: Phillip


_________________
Phillip

 2006/4/16 12:31Profile
rookie
Member



Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4807


 Re:

Brother Steve wrote:

Quote:
The Catholics can believe whatever they please, but I will continue to take Communion in remebrance of Christ, and in what He did for me on the Cross and at the resurrection.



I agree with you in terms of your thoughts concerning the Catholic traditions.


Paul teaches us that there is more than remembrance of what He did and is doing in us. This same precept is also written in 1 John 1:

1John 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us. 1 My little children, these things I write to you, so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous. 2 And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the whole world.

The idea of confessing our sins to our Lord is taught by both Paul and John.

Paul writes, 1 Cor. 11:

1Cor. 11:23 For I received from the Lord that which I also delivered to you:

He himself received it from Jesus...

1Cor. 11:27 Therefore whoever eats this bread or drinks this cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord. 28 But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of the bread and drink of the cup. 29 For he who eats and drinks in an unworthy manner eats and drinks judgment to himself, not discerning the Lord’s body.

There seems to be more to the thought of how we should remember our Lord.

IN Christ
Jeff


_________________
Jeff Marshalek

 2006/4/17 16:01Profile
rookie
Member



Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4807


 Re:

Brother Phillip quoted:

Quote:
Galatians 5:1-10 Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.



So one has to stand fast in the liberty that makes us free. Otherwise we can fall back into the yoke of bondage.

In Christ
Jeff


_________________
Jeff Marshalek

 2006/4/17 16:04Profile









 Re:

Quote:

rookie wrote:
Brother Steve wrote:

Quote:
The Catholics can believe whatever they please, but I will continue to take Communion in remebrance of Christ, and in what He did for me on the Cross and at the resurrection.



I agree with you in terms of your thoughts concerning the Catholic traditions.


Paul teaches us that there is more than remembrance of what He did and is doing in us. This same precept is also written in 1 John 1:

1John 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us. 1 My little children, these things I write to you, so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous. 2 And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the whole world.

The idea of confessing our sins to our Lord is taught by both Paul and John.

Paul writes, 1 Cor. 11:

1Cor. 11:23 For I received from the Lord that which I also delivered to you:

He himself received it from Jesus...

1Cor. 11:27 Therefore whoever eats this bread or drinks this cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord. 28 But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of the bread and drink of the cup. 29 For he who eats and drinks in an unworthy manner eats and drinks judgment to himself, not discerning the Lord’s body.

There seems to be more to the thought of how we should remember our Lord.

IN Christ
Jeff



xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Stever's response to Rookie:

I really don't understand exactly what you are trying to say. As a Christian, with a personal relationsip with Jesus Christ, we are to confess our sins to Him everday of the week, at all times. We are to confess them when we think an evil thought or of doing an evil deed, even though we don't follow through with the act. We are also to confess them when we do commit the act of sin. Sins like pride, sins like not listening, sins like getting angy at someone driving under the speed limit, the sin of not loving our brother as ourself---sins that Adams blood are responsible for (the blood that has created our "sin nature", eventhough we have the Holy Spirit in residence in our hearts).

The Bible tells us in 1 John 1
"7. But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin. 8. If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
10. If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us."

This confession of sin that you make reference to in your post above that takes place at Communion should also take place at all times, before the Lord in silent and audible prayer. This same confession of sin should also take place at Communion as referred to in 1 Cor 11:

"28. But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup. 29. For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body."


God bless,

Stever

P.S. "How can two walk together if they are not agreed?" (Amos 3:3)

We have a personal relationship with a sinless God. How can we become more like HIM? We have the down-payment, the Holy Ghost that resides in our hearts. He has given us that. What we are charged to do is to become more like HIM. We can do that by being in constant fellowship with Him throughout every day. The more that we humble ourselves, and throw HIS light on our sin, and ask for HIS forgiveness, the more we become like HIM.

