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Christinyou
Member



Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3707
Ca.

 Re:

Where does sin get its power? From the spirit of a man. Who is that spirit before being born again? The Man of sin, Satan himself, the liar from the beginning.

When a believer is born again, what happens to the spirit of Satan? The spirit of Satan is out, the Spirit of Christ the Seed of God is in. It is not my spirit that sins, it is my mind in the flesh that sins. Christ my Spirit cannot sin. How does sin reach its conclusion in me? Not by my Spirit which is Christ but in my soul/mind is where;

James 1:13-21 Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man: But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed. Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death. Do not err, my beloved brethren. Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning. Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures. Wherefore, my beloved brethren, let every man be swift to hear, slow to speak, slow to wrath: For the wrath of man worketh not the righteousness of God. Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls.

If my Spirit sins, I am being tempted by God and that can never be. So, where am I tempted? In the lust of my soul/mind, then when the lust of my soul/mind has conceived, sin comes forth and brings death with it. Where is my death, not in Spirit but in my Mind/Soul. That is why and how we can repent and confess and be cleansed from all unrighteousness. The Christ Spirit in me is always perfect and He cannot sin. I can sin, but not in spirit, only in my soul/mind which has all the body pulls of the old man spirit that is now dead, but my mind must be renewed to this conviction, I am dead to sin by the Christ Spirit that is in me, I can still sin by my own mind/soul that still has all the body pulls of the old man that is now dead, that is why I am renewing my mind to the Mind of Christ, which the scripture says I now have.

2 Corinthians 1:10 Who delivered us from so great a death, and doth deliver: in whom we trust that he will yet deliver us;

Romans 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of His.

We are delivered in Spirit, (new life in Christ). We are being delivered in our soul/mind, (through the Mind of Christ in us)by the Holy Spirit. We will be delivered completely in our new bodies of flesh and bone (no blood), just like Jesus and His glorious body.

In Christ: Phillip


_________________
Phillip

 2011/1/10 20:22Profile









 Re:

Quote:
The word "might" refer to something being possible and the word might appears in every translation I have looked at (about fifteen of them).

Your giving a strong impression that Jesus wasn't victorious in destroying him that had power over death, that is, the devil.

Looked up "Might" in Strongs Numbers and came up with something that was more interesting. The word in the Greek is Dunamai which means, "to be able".

When translating this verse, it's rendering is, Hebrews 2:14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, He also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death He [was] ABLE TO destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;

 2011/1/10 20:22
Lysa
Member



Joined: 2008/10/25
Posts: 3421
This world is not my home anymore.

 Re:

Quote:
Alive-to-God wrote on 2011/1/6

Doug, I'd like to make this my last post in this thread. I hope if others think I'm as wrong as you do, they will back you up. Thanks for the discussion.



I'm glad you're back and I don't think you're wrong.

God bless,
Lisa


_________________
Lisa

 2011/1/10 20:34Profile









 Re: Saint or sinner


Hi Doug,

Quote:
Furthermore if sin was destroyed then Christian would never ever have to worry about ever sinning again......... now do you possibly think that is the case?

A simple yes or no will suffice

Yes.

I don't worry about sinning, because I decided to enter into the death of Christ whereby in Him, 'the sin' in me is crucified. IF I sin, I have an Advocate with my Father in heaven; Jesus Christ the righteous who died for me that I might become the righteousness of God in Him. I walk in the light as He is in the light, and His blood cleanses me from all unrighteousness.

This is the rest of faith.


Btw, the sin in the context of Heb 12:1 which besets us, is unbelief.

I'm not looking for an answer to this, but you might like to ponder the question.

What was the point of Jesus Christ coming to die if His death was not to have the power to reverse eternally the death which had entered the human race through Adam's disobedience, to make the way for God to have pure unsullied fellowship with man again?

(Subsidiary question: why not just let Israel carry on with animal sacrifices?)

 2011/1/10 20:43









 Re: Saint or sinner



Thanks Lysa,

Quote:
I'm glad you're back and I don't think you're wrong.

The encouragement is appreciated.

 2011/1/10 20:46
Christinyou
Member



Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3707
Ca.

 Re:

This statement "that He might" is not an if, but a certainty the He is able and by His Power He accomplished it. Satan out and Christ birthed in the believer.

