HeyDave, I gave specific phrases that I considered rude. I listed them, from mocking to demeaning someone else.

murrcolr, your example (of Jesus before the Sanhedrin) is...interesting. I don't see how Jesus is wishing suffering upon the high priest. Yet you did. I don't see how you are being like Jesus in this thread, even with your example. How? Wishing suffering isn't what Jesus did. Much of how He responded to them was quiet and a few words. Because He knew, nothing He said would change His course, that He was indeed going to the cross, no matter what.

In addition, let's not be theoretical about the possible, yet unseen persecution of the Western Church. It's not here. And if it does get here, I doubt the unbelievers would have any patience for you 'wishing that they suffered'. You may feel justified. But Jesus didn't wish anything negative on them, when He was on the cross. He asked God to forgive them, for they didn't know what they were doing. Please don't rationalize this away, for this is Christ.

In conclusion, unless I feel the Lord pulling me back to this thread, I feel the witness is obvious. Christians, true Christians, are called to bear 'much fruit'. Our mission in this world isn't to be the 'judge, jury, and executioner', it's to be the hands and feet of Jesus, to bring the bad news (wait...Good News, it's called Good...). To heal, to restore, to not be rude while doing these things. Sure, I see no harm in exposing, as...we worship a God of Light, that is Light and there is no darkness in Him. But the reality of the matter is (my posts throughout this thread), in our 'exposing' let us PUT ON THE LOVE OF CHRIST.

Here are some ideas, God bless you all:

Let's cry out to God, 'Lord, have mercy on them. For they do not know what they are doing'. Let's put aside wishing others suffering but instead pray that God's goodness leads them to repentance. Let's pray that the perfect One with perfect Love cast out all fear, that Jesus Christ may lead them to still waters. Let's pray that the Holy Spirit comes and leads and guides this man and ask God to forgive us for mocking someone else's blindness. Let's mourn that they are losing their members because God's judgement may be very near for them, let's cry out mercy, mercy, mercy.

LoveMeekHope: the example of Jesus before the Sanhedrin.

Was an example about rudeness...

Your accusation on me is that I don't follow Christ example as I wished suffering on a Mega Church Pastor who is allowing fornicators and homosexual memebrship in his church...

Your example to me is "Lord, have mercy on them. For they do not know what they are doing" But we are not dealing with the blind unsaved - we are dealing a believer who is a the senior Pastor of a Church.. So hardly blind and not unknowing..

I Cor 5 - clearly rebukes sexual immorality within the church - the judgement - expel the immoral brother and deliver him to Satan for the destruction of the flesh so that he may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

Now this mega church pastor is not following these instructions, so I do hope this Pastor suffers at the very hands of Satan - 1. as an example to other Pastors so they don't follow in this example of his wickedness 2. that in his suffering he may find repentance...

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Colin Murray

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Lisa

James says, "Let not many of you be teachers, for they will be judged more strictly."

Jesus railed at the Pharisees about many things, one of which was about how far they would go to make a convert, and then make him a greater child of Hell than they were.

Could be that James was jotting a little note on his papyrus for later...

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Tom Cameron

Those who buy into the current liberal, emergent "Christianity" oppose the preaching of repentance and other hard truths of God's Word. As Voddie Baucham has stated, they've bought into a "sissified Jesus" that only preaches the love of God and has no backbone or wrath.

LoveMeekHope, in the past you have opposed the truth of God's wrath against sin and sinners. In this thread you seem to call this so-called pastor and homosexual "Christians" brothers and sisters who simply differ in their views on sexuality.

Furthermore, you seem to imply Jesus never harshly rebuked anyone, which is clearly not true. Besides, Paul the apostle also had some strong statements against sin and false teachers. I have pointed out some of those examples and you keep mentioning Jesus and ignoring Paul. Are you among those who try to pit Jesus against Paul and vice versa?

Here’s another example of how Paul interacted with false teachers:

“Now when they had gone through the island to Paphos, they found a certain sorcerer, a false prophet, a Jew whose name was Bar-Jesus, 7 who was with the proconsul, Sergius Paulus, an intelligent man. This man called for Barnabas and Saul and sought to hear the word of God. 8 But Elymas the sorcerer (for so his name is translated) withstood them, seeking to turn the proconsul away from the faith. 9 Then Saul, who also is called Paul, filled with the Holy Spirit, looked intently at him 10 and said, "O full of all deceit and all fraud, you son of the devil, you enemy of all righteousness, will you not cease perverting the straight ways of the Lord? 11 And now, indeed, the hand of the Lord is upon you, and you shall be blind, not seeing the sun for a time." And immediately a dark mist fell on him, and he went around seeking someone to lead him by the hand. 12 Then the proconsul believed, when he saw what had been done, being astonished at the teaching of the Lord.”-Acts 13:6-12

