Poster | Thread | rookie Member
Joined: 2003/6/3 Posts: 4821 Savannah TN
| Re: | | "God gives instructions coupled with promise. What is God's purpose?"
Paul writes this of the promise...
Eph 2:8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; [it is] the gift of God,
and...
Rom 1:17 For in it the righteousness of God is revealed from faith to faith; as it is written, "The just shall live by faith." [fn]
The righteousness of God is revealed, this is the grace that God extends to men in the hope that they would believe in Him whom He sent. As we read the testimony of Scripture concerning God's work in Abraham one will see various examples of God's grace. And this grace flows to those who live by faith.
_________________ Jeff Marshalek
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| 2011/11/20 7:59 | Profile | rookie Member
Joined: 2003/6/3 Posts: 4821 Savannah TN
| Re: | | "The righteousness of God is revealed, this is the grace that God extends to men in the hope that they would believe in Him whom He sent. As we read the testimony of Scripture concerning God's work in Abraham one will see various examples of God's grace. And this grace flows to those who live by faith."
The first testimony given to us in Scripture of the grace given to Abram is found in the book of Acts...
Act 7:2 And he said, "Brethren and fathers, listen: The God of glory appeared to our father Abraham when he was in Mesopotamia, before he dwelt in Haran,
Act 7:3 "and said to him, 'Get out of your country and from your relatives, and come to a land that I will show you.' [fn]
We are told that "The God of glory...said to him..." Through out the Scriptures we find this precept. God speaks to man.
Can man know God if He is silent?
_________________ Jeff Marshalek
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| 2011/11/21 6:37 | Profile | Christinyou Member
Joined: 2005/11/2 Posts: 3710 Ca.
| Re: | | Nicodemus, do you know where the wind is coming from or where it is going? So is the New Birth in Christ Jesus, being born again of incorruptable Seed of the Word of God who is Jesus Christ in you, the Hope of Glroy. Paul the final gospel given to the meanest man on earth, killing and percuting Christians. If you want to see Grace by Jesus Christ in a man, look to Paul. Abraham did not have Jesus Christ born again in him, Abraham was under the mercy of God, not the Grace of God in Christ Jesus by His finished work on the Cross. "Dispensation of Grace"
Man cannot know God until He speaks and now being our Father also gives us new birth in Christ, New Creatures.
In Christ: Phillip _________________ Phillip
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| 2011/11/21 15:09 | Profile | rookie Member
Joined: 2003/6/3 Posts: 4821 Savannah TN
| Re: | | Eph 2:8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; [it is] the gift of God,
The grace of God is a gift to fallen man. God is not willing that any should perish. His work is to have us believe in Him whom He sent. So let's identify the grace which was given to Abraham.
Gen 12:1 Now the LORD had said to Abram: "Get out of your country, From your family And from your father's house, To a land that I will show you. Gen 12:2 I will make you a great nation; I will bless you And make your name great; And you shall be a blessing. Gen 12:3 I will bless those who bless you, And I will curse him who curses you; And in you all the families of the earth shall be blessed."
Gen 12:7 Then the LORD appeared to Abram and said, "To your descendants I will give this land." And there he built an altar to the LORD, who had appeared to him.
Gen 13:14 And the LORD said to Abram, after Lot had separated from him: "Lift your eyes now and look from the place where you are--northward, southward, eastward, and westward; Gen 13:15 "for all the land which you see I give to you and your descendants [fn] forever. Gen 13:16 "And I will make your descendants as the dust of the earth; so that if a man could number the dust of the earth, [then] your descendants also could be numbered. Gen 13:17 "Arise, walk in the land through its length and its width, for I give it to you."
Gen 14:18 Then Melchizedek king of Salem brought out bread and wine; he [was] the priest of God Most High. Gen 14:19 And he blessed him and said: "Blessed be Abram of God Most High, Possessor of heaven and earth; Gen 14:20 And blessed be God Most High, Who has delivered your enemies into your hand." And he gave him a tithe of all.