Matthew Poole's Commentary on the Holy Bible
Hebrews 2:14 carries the import of the fulness of the destruction the Devil has over the human race by the Law, which Kills, but is a perfect statement of what God requires to come to know God and His full and complete control of His own creation. Ephesians 1:4-5 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

Matthew Poole's Commentary on the Holy Bible
Hebrews 2:14

But being God, besides his Divine nature, &c., to it he took the human, even their true and full nature, consisting of a body and a soul, and so united them, that in him they became one person; so that hence results a double union of Christ with man. By his incarnation he is of one nature with all the human race, body and soul and so is the Head of them: and by his dying for them all the human race are made salvable By His Devine Spirit and nature of the Father, which angels are not; and those who believe on him, are actually sanctified and united to and in Him and Him in us, as His elect and chosen body, and shall be saved by Him.

((((That through death he might destroy him that had the power of death:)))) by his dying on the cross as testator of God's covenant, and not by his power as a God, (which was most glorious to himself, but most ignominious to the devil, according to the promise, Ge 3:15), did he abolish, or bring to nought, and render powerless without any recovery, not by taking away the immortal life and being, but the kratoV, the strength and power to kill. For the ezousia, the authority, right, and command, the keys of death, are in Christ's hand only, and he useth the strength of this execution in it, as to his enemies; when sinners become penitent believers, then his death satisfying God's justice for their sin, hath executed the power as to death, which the devil had by law against them: 1Co 15:56-57: The sting of death is sin, that gives him power; and the strength of sin is the law, that, unless satisfied for, takes part with sin; but Christ by dying takes away the law's enmity, removes sin, as to guilt, stain, and power, and so brings to nought this power.

That is, the devil; the prince himself, set here collectively for all the rest of his evil spirits, Mt 25:41, who by his lies drew man into sin, and by sin stings him to death; having therefore such power to seduce to sin, he powerfully renders men obnoxious to death: and then, as executioner, having them by the law delivered into his hands, putteth forth his strength to torment and destroy them. Christ by his death doth with price and power redeem them out of his hand, and destroys all his works, takes possession of them, and brings them through death to eternal life. Ver. 14. For we are made partakers of Christ: for shows this to be a rational motive, urging home the former counsel, unto which the following condition doth agree; for we believing Christians and Brethren are made metocoi, partners with the primitive Proprietor supposed in it, even Christ, who hath of his own the fulness of God, life, grace, glory, and all good; in all which fulness of his we share, by virtue of our union with him, Joh 1:16; Eph 1:22-23; Col 1:19; 2:9-10; and he by his Spirit will free us from the deceitfulness of sin, and hardening by it.

If we hold the beginning of our confidence; if by a spiritual tenaciousness, and firm fixing in our hearts, we hold archn, either the principal or fundamental truth, as the word signifieth in sciences; or, the entrance or beginning of our course, as used in things, so as the first step in Christianity is styled a beginning of grace.

Stedfast unto the end: upostasewV, in personal relations, is, a real subsistence, as of the Son in the Trinity, Heb 1:3; in things, the basis and foundation upholding others; and this in Christianity is Christ principally, who bears up his church, Eph 2:20-22. And faith, the instrument whereby we receive Christ, is so called, Heb 11:1, that which renders present and subsisting what is hoped for to the soul; so that here it imports the retaining firm that principle of truth, upon which Christians are bottomed and supported to life, that is, Christ himself, and the true doctrine of him; as also, that we must firmly stand in the first beginnings of faith, and increase in them, so as they may be firmly fixed in our hearts, and our hearts on them, so as never to be removed as long as we live. Our retaining firmly of this, makes us partners in Christ; both instrumentally helping in it, and evidentially; it being the infallible consequence of true grace, holding us to this communion with Christ. How ought these conditions to quicken the activity of believers!

"might destroy him"

Strong's Greek Dictionary
2673. katargeo
Search for G2673 in KJVSL
katargew katargeo kat-arg-eh'-o
from 2596 and 691; to be (render) entirely idle (useless), literally or figuratively:--abolish, cease, cumber, deliver, destroy, do away, become (make) of no (none, without) effect, fail, loose, bring (come) to nought, put away (down), vanish away, make void.