 2006/4/17 20:55
rookie
Member



Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4807


 Re:

Brother Steve wrote:

Quote:
I really don't understand exactly what you are trying to say. As a Christian, with a personal relationsip with Jesus Christ, we are to confess our sins to Him everday of the week, at all times. We are to confess them when we think an evil thought or of doing an evil deed, even though we don't follow through with the act. We are also to confess them when we do commit the act of sin.



I here what you are saying that we should do. I myself fall short. But the intent of this discussion is to point out in a sense, what most do not do. All that you have said is correct.

Yet Paul found that the Corinthians were not living according to the call of Christ in their life. This is the emphasis made by Paul and not me.


1Cor. 11:27 Therefore whoever eats this bread or drinks this cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord. 28 But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of the bread and drink of the cup. 29 For he who eats and drinks in an unworthy manner eats and drinks judgment to himself, not discerning the Lord’s body. 30 For this reason many are weak and sick among you, and many sleep.

What kind of sickness is Paul talking about here in those who have Christ?

In Christ
Jeff


_________________
Jeff Marshalek

 2006/4/20 13:39Profile
Christinyou
Member



Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3708
Ca.

 Re:

"""So one has to stand fast in the liberty that makes us free. Otherwise we can fall back into the yoke of bondage."""

This is the bondage of our minds. We can never fall in to the bondage of Satan ever again. Our birthing is Christ in us by the Seed of our Father. At the instant of our birthing we got the whole bucket of Grace, Christ in us, The Holy Spirit teaching all things that Christ gives Him for us, Instant full heirs by our adoption into the Family of God, Christ was made all things to us pertaining to salvation and godliness. 1 Corinthians 1:30 But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who was made unto us wisdom from God, and righteousness and sanctification, and redemption:

Check this out very carefully, In Christ, He made us the wisdom of God. WOW! God in Christ made us the righteousness of God. Even more WOW! God in Christ put us to the intension of what God intended us to be before the foundation of the world, to that intent Christ in us with the full capacity of the Nature of God, WOW, now that is sanctification. God in Christ redeemed us, not just saved us but made us all that Christ is, and ever will be. Now that is a son of God, and we will keep finding out that the more we know Him the more we have available and will become in Christ to the Father, not by my works but by His. Paul's statement: "To know Him" and to preach Christ and Him Crucified is so much more than we even conceive or think.

2Cr 12:6 For though I would desire to glory, I shall not be a fool; for I will say the truth: but [now] I forbear, lest any man should think of me above that which he seeth me [to be], or [that] he heareth of me.

2Cr 12:19 Again, think ye that we excuse ourselves unto you? we speak before God in Christ: but [we do] all things, dearly beloved, for your edifying.

As we do for each other.

Gal 6:3 For if a man think himself to be something, when he is nothing, he deceiveth himself.

Eph 3:20 Now unto him that is able to do exceeding abundantly above all that we ask or think, according to the power that worketh in us,

In Christ: According to the Power that works in us, Phillip


_________________
Phillip

 2006/4/20 20:53Profile
Logic
Member



Joined: 2005/7/17
Posts: 1791


 Re:

Christinyou wrote:

Quote:
"""So one has to stand fast in the liberty that makes us free. Otherwise we can fall back into the yoke of bondage."""

This is the bondage of our minds.We can never fall in to the bondage of Satan ever again.


This is bondage to the Law, not our minds.

Quote:
Christ was made all things to us pertaining to salvation and godliness.



[b]2Peter 1:3 According as his divine power hath given unto us[/b] all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:

Quote:
At the instant of our birthing we got the whole bucket of Grace,


We still need more gace though!
[b]Hebrews 4:16[[/b] Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need.

Quote:
Check this out very carefully, In Christ, He made us the wisdom of God. Phillip



You'd better look at that verse "very carefully" again.
[b]1Corinth 1:30[/b] But by Him you are in Christ Jesus, who became to us wisdom from God, and righteousness and sanctification and redemption,

It says that Jesus is the wisdom of God to us.

 2006/4/20 23:21Profile





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