Gen 15:1 After these things the word of the LORD came to Abram in a vision, saying, "Do not be afraid, Abram. I [am] your shield, your exceedingly great reward." Gen 15:2 But Abram said, "Lord GOD, what will You give me, seeing I go childless, and the heir of my house [is] Eliezer of Damascus?" Gen 15:3 Then Abram said, "Look, You have given me no offspring; indeed one born in my house is my heir!" Gen 15:4 And behold, the word of the LORD [came] to him, saying, "This one shall not be your heir, but one who will come from your own body shall be your heir." Gen 15:5 Then He brought him outside and said, "Look now toward heaven, and count the stars if you are able to number them." And He said to him, "So shall your descendants be."
God spoke through the power of the Holy Spirit five times in the process of time. And then the Scriptures say...
Gen 15:6 And he believed in the LORD, and He accounted it to him for righteousness.
Can man believe without the grace of God? _________________ Jeff Marshalek
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| 2011/11/21 19:34 | Profile | Christinyou Member
Joined: 2005/11/2 Posts: 3710 Ca.
| Re: | | John 1:29-34 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world. This is he of whom I said, After me cometh a man which is preferred before me: for he was before me. And I knew him not: but that he should be made manifest to Israel, therefore am I come baptizing with water. And John bare record, saying, I saw the Spirit descending from heaven like a dove, and it abode upon him. And I knew him not: but he that sent me to baptize with water, the same said unto me, Upon whom thou shalt see the Spirit descending, and remaining on him, the same is he which baptizeth with the Holy Ghost. And I saw, and bare record that this is the Son of God.
John 1:12-17 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God. And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth. John bare witness of him, and cried, saying, This was he of whom I spake, He that cometh after me is preferred before me: for he was before me. And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace. For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.
Did Abraham receive Jesus Christ? Did Abraham even believe on His name? How could Jesus have been born again in Abraham? Abraham was a great man of God and because he believed God, how did he believe, by God Himself and it was counted to him as righteousness, not made righteousn by Christ in Him. 1 Corinthians 1:30-31 But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption: That, according as it is written, He that glorieth, let him glory in the Lord. I will not glory in anything that Abraham did, just like I will not glory in anything I do. The only One that I glory in is the One that as it is written, My Glory is in God my Father and God my Savior, Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit of God, in whom all Three are now in me and my life is now made conformable to Him who gave Himself for me. Not Abraham.
In Christ: Phillip _________________ Phillip
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| 2011/11/21 20:37 | Profile | rookie Member
Joined: 2003/6/3 Posts: 4821 Savannah TN
| Re: | | Phillip wrote:
"Did Abraham receive Jesus Christ? Did Abraham even believe on His name?"
According to Scripture we have this testimony...
Neh 9:6 You alone [are] the LORD; You have made heaven, The heaven of heavens, with all their host, The earth and everything on it, The seas and all that is in them, And You preserve them all. The host of heaven worships You.
Paul confirms this to the Colossians...
Col 1:15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation.
Col 1:16 For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him.
Col 1:17 And He is before all things, and in Him all things consist.
The Lord of Nehemiah and the Lord of the Colossians is the same....Paul provided the commentary on who is the Lord God of the Old Testament.
Next we are told this in Nehemiah...
Neh 9:7 "You [are] the LORD God, Who chose Abram, And brought him out of Ur of the Chaldeans, And gave him the name Abraham;
Neh 9:8 You found his heart faithful before You, And made a covenant with him To give the land of the Canaanites, The Hittites, the Amorites, The Perizzites, the Jebusites, And the Girgashites--To give [it] to his descendants. You have performed Your words, For You [are] righteous.
The Lord God chose Abram. He found his heart faithful.
Now Jesus also provides commentary on Nehemiah 9:7...
Jhn 8:56 "Your father Abraham rejoiced to see My day, and he saw [it] and was glad."
Jhn 8:58 Jesus said to them, "Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM."
Why do you reject the God of the Old Testament? _________________ Jeff Marshalek
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| 2011/11/22 8:51 | Profile | Christinyou Member
Joined: 2005/11/2 Posts: 3710 Ca.
| Re: | | How could I reject the God of the Old Testament and believe in His Son? 2 Corinthians 5:19-21 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation. Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God. For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.
2 Corinthians 5:19-21 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation. Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God. For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.
God was in the world in Abrahams time showing us by whom He was going to reconcile the world to Himself. Now He is reconciling us to Himself, by the Son. There is no life in Abraham, only a forshadowing of the Seed, which is Jesus Christ.
