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 Would We Risk Death to Own a Bible?

Revelation 6:9-10
When the Lamb broke the fifth seal, I saw underneath the alter the souls of those who had been slain because of the "word of God".and because of the "testimony which they had maintained". (quotes mine for emphasis)

The above verses are set in the time when Jesus will return. Those saints who follow Jesus are martyred because of the word of God and the testimony they maintain because of that word. What they are martyrs for the Bible? For sure they are martyred for Jesus as He is the Word of God (Rev.19:13). But one cannot separate Him who is the Word from His truth which came from His mouth and is found in the pages of what we call the Bible. Most notedly the New Testament. So yes. These saints were martyred for the Bible.

We see this being carried out in places such as N. Korea. To be found possessing a Bible in N. Korea will send one to a merciful quick death with an AK47 bullet or a slower painful death in one of N. Korea's infamous death camps. It is said the average lifespan of a Bible courier evangelist is 3 to 6 months in N. Korea. Why do the N. Koreans fear the Bible so much? Indeed why do those who persecute believers fear the Bible?

What is the big deal? Why should anyone be put to death because of the Bible? Why was William Tyndale burned at the stake for translating the Bible into English? Why are believers around the world persecuted around the world for having a copy of the Bible?

The Bible is truth. It is God's truth set against a world system of lies controlled by Satan. Satan lies. God speaks truth. Jesus resisted the temptations and lies of Satan with the truth of God's word. How much more should we?

The persecuted value the word so much they will die to own a copy of blessed truth. I have read stories and seen pictures of precious saints who have never owned a copy of God's word crying tears of joy when presented with a copy of God's word. Our response is generally "yawn" well what else is new?

In Eritrea scraps of scripture on pieces of paper are far more precious than food itself. Our response "yawn" so what else is new?

The persecuted will die for having Bibles. But we in America? I think we would die for a theology book or position than for the Bible itself. But then does it really matter? We probably don't believe what is in the Bible.

I have often said that Satan does not have to remove our Bibles. We do not bother to read it as it is?

Will we die for the word. Probably not. But I would sure loved to be proved wrong on this.

My thoughts.

Bearmaster.

 2013/8/10 18:26
Sidewalk
Member



Joined: 2011/11/11
Posts: 708
San Diego

 Re: Will we die for the Word?

The only people who will die for the Word are those who have first come to live for it. It will be a no brainer when that time comes.

And that time is quickly speeding its way into American culture. I am appalled daily by how eager this people gobbles up the idea that being enslaved by an all-powerful government system is such a good idea.

And everything in Christianity opposes this, the two cannot abide.

Showdown coming!


