David writes:

"God may do this but He won't speak outside the bounds of His written word which is really His living word."

What do you mean by the qualifier "outside the bounds of His written word"?

Would you consider working this idea out a bit?

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Jeff Marshalek

Blaine writes:

"Brother at this point I'm going to have to extrapolate out of the scriptures."

Yes, Paul classifies this as examples given to us. The examples you provided are indeed testimony of what God has worked in the lives of Abraham and Paul. God introduced Himself to each of these men. And both Paul and Abraham were brought through a time of preparation, as you have noted in your response.

And as we learn from the testimony of these two men, they begin to love God. And that love for God overcomes the world.

This precept is spoken of by Paul,

Eph 2:10
For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them.

And

2Ti 2:20
But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and silver, but also of wood and clay, some for honor and some for dishonor.

2Ti 2:21
Therefore if anyone cleanses himself from the latter, he will be a vessel for honor, sanctified and useful for the Master, prepared for every good work.

Is there any limit to the ways in which God chooses to work out salvation, is He limited by the written Word of God?

_________________
Jeff Marshalek

RE : /// Brothers do you believe that God speaks "only" through the written scriptures? ///

NO

RE : ///In other words, does God speak in any other ways "except" by the written word as contained in the Bible? ///

Yes

But The Scripture is a 'more sure word' than anything that we experience.

And anything/everything that we experience or feel, hear (or see) needs to be tested and come into compliance (or at least not contradict) with what is Written ?

When Jesus was being tempted, what did he rely on to discern what he was hearing ?

What was Written.


edit : clarity

Exactly proud papa, not only that , the scripture , blain presented in the beginning , is that god has spoken to us through the son , the gosple of Christ , the teachings of Christ , that are writtern and recorded and read and preached or parra preached , word of God

And we see that the apostals doctrine is up there with the words Christ , being that god chose the apostal and has revealed to only them , special teaching , that we see in the book of acts ,the saints abided in ,

Facts are we do not have the infalable revaluations revealed to us independently , of Christ and the apaostals ,

There is know knew doctrines given to us , , that don't come through scriptures.......



Just because some one doesn't believe in the gift of toungs and healings , doesn't mean they haven't recieved a gift of the spirit , and are true believes , men like Paul washer fall into this category

You must covert the gift to recieve , if one doesn't believe and understand a gift , he won't recieve it , and there for won't see in his own life , it may be a loss to him , depending of how he fans the flame of the gift he has ,

That's what important , , not speaking in toungs


What have you done what god has given you , give up the judgment of gods servants , , and prove that you are excelling in your gift and prove that you have the greater gift ......

Be concerned about being perfect your self , and stop , pointing out what you see as imperfections

And then you'll be hearing gods spoken word , and writtern word ,
And don't look for amens from others , but well done servant from god , and you and I will do well .......

42 And they continued steadfastly in the apostles’ doctrine and fellowship, in the breaking of bread, and in prayers. Acts 2 42

proudpapa writes:

"But The Scripture is a 'more sure word' than anything that we experience."

This is Paul's experience...

Act 9:5
And he said, “Who are You, Lord?” Then the Lord said, “I am Jesus, whom you are persecuting.[fn] It is hard for you to kick against the goads.”

Act 9:6
So he, trembling and astonished, said, “Lord, what do You want me to do?” Then the Lord said to him, “Arise and go into the city, and you will be told what you must do.”

So Paul obeyed and went to the city.

Act 9:17
And Ananias went his way and entered the house; and laying his hands on him he said, “Brother Saul, the Lord Jesus,[fn] who appeared to you on the road as you came, has sent me that you may receive your sight and be filled with the Holy Spirit.”

Paul's experience was confirmed by the Word.

It is God who confirms through the work of the Holy Spirit. If the voice is true the confirmation will come at it's appointed time.

No one else will have the exact same experience as Paul, but everyone who hears His voice will have confirmation just like Paul. Faith is the substance of hearing and then seeing what God is working in one's life.

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Jeff Marshalek

This subject of the spoken or the written word of God is be made overly complicated, when the issue is really quite simple.

That God speaks his word to us as well as (but not in conflict with) His written word is affirmed by most all of us. However it is also true that His written word (the bible) is more sure and of higher value. Why is this?

Lets be clear, God did not take a quill and ink and write His words onto the parchment. He SPOKE his word to men who WROTE His word in what we have now as the Holy scriptures, i.e the bible.

Why is this written word (the bible) more sure and of higher value to us? If God speaks at any time including now to me or you, His word is 100% true. The issue is not God's word, but how it is received and recorded. Has it been faithfully heard and recorded? The bible faithfully and accurately records for us God's word.

Let me give a simple explanation. If I want to communicate something to a close friend or relative, they may welcome me speaking to them personally as this is more intimate. However if I want to communicate some very important information to them that also needs to shared with others, that they will not misunderstand, forget or change what I mean, I will write it down and send it to them, because there is much less chance of a misunderstanding and it can be refferrd back to at any time and also forwarded onto others exactly as it was given.
This is also why God chose to use the written word, that there would be no mistake about what He has said. We all know about the 'Chinese Whisper effect' and know what happens when you tell someone something verbally, who then passes it onto someone else, etc, etc. The message and meaning can get changed very significantly.

Much as been said about Muslims receiving dreams and visions, as if this negates the need or importance of the bible. However the testimony of those Muslims who have had dreams and visions is that they earnestly desire to have a bible in their hands and rejoice greatly when they do get one! I know personally of a man who spent many years taking bibles into Islamic nations. He testifies that it is true that some Muslims in nations where they have no access to the the word of God are receiving dreams and visions of Christ showing He is the true God. However he also says that when they get a bible and or biblical teaching they no longer have these dreams and visions as they have the very word of God available to read. Why is it that these people that no easy access to the bible value it so much and yet those in lands where they can have a multitude of bibles do not value it?? They would be horrified that their experience is being used to talk down the value and importance of God's word, the bible!

Thank God we have His written word, this does not make us worshipers of a book, but worshipers of the author of that book! It does not mean we read it 'legalistically', but as the 'word of grace "that gives us knowledge unto salvation" (2 Tim 3:15).

_________________
Dave

rookie,

What I mean is that whatever God may speak outside of His written word, through dreams or visions or revelations, should be able later to be found or verified within scripture. A lady stood up once in a prayer meeting and said, "I got a revelation! I got a revelation. God is one." From this unscriptural anti Trinity "revelation" the Pentecostal Oneness movement began. She had had a revelation all right but not from God. She ran out of bounds from what is in the written word. I'm not against Christ appearing to non believing Muslims. I believe He is appearing and many are being saved but whatever Christ reveals to them will not violate what can be found in the written word.

_________________
David Winter

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Travis

My sheep hear my voice...

I believe the Bible is replete with examples of men and women to whom God spoke directly, outside of scripture. My live has also been full of such men and women, and often as I go through the day, I carry on a dialogue with God. He speaks to me and I speak to Him. He tells me of His desires for my life. He tells me how to understand His written word. He tells me of His will and asks me to obey Him. The more time I spend with Him, the more I am in tune to His voice and the more clearly I hear Him speak. (Not audibly, but in my spirit.)

As a believer with my feet firmly rooted in His word, I am able to discern what I am hearing. I know God's voice, yet if I am ever unsure, I have the written word of God by which I judge all things. Someone posted that the written word is the more sure word of prophecy. We have to realize that in context we learn that even if an angel appears before us in visible form, that angel's words are confirmed or rejected based upon the written word of God.

God's written word is the standard by which we measure all things. But God absolutely speaks to us outside of the written word.

_________________
Travis