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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : The Great "Falling Away".The Maths doesnt Work!!

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PosterThread
staff
Member



Joined: 2007/2/8
Posts: 1547


 Re:

Hi Julius,
To me the tribulation views are important for this reason,
Whaterver view you hold Post Or Pre effect your whole outlook.
On one end of the scale You have crazy Pre tribbers who are off the charts and on the other end you have post tribbers who are equally off the charts.
The post tribbers are very quick to point at the "hyper" Pre Tribbers but are very slow to say well to point out that the vast majority of Pre tribbers are just regular Christians who love the lord and are as close to him as I am.
Which leads me to a follow on If the falling away from the church and then comes the man of sin.Is the"falling away part of the church" a restrainer?
Yours Staff

 2015/10/2 17:25Profile









 Re:

I really never could understand why people worried about pre, mid or post.

Matt_6:34b Sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof.

Matt_6:34a Take therefore no thought for the morrow: for the morrow shall take thought for the things of itself.

Many have never seen their pre, mid or post as they have already died and gone somewhere.

We need to live in the NOW. "NOW, is the day of salvation".

If you are white hot for Jesus today, what is there to be concerned about?

I don't even ask anyone what their tribulation view is and no on asks me. If they ask me what my view is I will tell them my view is that we are Overcomers through Christ. My view is JESUS WINS!! Case closed!

 2015/10/2 17:34
Christinyou
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Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3707
Ca.

 Re:

Lu 8:13 They on the rock are they, which, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, which for a while believe, and in time of temptation fall away.

Heb 6:6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

Luke 8:18 Take heed therefore how ye hear: for whosoever hath, to him shall be given; and whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken even that which he seemeth to have.

There is only one way to "hath", that is that it "hath" been given.

They that seem to "hath" and "hath" not, even that is taken away.

Luke 8:15 But that on the good ground are they, which in an honest and good heart, having heard the word, keep it, and bring forth fruit with patience.

There is only One that has an honest and good heart, The Son of God, Jesus Christ. To have an honest and good heart, the good ground has been prepared by God and the incorruptible Seed birthed in them are the only ones that have the heart of Christ in them and they cannot fall away.

No one can bring forth fruit without the Root.

In Christ: Phillip


_________________
Phillip

 2015/10/3 20:49Profile









 Re:

There is hope for the backslidden and it is called the "Mercy and Compassion of God".

Hos 14:1 O Israel (Christian), return unto the LORD thy God; for thou hast fallen by thine iniquity.

Hos 14:2 Take with you words, and turn (repent) to the LORD: say unto him, Take away all iniquity, and receive us graciously: so will we render the calves of our lips.

Hos 14:4 I will heal their backsliding, I will love them freely: for mine anger is turned away from him.

Heb_4:14 Seeing then that we have a great high priest, that is passed into the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our profession.

 2015/10/3 22:24
JFW
Member



Joined: 2011/10/21
Posts: 1438
Dothan, Alabama

 Re:

Brother Phillip,
Quote: "Luke 8:18 Take heed therefore how ye hear: for whosoever hath, to him shall be given; and whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken even that which he seemeth to have.

There is only one way to "hath", that is that it "hath" been given."


Forgive me if I'm misunderstanding you, but are you aware the word "hath" is a verb? Meaning (most often) to take hold or possess.

I ask this because I'm confused at how you came to the conclusion you came to...
Might you help me to understand what you are saying?


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Fletcher

 2015/10/4 1:17Profile
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Joined: 2007/2/8
Posts: 1547


 Re:

Hi all,
So are we concluding here that the church(true believers) is a "restrainer" of Evil?
Yours Staff

 2015/10/4 5:08Profile
Christinyou
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Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3707
Ca.

 Re:

JFW my brother and one Spirit in the Lord:

Luke 8:18 Take heed <blepo> therefore <oun> how <pos> ye hear <akouo>: for <gar> whosoever <hos> <an> hath <echo>, to him <autos> shall be given <didomi>; and <kai> whosoever <hos> <an> hath <echo> not <me>, from <apo> him <autos> shall be taken <airo> even <kai> that which <hos> he seemeth <dokeo> to have <echo>.

hath or have
Strong's Greek Dictionary
2192. εχω echo
Search for G2192 in KJVSL
εχω echo ekh'-o or scheo skheh'-o; (alternate form, used in certain tenses only)
a primary verb; to hold (used in very various applications, literally or figuratively, direct or remote; such as possession; ability, contiuity, relation, or condition):—be (able, X hold, possessed with), accompany, + begin to amend, can(+ -not)

A possession is either paid for; or given by which the giver has paid the price.