_________________
Tom Cameron

 2013/8/10 22:40Profile
Lafforgue
Member



Joined: 2006/3/12
Posts: 1
Germany

 Re: Jude 1:3

Hearing from God
Sunday, June 23, 2013

HISTORY OF THE OLD TESTAMENT OF THE BIBLE
A FEW GAIL A. RIPLINGER NOTES:
MOVING ON TO
THE OLD TESTAMENT OF THE BIBLE
SOMETHING CALLED Ben Chayyim
PROBABLY WRITTEN ABOUT 1500 YEARS AGO;
THE RABBINIC BIBLE.
1937 RUDOLF KITTEL CHANGED
THE TRADITIONAL HEBREW BIBLE.
RUDOLF KITTEL WAS ANTI-SEMITIC
.. HE DID NOT LIKE
JEWISH PEOPLE....
...SO MUCH SO THAT RUDOLF KITTELS
SON ;
GEARHARD KITTEL WAS TRIED
AND CONVICTED
OF WAR CRIMES AGAINST THE JEWS.
______________
INSIGHT ON THE HEART OF GEARHARD KITTEL:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerhard_Kittel
Gerhard Kittel
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search
Gerhard Kittel
(September 23, 1888, Breslau –
July 11, 1948, Tübingen)
was a German Protestant theologian,
lexicographer of biblical languages,
and open anti-Semite.[1] He is best known
in academic circles for his
Theologisches Wörterbuch zum Neuen Testament
(Theological Dictionary of the New Testament).
The son of acclaimed
Old Testament scholar
Rudolf Kittel,
he married Hanna Untermeier
in 1914, but there were no children from the
union.
In May 1933 he joined
the National Socialist
German Workers Party.
A Professor of Evangelical Theology
and New Testament at the University
of Tübingen, he published "scientific"
studies depicting the Jewish people as
the historical enemy of Germany, Christianity,
and European culture in general.
From 1940 to 1943 he actively assisted in
the mass murder of Jews in Poland.[citation needed]
In 1945, after Hitler's Third Reich capitulated
to the Allies, Kittel was arrested by the
French occupying forces, removed from
office and interned at Balingen.
William F. Albright wrote the
International War Crimes Tribunal in
Nuremberg in early 1946,
"In view of
the terrible viciousness of his attacks
on Judaism and the Jews,
which continues at least until 1943,
Gerhard Kittel must bear the guilt
of having contributed more, perhaps,
than any other Christian theologian
to the mass murder of Jews by Nazis.
" Nonetheless, in 1946 Kittel was released
pending his trial. He was forbidden to enter
Tübingen until 1948, however.
From 1946 to 1948 he was a Seelsorger (soul carer)
in Beuron. In 1948 he was allowed back into Tübingen,
but died that year before the criminal proceedings
against him could be resumed.
Literary works
Die Oden Salomos überarbeitet oder einheitlich, 1914
Jesus und die Rabbinen, 1914
Die Probleme des palästinensischen Spätjudentums und das Urchristentum, 1926
Urchristentum, Spätjudentum, Hellenismus, 1926
Die Religionsgeschichte und das Urchristentum, 1932
Founder and co-editor of the "Theologisches Wörterbuch zum Neuen Testament", 5 vols., 1933-1979
Ein theologischer Briefwechsel mit Karl Barth, 1934
Christus und Imperator, 1939
______________
RUDOLF KIDDEL WAS HITLER SORT
OF HIGH PRIEST HIS PROPAGANDA MAN
... HE WROTE THE PROPAGANDA BRAINWASHING
AS TO WHY THE JEWS SHOULD BE KILLED...
[YOU MAY DO WELL TO RESEARCH THIS
INFORMATION IN YOUR PUBLIC LIBRARY
... RATHER THAN ONLINE]
SO NOW THEN WE HAVE THE SON OF RUDOLF KITTEL;
GEARHARD KITTEL, WHO CHANGED THE OLD TESTAMENT
HENCE WE HAVE THE NEW KING JAMES VERSION
HAVING THE Ben Asher,
UNDERLYING THE OLD TESTAMENT.
IT REPLACED THE ORIGINAL
Ben Chayyim TEXT THAT UNDERLINED
THE OLD TESTAMENT.
The Ben Asher; the false text was created in 1937
at the peak of anti-Semitism WHEN THE GERMANS
ARE BEGINNING TO KILL THE JEWS.
A GOOD QUESTION: WHY WOULD WE WANT AN
OLD TESTAMENT WRITTEN BY;
PEOPLE THAT HATE THE JEWS?
GEARHARD KITTEL CAME ALONG AND WROTE
THE THEOLOGICAL DICTIONARY
OF THE NEW TESTAMENT
NOW THE TEN VOLUME WORD THAT GIVES
ALL THE ETYMOLOGY FOR ALL GREEK WORDS
IN THE NEW TESTAMENT ..
GEARHARD BROUGHT ALL THE PAGAN
VIEWS INTO THE LEXICAL INFORMATION
... SO THEN WHEN WE BUY A LEXICON
WE ARE GETTING RUDOLF KITTELS PAGAN
NOTIONS AND NOT THE HISTORIC
JUDEO CHRISTIAN VIEWS.
SO THE ULTRA LIBERAL HALF PAGAN-
HALF CHRISTIAN LEXICON AGREES WITH
THE NEW VERSIONS OF THE BIBLE AND
THE REASON IT AGREES IS BECAUSE
THE NEW BIBLES ARE FILLED WITH
THE LIBERAL PAGAN IDEAS.
SO THE NEW KING JAMES VERSION
COMPLETELY DROPS:
THE Ben Chayyim
RABBINIC BIBLE ;
AND FOLLOW the Stuttgart Edition
NOW YOU CAN LOOK ON
