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Discussion Forum : Miracles that follow the plow : Prayer and support for Ken Miller

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 Prayer and support for Ken Miller

Dear brothers and sisters,
In the middle of the night I awakened and clicked onto the Godly Music section in the audio files here on sermonindex. I saw the Ken Miller Family singers and listened to this lovely Mennonite acapella choir. Then I wondered if this was the same pastor who is going to prison for aiding the mother who came to Christ who left her homosexual sin and marriage.

Pastor Miller, as a man of God, gave she and her daughter (she had been the surrogate mother) sanctuary and helped her relocate to Argentina.

Upon finding the website I saw the news that Pastor Miller wrote his last letter before prison on Tuesday March 22, 2016. There are pictures of him saying goodbye to the congregation at Pilgrim Christian Fellowship in Stuart's Draft ,VA.

I clicked onto the family singers and indeed this is the same family that Greg had in the Godly Music section.

The Lord woke me up to pray for Ken Miller and his family. He has a wife and 6 children and the community will come together to support them as these dear Mennonite people do.

Our government has turned against Christians. It is ironic, yet most Christlike that once again a Mennonite believer suffers persecution willingly.

Once again, you can get the update on:

and the family singing hymns is even more lovely than the early ones here on SI

Respectfully in Christ,

 2016/3/24 4:54

 Re: Prayer and support for Ken Miller

Leslie I have linked article and sent out on my distribution networks. We will be praying for him tonight on our call.

I went to the Sister I was not able to find a link to the music you referenced. I would love to listen to the their music. Can you tell me where to find the music link.

Brother Blaine

 2016/3/24 8:10


This is a very sad and interesting case. I have nothing but respect for Ken Miller as a man of God and a man of great convictions and I applaud him for what he did.

However, he broke the law. Pure and simple and so did Lisa Miller. I am not defending the law at all, just learning the details of this case.

The law as bad as it is, stated that because of the civil union with the other woman, that other woman had child custody privileges. In circumventing the laws that makes Lisa a lawbreaker and there are consequences. According to the law and the prosecutors of the law, Ken Miller aided and abetted kidnapping. This is why he has been sentenced to 27months in prison.

Are these laws of man right and fair? One could argue easily in this case, NO WAY!

Are the prosecutors fair and are they showing grace and mercy in this case? I do not understand all the details so I do not know if 27mths is a light sentence or not? But we do know that wicked people prosper and escape justice on a daily basis and existing laws on our books are ignored millions of times in a million cases. There is nothing right or fair about human laws in circumstances like this and we can surmise that it is satan who has stirred up the men to go after Ken Miller in this case. In all this we do know however that the Lord is in control and is allowing satan to appear as if he is getting the upper hand, but it is all for the Lords purposes and His will is being done in Kens life.

But these laws, rightly or wrongly are on the books and they say that if you enter into a civil union and or a marriage you must abide by the laws thereof. And the outcome of this is that we do not get to be the only one to dictate the welfare of shared children.

There are many circumstances similar to this case where someone did something that they regret BEFORE they came to know Christ. Should we counsel them to skirt their responsibilities and go around the law? What would we say to a father who gets saved and begins to live for Christ but his wife rejects Christ and leaves him for another man and begins to live a wicked and vile lifestyle? Should that christian father submit to the laws of the land and share custody with his ex-wife? Or should he flee and (in the eyes of the law) kidnap his children and become a fugitive?

I do not know the answer to that question and I am not condemning Ken Miller for what he did, please let me be clear in this.

So what then is the issue? None really, we are just going to have to accept that to obey God rather than man is probably going to wind us up in hot water and maybe some of us will even lose our heads one day:-) Its not hard to see how all this will pan out as new and despicable laws are put on the books to corner Christians in their beliefs and a stand for a higher law. One day it will become unlawful to do many things in obedience to Christ. Until then let us thank God for what religious liberties we have left.

Let us continue to pray for this dear brother and his family. I am confident that God is being glorified in this whole ordeal and that He has great things in store for all as a result of this.

 2016/3/24 9:09

 Re: Mark

The brother, Ken Miller, is aware that he has violated the law. But then this brother comes from an Anabaptist heritage where his forefathers have suffered for their faith in Christ. The Anabaptist suffered for their belief that believers and believers alone were to be baptized. They did not believe in the baptism of infants. Yet state law in those nations that were Protestant and Catholic mandated that babies be baptized. This was done mainly for tax purposes. So the Anabaptists were aware that disobeying this law would result in their death. And history does record that many died for their faith in Christ by refusing to baptize infants and baptized only believers in the Lord Jesus Christ.

I believe out of that tradition and his conscience Ken Miller chose to help Lisa Miller and pay the consequences of his actions.

Many of us remember the story of Corrie Ten Boom. Against the Nazi edicts at the time. She and her family hid Jews that were on the Nazi death watch. She and her family also paid a price.

Brother I believe that we as Believers in America will also have to ask yourself the question. Will we obey God rather than man. Realizing the price that may be required of us.

Just my thoughts brother.


 2016/3/24 9:20


Yes brother Blaine I realize that Ken knows now that he violated the law, but one wonders if he knew that at the time?

I probably wouldn't have know that if it was me. And it seems that he might have been acting out of ignorance too because he drew several others into the plot as well. If he knew the seriousness of the crime I doubt he would have knowingly made others his accomplices.