Or how about Peter’s interaction with Simon the sorcerer:

“But Peter said to him, "Your money perish with you, because you thought that the gift of God could be purchased with money! 21 You have neither part nor portion in this matter, for your heart is not right in the sight of God. 22 Repent therefore of this your wickedness, and pray God if perhaps the thought of your heart may be forgiven you. 23 For I see that you are poisoned by bitterness and bound by iniquity." 24 Then Simon answered and said, "Pray to the Lord for me, that none of the things which you have spoken may come upon me." –Acts 8:20-24

How much more proof do you need from God's Word to show you that you are opposing the truth of God's Word in this thread? What you perceive as me being rude toward you is actually a mild rebuke out of concern for your spiritual welfare. I'll leave you in God's hand, take care.

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Oracio

Well said Oracio. I can sit in a garage but it does not make me a car. Be assured Jesus said the tares would grow with the wheat. And we see it plainly when people form all kinds of clubs and call them churches. God knows where the body of Christ is and where it is not. And God most certainly is a God of judgement that fact can not be denied. I tremble when I consider what God's judgement may be when this nation is permeated with so many souls shaking their fist at God's word in blatant mockery. Let every man be a liar but God's word is true. No matter how much men may seek to sanctify sin -- God promises to judge it. The good news is that judgement from God can be avoided through true repentance and falling on that Rock Jesus Christ -- Then we will have mercy and forgiveness -- But if we do not repent and wait until the Rock falls on us we will be under judgement. End of story and into eternity.

Well the reason we have to care about this issue is because of the little ones (babes in Christ) that we will cause to stumble if sin is not called sin. We would allow them to be exposed to this different gospel which has no foundation in scripture and we would be negligent in proclaiming the truth. Divine wind? Indeed! There is nothing divine in that wind -- it is the enemy coming in like a flood and the standard raised up against it is Jesus Christ and His holy word!

Sorry for not getting back sooner as, I have been praying and thinking about this.

The first thing I want to address is the word 'wish', it makes it sounds like I am using some magically charm to try and hurt the man, which I never used and is a false accusation.

The second issue being handing this man over to Satan, when thinking about this subject a memory was recalled to me about a warning I got from God... Basically I was warned about Satan was going to attack me, he was going to try and get me out God's timings, by saying your to late, your to far behind and then trying to push me out from under God's timing. If I go to soon then I will come out from under God protection and the Devil will destroy me. God then finished by saying "know tonight that you are right on time with me"

The lesson here is plainly that we must remain obedient to God regardless of what the subject is or we take ourselves out from under God's protection and hand ourselves over to Satan..

Now with my testimony (experience) may not be enough to prove this. So for the second example we must look to God's word...

And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness. 2 Thess 2:10-12

My position on the mega-church Pastor has changed from "hoping" to knowing has been given over to Satan. I come to this conclusion because of the scripture above, "he loved not the truth", he may say he love Jesus, but the truth is he loved a lie, the sexually immoral have no part in the Kingdom of God, anyone in knowing sin should not be involved in the ministry. If you are involved in sin step back from ministry and seek God to set you free, to forgive and cleanse you from that sin...

By his owns words "devine wind of revelation" that wind was the strong spirit of delusion, yes he believed a lie and a wind of delusion has been given to him, he is already given over to Satan...

Quote: As hard a saying as this is, we are to follow Him and mind our own business.

The first I agree with we are to follow him, but this minding our own business is not good Godly advice... The drug addict that lives at the bottom of the street should we mind our own business, the lost soul next door should we mind our own business...

Minding you own business, is like saying just "tolerate" what's going on, it's not different that the message we hear from the world... TOLERANCE.

Rev 2:20 But I have this against you, that you TOLERATE that woman Jezebel, who calls herself a prophetess and is teaching and seducing my servants.

Can you imagine Christ saying this to "I have this against you" what did he say you TOLERATE that woman Jezebel. I can imagine some on the people in the church speaking out about her and other's replying just mind your own business it's nothing to do with you, just focus on Jesus.

Then many years later Christ you meet and he says "this I have against you"

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Colin Murray

Consider Paul's admonition - no, this is not Paul's - it is the LORD's and he just wrote it for him.

1Co 5:9 I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators:

10 Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world.

11 But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.

12 For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within?

13 But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person.

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Sandra Miller

I went to read that chapter online, when the page came up these words in big black writing sprung out at me...

Sexual Immorality Defiles the Church

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/search=1%20Corinthians%205&version=ESV

I think I will go and find a sermon on the subject...

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Colin Murray