Jesus paid the ultimate price to; "for <gar> whosoever <hos> <an> hath <echo>, to him <autos> shall be given <didomi>

How many ways are there of Salvation? I only know of One.

Ephesians 1:5-8 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will, To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved. In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace; Wherein he hath abounded toward us in all wisdom and prudence;

John 9:35-38 Jesus heard that they had cast him out; and when he had found him, he said unto him, Dost thou believe on the Son of God? He answered and said, Who is he, Lord, that I might believe on him? And Jesus said unto him, Thou hast both seen him, and it is he that talketh with thee. And he said, Lord, I believe. And he worshipped him.

Jesus has shown me by the comforter Holy Spirit Teacher He has sent, who Jesus is and I believe.

Ephesians 2:8-15 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast. For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them. Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands; That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world: But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ. For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us; Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;

This gift "Hath" been given and I "hath" received it.

This I believe with my hole heart;

Galatians 2:20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

It truly is He that is in me that will bring me into the Father' House and so shall I/we ever be with the Lord.

Hope this clarifies the "hath and the hath" not from my perspective.

In Christ: Phillip


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Phillip

 2015/10/4 5:35Profile









 Re:

Quote:

Re:
by staff on 2015/10/4 5:08:26

Hi all,
So are we concluding here that the church(true believers) is a "restrainer" of Evil?
Yours Staff



Rev 20:1 And I saw an ANGEL come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
Rev 20:2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
Rev 20:3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

God's angels restrain the powers of darkness. But, who is this angel? I believe it is Michael.

Dan 10:12 Then said he unto me, Fear not, Daniel: for from the first day that thou didst set thine heart to understand, and to chasten thyself before thy God, thy words were heard, and I am come for thy words.
Dan 10:13 But the prince of the kingdom of Persia withstood me one and twenty days: but, lo, MICHAEL, one of the chief princes, came to help me; and I remained there with the kings of Persia.

Daniel 10
10:12 Then he said to me, "Do not fear, Daniel, for from the first day that you set your heart to understand, and to humble yourself before your God, your words were heard; and I have come because of your words.
10:13 But the prince of the kingdom of Persia withstood me twenty-one days; and behold, Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me, for I had been left alone there with the kings of Persia.
....................................

Dan 10:20 Then said he, Knowest thou wherefore I come unto thee? and now will I return to fight with the prince of Persia: and when I am gone forth, lo, the prince of Grecia shall come.



Dan 10:21 But I will shew thee that which is noted in the scripture of truth: and there is none that holdeth with me in these things, but MICHAEL your prince.

The powers of darkness are also referred to as Angels.
Rev_9:11 And they had a king over them, which is the ANGEL of the bottomless pit, whose name in the Hebrew tongue is Abaddon, but in the Greek tongue hath his name Apollyon.

And we see that 4 "ANGELS" are bound and another ANGEL looses them. The Angel that loosed them was restraining them.
Rev_9:14 Saying to the sixth angel which had the trumpet, Loose the four angels which are bound in the great river Euphrates.

So, the Angel of God (Michael) is the Restrainer.

 2015/10/4 9:01
JFW
Member



Joined: 2011/10/21
Posts: 1438
Dothan, Alabama

 Re:

Brother Phillip,
Thank you for your response,
You wrote: "A possession is either paid for; or given by which the giver has paid the price."
I guess I understand the definition of this word a lil dif than you. As I "hath" my wife and she is a free gift... I also "hath" ears- which were also not paid for, as it were.

Having said that I'm still not sure how you arrived at the conclusion you did in your previous post regarding not being able to fall away when you had cited Hebrews 6:6 which (among others) clearly says we can....

How is this so?



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Fletcher

 2015/10/4 10:15Profile
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Joined: 2007/2/8
Posts: 1547


 Re:

Hi Julius,
Why does the Man of Sin appear as a consequence of this small percentage of people falling away?
Yours Staff

 2015/10/4 16:24Profile





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