It is a dilemma for sure and one that very few of us have ever had to face in this country. I find the ruling of the judge quite interesting, here is what he said:

"The room was quiet as the judge spoke for some time to an attentive audience- first about the seriousness and sadness of the offense, but then also about his respect and admiration for Ken's faith and character. He said he does not feel Ken is being sentenced for his religion, but for actions contrary to the law. As one whose responsibility it is to uphold the laws and to protect the system of law in this country, he also finds himself in a dilemma. Many people commit crimes in the name of religion (even murder), and if we discard the criminal justice system because of everyone's personal beliefs, we will have anarchy- a country without laws. He finds it painful and hard, but this court must enforce the law which exists."

It is such a complicated matter and I understand the judges sentiments. What is at issue is the horrible laws of man that are in effect, that a lesbian woman can even contend for a moment that she shares that child with Lisa? Insanity. The whole mess is satanic and an attack on Gods people, that much I am certain of. Look for much, much more of this down the road!

One other thing I read was that Ken was asked if he would do it all over again...aid in the kidnapping of a child. He gave a truthful answer but it was vague and worrisome for the judge which probably is what caused him to be given the maximum sentence of 27mths. In the eyes of the law they are concerned about repeat offences.

Regarding Corrie Ten Boom, I don't think this situation rises to that level brother. The Jews were being exterminated. In this case, we are dealing with child custody laws. And laws and situations that are not too uncommon. All sorts of people for all sorts of reasons want to get out of sharing their children with an ex-spouse. What are the courts to partial?

Would it be fair for a non-christian to kidnap their child because they did not want to share it with a "crazy/extreme christian" spouse?

Certainly a dilemma if you are a christian judge thats for sure.

So what about Lisa Miller? Should she remain a fugitive? If she ever returned she would probably face harsh justice and the child would suffer as a result and probably never be returned to her. That is all conjecture on my part but I am sure she is thinking these things as well. And she is still being hunted, actively pursued by the US authorities.

More than anything I feel for this woman and her child...may the Lord continue to protect and guide her!

 2016/3/24 9:56


Granted brother this is a complicated case. And the case that causes us to ask the difficult question. Where do we draw the line and say we must obey God rather than men?

Here is a scenario. And one that may very well come to play out if a certain candidate is elected president. If the government deemed that Muslims residing in this country were a threat to National Security. And they were being rounded up and sent to FEMA like camps. Perhaps camps where they would be executed. Because the government has passed laws that Muslims are a threat to National Security.

Let's say there's a Muslim family living next door to you. You have been trying to reach out to this family with the love of Jesus Christ. All of a sudden you find yourself in the situation where you must report them to the authorities. Knowing that if you report them to the authorities they will lose their lives. And let's say this family turns to you and ask for help. What would your response be?

Brother I do not believe these are intellectual questions. But questions we will have to ask ourselves in the not-too-distant future as to where do we draw the line and say we must obey God rather than men? And be prepared to count the cost for radical obedience to Christ. This I believe is the message of the Ken Miller case to us. Whatever the situation may be. We are commanded to love our neighbor. But loving our neighbor may well come with a steep price. But then did Jesus not pay a steep price for us to have redemption in Him?

Simply my thoughts and reflections.

Brother appreciate you. Respectfully posted.

Brother Blaine

 2016/3/24 10:24


Also I do agree brother. We need to pray for all involved in this case. The Ken Miller family. The Lisa Miller family. And for the judge and Janet Jenkins.

Indeed we need to keep this in prayer.


 2016/3/24 10:32

Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 5789


Does the concept of "turn the other cheek" apply in this case?

Also, there are many people who commit a crime when they are not saved, but repent and believe after they are captured. However they still must pay the penalty.

Presumably Lisa knew the law when she entered into this union and decided to have a child. The law recognized both "mothers" as the parent just as in the case of a mother and a father. In a normal divorce both parents have custody.

I know this whole thing is repellent but I am not sure that once the bed was made it should not also be slept in.

I am telling you though- this would be a tough bar exam question.


 2016/3/24 12:37Profile

 Re: Tidd

Todd this is more than a custody battle of a same-sex couple. There were allegations of sexual abuse by the former parent, Janet Jenkins When Isabel would go to visit Janet Jenkins, she would come back from the visitation and tell her mother, Lisa, she felt like kilng herself.

I do not want to go into the explicit details on a public forum. But allegations did emerge that Janet Jenkins inappropriately touched the daughter. This being the case Lisa Miller became concerned and sought the help of a Mennonite community. Believing that in the political correct climate of our country she would not find redress through the justice system. Also Lisa believing that if Janet had continued visit rights toward the daughter she would be harmed.

I might add that the allegations of sexual abuse were not admitted in the defense of Ken Miller.

One must ask the question to what extent will a mother go to protect her child. Lisa caring the embryo and giving birth to Isabel was willing to take what steps necessary to protect her daughter. Even to the point of violating federal law. Just because it is federal law, does not mean that it is a just law. Particularly in the eyes of God.

We cannot assume in this politically correct climate that one will see Justice through the American justice system system. Perhaps I'm being a bit cynical. But in the times that we are living in. The American justice system is hostile toward the things of Christ. Indeed the American justice system is hostile toward common sense. For if we had employed common sense. You would not see children being raised by two men or two women reported to be married in the eyes of God.

Brother this is respectfully posted. And as usual these are my thoughts. Which could very well land me in jail.

Brother Blaine

 2016/3/24 13:13

Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 5789


I won't turn you in Bear.

I didn't read deep enough into the story to get those facts. Obviously that makes a difference, if true.


 2016/3/24 14:11Profile

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