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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : The Pretrib Rapture???

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Lysa
Member



Joined: 2008/10/25
Posts: 3417
This world is not my home anymore.

 Re:

Quote:
by marcmc
...So much for the authority of the believer.


I'm not arguing for a particular endtime belief but I would logically like to ask about the "authority of the believer."

The Apostles all had tongues of fire rest upon them, did miracles in the name of Jesus, Peter's shadow healed people and yet every single one of them BUT John died a violent death. How do you explain the authority of those believers?

Nero literally burned to death Christians and left them burning to light Rome up after the fire. How do you explain the authority of those believers?

How does one explain the authority of believers when Christian's were led to the coliseum for their deaths all to entertain the citizens of Romans?

Where is the authority of the believer when Christians have been skinned alive and had to watch their children and loved ones die unspeakable deaths before they were martyred?

I'm not upset and yelling, with tears in my eyes these are honest questions that I have.

Question 1. I believe they had authority but where was the authority of those believers when they suffered and were martyred?

Question 2. Why is our authority of the believer any different than theirs? Better question is, "Is ours any different?"

Question 3. Can anyone explain to me logically why those Christians were martyred and yet not one Christian (in America? because we all know outside America they are being martyred), why we in America will not die a violent death before Christ returns.

Anyone care to explain?


_________________
Lisa

 2016/9/5 9:43Profile









 Re:

Post-trib = not only will the following versus not be fulfilled, they would have to be wrong. I read the ministries not tribulation being God's method of equipping the body.

Ephesians 4:9(What does “he ascended” mean except that he also descended to the lower, earthly regionsc ? 10He who descended is the very one who ascended higher than all the heavens, in order to fill the whole universe.) 11So Christ himself gave the apostles, the prophets, the evangelists, the pastors and teachers, 12to equip his people for works of service, so that the body of Christ may be built up 13until we all reach unity in the faith and in the knowledge of the Son of God and become mature, attaining to the whole measure of the fullness of Christ.14Then we will no longer be infants, tossed back and forth by the waves, and blown here and there by every wind of teaching and by the cunning and craftiness of people in their deceitful scheming. 15Instead, speaking the truth in love, we will grow to become in every respect the mature body of him who is the head, that is, Christ. 16From him the whole body, joined and held together by every supporting ligament, grows and builds itself up in love, as each part does its work.

Marcmc

 2016/9/5 9:57









 Re:

Post-trib = God the Father giving His Son's Bride a good beating to get her all fixed up for the wedding.

marcmc

 2016/9/5 10:04
proudpapa
Member



Joined: 2012/5/13
Posts: 2936


 Re: marcmc

RE : ///Post-trib = God the Father giving His Son's Bride a good beating to get her all fixed up for the wedding.///

My understanding is that most post-trib pre-mill. believe that the end times plagues that are poured out will be like those in egypt and will not include the Christians.

As far as persecution from the enemy , As Lisa pointed out that is a simple reality through out all of history including much of the world today.

edit : clarity

 2016/9/5 10:29Profile









 Re:

Quote:
by Lysa on 2016/9/5 9:43:50

Quote:
by marcmc
...So much for the authority of the believer.


I'm not arguing for a particular endtime belief but I would logically like to ask about the "authority of the believer."

The Apostles all had tongues of fire rest upon them, did miracles in the name of Jesus, Peter's shadow healed people and yet every single one of them BUT John died a violent death. How do you explain the authority of those believers?



How do you explain that Jesus died? Jesus did many miracles yet allowed men to kill Him.

"As He is in this world, so are we". 1 John

The "authority of the believer" has nothing to do with fighting back with the arm of flesh against men. Now, there are a group of Christians that do believe they have been given authority to prepare the earth for the Lord's second coming and that means getting involved politically and militarily. I think they are called "Dominionists". They think they have authority from God to do these things.

 2016/9/5 10:33









 Re:

Post-trib = No joy, no peace and no victory. Which is the clear impression I have witnessed in the lives and on the face of every person that I have met who propagates this false doctrine.

marcmc

 2016/9/5 11:24









 Re:

Post-trib= God using Satan the beast and the false prophet to accomplish......umm....whatever post-tribbers think the outcome will be.

marcmc

 2016/9/5 11:28









 Re:

Post-trib = Confusing the culmination of the age where God allows the fruition of the rebellious treason of Adam to come to its inevitable outcome ( Man as god) and the martyrdom of the saints throughout history which is a very different thing.

marcmc

 2016/9/5 11:31









 Re:

Post-trib = joyless Christians who expect and want God to be a cosmic bully to slap around the carnal Christians and prove they were right all along.

marcmc

 2016/9/5 11:33
proudpapa
Member



Joined: 2012/5/13
Posts: 2936


  marcmc

Perhaps instead of spamming little mocks pointed at post tribs..
It would be more beneficial to make a clear case using the Scriptures and perhaps find some writings in the first 1500 years of church history that supports your position of a pre-trib rapture

 2016/9/5 11:37Profile





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