Heb 11:17 By faith Abraham, when he was tried, offered up Isaac: and he that had received the promises offered up his only begotten son, Jas 2:21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?
We are now not justified by works, we are justified by Grace through Faith, which is Jesus Christ the Son of God, by whom God now speaks to us.
Ro 5:10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life. 1Co 1:9 God is faithful, by whom ye were called unto the fellowship of his Son Jesus Christ our Lord. Heb 1:2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;
I will see Abraham some day and he would point me to Jesus Christ if he was the first thing in heaven I see, which he does by his life with God in the Old Testament. My life now is in Christ, He is the first One I will see.
Galatians 2:16-21 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified. But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid. For if I build again the things which I destroyed, I make myself a transgressor. For I through the law am dead to the law, that I might live unto God. I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me. I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.
In Christ: Phillip _________________ Phillip
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| 2011/11/22 13:26 | Profile | rookie Member
Joined: 2003/6/3 Posts: 4821 Savannah TN
| Re: | | Neh 9:6 You alone [are] the LORD; You have made heaven, The heaven of heavens, with all their host, The earth and everything on it, The seas and all that is in them, And You preserve them all. The host of heaven worships You.
Col 1:15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation.
Col 1:16 For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him.
Col 1:17 And He is before all things, and in Him all things consist.
Who are Nehemiah and Paul refering to in the Scriptures above? _________________ Jeff Marshalek
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| 2011/11/22 13:50 | Profile | Christinyou Member
Joined: 2005/11/2 Posts: 3710 Ca.
| Re: | | This is who Nehemiah was speaking to. The all powerful creator of the universe who was God, The Son and the Holy Spirit and He, being the Three in One Created all things through Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit, all Three, being One God.
Genesis 1:1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
Genesis 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in ((our)) image, after ((our)) likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
This is who Paul was refering to.
Galatians 1:15-16 But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb, and called me by his grace, To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood:
Now!!! Ephesians 1:3-13 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ: According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will, To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved. In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace; Wherein he hath abounded toward us in all wisdom and prudence; Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself: That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him: In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will: That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ. In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
"who first trusted in Christ", Abraham showed how God would sacrifice His own Son, even unto death of the Cross, by His Blood we are saved, Through the praise of Gods glory that we first trusted in Christ for Salvation, which is the Gospel preached to us by Paul. Even Abraham believed God and put his own human flesh son on the altar, God providing the shadow of His Own Son as the sacrifice for those after the Cross, the Ram in the thicket, thus alowing Issac to live in the flesh. This was counted to Abraham for righteousness, not making him righteous, which we now have by Christ being born again in us, but showing through Abraham even the truth of the Gospel of our Salvation, "Christ in you the hope of Glory", of which Abraham could not avail himself of this righteousness for Christ had not come and be born, live, minister to Israel who received Him not, die on the Cross, be resurrected, Seen in His resurrected body and ascend into Heaven and come back in the Spirit of the Born Again giving new creation life to those He our new Father has given to the Son, That we might become the sons of God, plus the promise of the indwelling Holy Spirit who now is in us forever.
We must see Abraham of who he was and how God provided types and shadows of the One Who would Save all of Gods birthed children. Not in Abraham but In Christ.
A birthed child of God, in Christ: Phillip
_________________ Phillip
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| 2011/11/22 18:38 | Profile | rookie Member
Joined: 2003/6/3 Posts: 4821 Savannah TN
| Re: | | Phillip wrote:
"We must see Abraham of who he was and how God provided types and shadows of the One Who would Save all of Gods birthed children. Not in Abraham but In Christ."
When the Scripture's state...
Act 7:2 And he said, "Brethren and fathers, listen: The God of glory appeared to our father Abraham when he was in Mesopotamia, before he dwelt in Haran,
Act 7:3 "and said to him, 'Get out of your country and from your relatives, and come to a land that I will show you.' [fn]
Is this event in Abraham's life a "shadow" to him or did "The God of glory" appear to him?
If you accept what the Scripture says, then who in the Trinity appeared to Abraham?
_________________ Jeff Marshalek
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| 2011/11/23 7:43 | Profile |
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