THE FRONT OF THE BIBLE AND SEE
IT IS the Stuttgart Edition
BY RUDOLF KITTEL ....
AND HIS SON
GEARHARD KITTEL WROTE
THE THEOLOGICAL DICTIONARY
OF THE NEW TESTAMENT...
THESE COMBINED WORKS
COME FROM ANTIEMETIC MEN...
IF YOU LOOK AT;
ENCYCLOPEDIA JUDAICA 1971
LOOK UP RUDOLF KITTEL :
#1 antiemetic tendencies
#2 contributions of humanistic
mystery religions in his thinking
NOTE WHO IS WRITING THIS ENCYCLOPEDIA
INFORMATION THESE ARE JUST
SECULAR SCHOLARS WRITING ABOUT A MANS
LIFE ; WHAT DOES HE THINK,
WHAT DOES HE BELIEVE?
ITS NOT MUCH IT’S A MERE DROP OF WATER
TO THE NOTES GAIL RIPLINGER HAS PUBLISHED
IN HER BOOKS FOLLOWING HER SIX YEAR STUDY
OF THE SOUND DOCTRINE AND ITS FALL
INTO ENEMY HANDS...
PLEASE BE AWARE ... AND PLEASE FEEL FREE
TO RESEARCH ON YOUR OWN....
WHILE YOU STILL CAN... IN JESUS* HOLY NAME AMEN
" The Two Competing Hebrew Old Testament Texts"
"There are two basic texts in existence in Hebrew,
the false one, edited by Ben Asher,
and
the true one, edited by Ben Chayyim.
The Ben Asher is exhibited in Rudolf Kittel's
BIBLIA HEBRAICA (BHK) (1937) with all of
his suggested footnote changes, as well as
in the Stuttgart edition of BIBLIA HEBRAICA
(BHS) (1967-77) with all of their suggested
footnote changes.
"The true text of Ben Chayyim on which
our KING JAMES BIBLE is based is also
available. It is called the Daniel Bomberg edition
or the Second Great Rabbinic Bible (1524-25).
This Ben Chayyim Masoretic Hebrew text
was the unquestioned Hebrew text
for the next 400 years. Nobody questioned it.
In fact, Rudolf Kittel, in his first two editions
of 1906 and 1912, used that text
in his BIBLIA HEBRAICA.
MY G.A.RIPLINGER NOTES STOP AROUND HERE:
The Ben Asher uses the Leningrad Manuscript
(B19 a or "L or some lettrer following the 19?
RUDOLF KIDDEL TOOK THE
LENINGRAD MANUSCRIPT 19 ? and changed it....
from that comes The Ben Asher....
AND I CANT SEEM TO PICK UP THE TRAIL OF WHERE I LEFT OFF AND SHE WAS HEADED...
ALL MY LEADS SEEM TO RUN TO DRY.
FOR THE MOST PART THESE NOTES
ARE TAKEN FROM AT TIMES
WORD FOR WORD FROM GAIL RIPLINGERS
VARIOUS ONLINE VIDEOS... I LISTENED
AND TYPED THEM OUT THAT WE MAY
BE ENLIGHTENED BY THEM..
IN CLOSING; THE MOST IMPORTANT THING IN THESE
LAST DAYS IS YOUR SOUL SALVATION;
IF YOUR NOT SAVED TODAY IS THE DAY
OF SALVATION...
CALL OUT TO JESUS* WHILE YOU HAVE BREATH
AND LIFE TO DO IT.
KNOWLEDGE SAVES NONE...
YOU CAN AND WILL TAKE IT WITH YOU TO HELL
IF YOU UNSAVED...
RECALL LUKE 16 THE RICH MAN
IN HELL HAD HIS MEMORY OF LIFE ON EARTH AND
WORRIED OVER HIS LOVES ONES UPON EARTH WHILE
HE BURNED IN THE FLAMES OF HELL
AND THE FATHER
ABRAHAM SAID UNTO THE RICH MAN ...
YOU HAD RECEIVED GOOD THINGS IN
YOUR LIFETIME
AND LAZARUS EVIL THINGS...
AND THE
RICH MAN COULD REFLECT
KNOWING THIS STATEMENT WAS TRUE...
WHALA- MEMORY IN HELL;
OUR MEMORY OUR KNOWLEDGE GAINED
GOES WITH US..
CASE AND POINT... KNOWLEDGE IS GOOD
BUT ITS NOT GOING TO SAVE US...
WE NEED A HEART
...A SINCERE HEART TO BE SAVED...
AND JESUS* WILL HEAR OUR CRY
AND WE SHALL BE SAVED..
HALLELUJAH PRAISE AND THANK YOU JESUS*
* KNOWLEDGE IS GOOD....
[Hosea 4:6] GOD SAID; MY PEOPLE ARE DESTROYED
FOR LACK OF KNOWLEDGE...
* YET KNOWLEDGE
WILL SAVE NONE
King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
MATTEW 15:8
This people draweth nigh unto me with
their mouth, and honoureth me
with their lips;
but their heart is far from me.
*SALVATION IS ETERNAL LIFE
UNTO YOU... AMEN
_____
FOR ADDITIONAL SUPPORTIVE INFORMATION
ON THE SOUND DOCTRINE IN JEOPARDY :
http://www.scionofzion.com/kjo.htm
MORE ON PERVERSION OF THE SOUND DOCTRINE
http://www.chick.com/ask/articles/nkjvtext.asp
GAIL A. RIPLINGER HAS BOOKS FOR STUDY....
REVEALS NEW AGE BIBLE VERSIONS AND MORE.
http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/False%20Religions/New%20Age/new_age-riplinger.htm
PLEASE READ:
1611 King James Bible
OR
THE King James Bible PURE
CAMBRIDGE EDITION FOR SOUND DOCTRINE.
This is an online link for both Bibles
http://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/1611-Bible/
ONE DAY I HOPE TO SEE YOU IN THE KINGDOM OF THE MOST HIGH GOD
THROUGH OUR SAVIOR JESUS* CHRIST .... THE ONE WHO DIED ON THE CROSS AND ROSE UP FROM THE TOMB... HE WHO WAS DEAD AND YET LIVES...
THE HOLY LAMB OF THE ONE TRUE LIVING GOD THE FATHER, SON AND HOLY GHOST.. IN JESUS* CHRIST PRECIOUS HOLY NAME .. AMEN
Posted by Terri at 7:11 PM &&


_________________
Jean-Claude Lafforgue

 2013/8/12 19:35Profile
Sidewalk
Member



Joined: 2011/11/11
Posts: 708
San Diego

 Re: ?

Takes this conversation to a whole different level??


_________________
Tom Cameron

 2013/8/13 1:03Profile
Christinyou
Member



Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3707
Ca.

 Re:

Sidewalk wrote: """Showdown coming!"""


We won't even be able to peacefully assemble to protest what the Government is doing. How can we defend ourselves against 50 cal machine guns, tanks, F-18, C-131 gunships, etc. All I have is a 357 revolver, 12 gage shot gun and deer rifle. Unless God strengthen these old bones the shotgun and rifle would probably break my shoulder. Not much I can do to protect my family anymore.

We are becoming a progressive systematic America that will be completely controlled by the Government.

Do we want to fight our own soldiers, our own Police, which are becoming SWAT Police from hell. After they read this they will probably be knocking on my door.

What can we do? Pray? What good will that do? Will God intervene and protect His Body the Church, and His people Israel?

If Jesus does not come soon for the Church, we will be like Israel was in-slaved to Egypt for 300 years. I only have a few years left and it still scares me, not just for myself but for my 7 children 11 grandchildren to date. What future do they have.

How much can we count on God for provision? I know He can, but will He. Because who am I to give God instruction. I am nothing of myself, I am only something to God the Father because of the Son He has birthed in me. Maybe we will go through the Greatest Tribulation the world has ever known.
That does not comfort me. These words do; 1 Thessalonians 1:9-10 For they themselves shew of us what manner of entering in we had unto you, and how ye turned to God from idols to serve the living and true God; And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, even Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come.

Are delivered from the wrath to come, or not?

1 Thessalonians 4:16-18 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

Is this comforting? Jesus did not fight as we know it, but He won. 30 years ago I could fight but not His way. Now I can do nothing but depend on God to do what is right for His body the church.

I guess I don't have enough faith to not be fearful. How will I finish the race, looking up and forward to the upward calling of Jesus Christ. In this I am so week, I don't know if I could even say no to the mark if I were confronted with loosing my and my families head if I don't take the mark. I thought He took all my stripes and am under no condemnation in Christ, I thought He died so I could live, etc.

That is why I believe in the pre-tribulation catching away translated into the Kingdom of God where He says all but the body is already with Christ in the Heavenly Places.

This is comfort to me. Lord please strengthen my faith and unbelief that I might stand in what ever you see fit for me to do and stand-fast.

This; 2 Thessalonians 2:13-17 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth: Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ. Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle. Now our Lord Jesus Christ himself, and God, even our Father, which hath loved us, and hath given us everlasting consolation and good hope through grace, Comfort your hearts, and stablish you in every good word and work.

or This; 1Co 16:13 Watch ye, stand fast in the faith, quit you like men, be strong.
Ga 5:1 Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.
Php 1:27 Only let your conversation be as it becometh the gospel of Christ: that whether I come and see you, or else be absent, I may hear of your affairs, that ye stand fast in one spirit, with one mind striving together for the faith of the gospel;
Php 4:1 Therefore, my brethren dearly beloved and longed for, my joy and crown, so stand fast in the Lord, my dearly beloved.
1Th 3:8 For now we live, if ye stand fast in the Lord.

or This? But I won't do that.

In Christ: Phillip





_________________
Phillip

 2013/8/13 1:19Profile









 Re:

I would like to bring the thread back on track. Do we value the word to a degree that we would give our lives for it. If we were living in a nation hostile to Christ and owning a Bible was illegal. Indeed to own a Bible was a death sentence. Would we own one?

Indeed questions to ponder.

Bearmaster.

 2013/8/13 1:27
Christinyou
Member



Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3707
Ca.

 Re:

Bearmaster you wrote:
"""If we were living in a nation hostile to Christ and owning a Bible was illegal. """

It will be soon.

Do you believe God will take us out of Egypt. How bad must it get before God hears our prayers of setting us free. No straw for bricks and the lash unending.

Could you because you got a bible stand and watch as your whole family lost their heads for most certainly they will make you and me watch.

In Christ: Phillip


_________________
Phillip

 2013/8/13 2:08Profile
romanchog
Member



Joined: 2011/10/27
Posts: 329


 Re:

Christinyou said: "Could you because you got a bible stand and watch as your whole family lost their heads for most certainly they will make you and me watch."

If you read 2 Maccabees 7 you will see an example of this exactly.

If they who did not have the Holy Spirit in them can do it, can we not through the Holy Spirit that is in us?

Yes, I agree with you, in our own strength we cannot die for the Word of God. But thanks be to God that we do not have to do it through our own strength.

You must also remember that God will give you the grace to do what you need at the moment that you need it, and not necessarily before. God our Father will, as Corrie Ten Boom used to say, give us the "ticket" right before we get on the train but not before.

All over the world today, Christians are experiencing this exact thing. There are many examples of this in the book just put out by Greg Gordon and available free at http://gospelfellowships.net/principles-book/
in Principles 39-60. Reading it will make you weep, but it will also encourage you in what you are asking here.

I understand your fear. I am a widow with children and I fear what will happen if I have to run in a time of persecution. Who will protect us? It is my children who always remind me: The LORD will.

In Christ,

Natalie


_________________
Natalie

 2013/8/13 3:46Profile
enid
Member



Joined: 2006/5/22
Posts: 2669
Nottingham, England

 Re:


Maccabees? The Apocrypha?

No thanks.

 2013/8/13 7:24Profile
ginnyrose
Member



Joined: 2004/7/7
Posts: 7494
Mississippi

 Re:

QUOTE:
______________________________________________________________
"If we were living in a nation hostile to Christ and owning a Bible was illegal. Indeed to own a Bible was a death sentence. Would we own one?
______________________________________________________________


Good question, but one whose answer is elusive because one really does not know until it happens. Still, it is a good question that deserves serious consideration.

Let us consider the history of the church. How many in the past have owned a Bible? It was not until Gutenburg invented the movable-type printing press in the 1450s that the scriptures were made available to the masses. For over 1450 years masses of God's people did not have access to the written word. So, then, how did they live apart from it? Illiteracy was rampant as well. How did they survive spiritually?

My point is one does not have to own or be in possession of the written word to have a vibrant walk with the LORD. Now, would I die so I can be in physical possession of one? If owning a Bible could impart holiness to its possessor the USA should be the most holiest of all nations but it's not so.

Would I die to own a Bible? Seems to be the greater issue should be walk close with the LORD NOW...

My thoughts...


_________________
Sandra Miller

 2013/8/13 9:02Profile





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