In Christ: Phillip


_________________
Phillip

 2011/1/11 2:22Profile









 Re:

Doug,

When Jesus was on that cross he 'atoned' (was the propitiation) for all our past SINS (Romans 3:25)

But Jesus didn't just leave it there he also 'became SIN for us' (Corinthians 5:21). This refers to the SIN nature , the source of all SINS, the original SIN.

Jesus became SIN for us. The father killed SIN in the flesh.

Jesus ROSE AGAIN He reversed the curse of Satan which leads to SIN and DEATH.

We must claim that victory that Jesus won. We are not under the law so Satan has nothing to accuse us with. This is freedom in Jesus Christ.

We have to believe that Jesus HAS killed our old man, and offer ourselves as living sacrifices.

It is finished



 2011/1/11 5:52
Lesserlight
Member



Joined: 2010/9/19
Posts: 134


 Re:

Quote:
But Jesus didn't just leave it there he also 'became SIN for us



Andy......... Jesus never became sin....... He became a sin offering for us and was only able to do so because He had no sin

There is a significant difference between the two and you need to get that right within you because it is part of the foundation of Christ in you........ Looking around here and listening to what he is being said is enough to make angels cry

No wonder Hosea said that God's people perish because of their lack of knowledge.

At a basic level Christians are to be baptized in the Holy Spirit that is always given evidence through some gift of the spirit that the least of is speaking in tongues. Unfortunately I am receiving an unction that there are those here who have never received the baptism of the Holy Spirit therefore they do not have the spirit within them that would allow them to see the truth that would set them free from the lies they are believing in.

This can be corrected and those here who have yet to ever display any of the supernatural gifts of the spirit need to consider the fact that the Holy Spirit is always given with evidence. If there has never been any evidence it is because the Holy Spirit is not in them.

I am not speaking of signs and wonders as in miracles but just the simplest of spiritual gifts such as the gift of tongue or the ability to prophesies (truthfully and accurately) as well as understand the prophecies in scripture that are from Genesis to Revelations......... If either of those two of the simplest of spiritual gifts are not present with you then you need to ask God why for some reason He has left you out.

Christians still having sin in them is amongst the most basic and plainly stated foundational knowledge there is. Those who are hearing otherwise are not hearing from God but are hearing from the father of all lies.

2 Peter 1:19
We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts:

When Christians receive the Baptism of the Holy Spirit it is the spirit of Jesus that is the light coming into their heart that is the dark place because of the presence of sin in man. However as the scriptures say the darkness cannot comprehend the light and the reason why there are people here who cannot comprehend the simplest of foundational knowledge is because the light has yet to come into them.

Darkness is not changed to light but instead light displaces darkness....... the brighter the light the more of the faith that displaces the darkness of Satan all the way up until the completion of ones sanctification when Christ is finally formed in them........ when that happens signs and wonders always follow that blessing just like the simple gifts of the spirit always follow the baptism of the Holy Spirit that is the start of the light coming into a dark place.

However Without first being baptized in the Holy Spirit that is always given with evidence, Christ cannot ever be formed in someone !!! ......... Or stated In laymen's terms it is as simple as "no seed no tree".

Blessings

Doug

 2011/1/11 7:26Profile
mguldner
Member



Joined: 2009/12/4
Posts: 1860
Kansas

 Re:

Doug I agree and disagree with your statements made. To say that Speaking in Tongues is an evidence is false, speaking in tongues is a gift of the Holy Spirit, not evidence. The ONLY Evidence of Holy Spirit baptism that lines up with ALL of Scripture is the Fruit of the Spirit Love, Joy, Peace, Patience, Kindness, Gentleness,Faithfulness, Goodness, and Self Control. These are the only marks of evidence we find in scripture. The Gifts are gifts not evidence.

We see many Christians that we hold in high regard that by your definition have never been baptised by the Holy Spirit, but many of these Saints has/had an undeniable Holiness and Love and devotion to God. I have seen one to many Pentecostals be puffed up in pride from this doctrine of Tongues and infact have seen an outrageous amount of them become so focused on the Gift they neglect the Giver of the Gift.

I believe there can be genunue tongues that operate in the church however I have seen many people use this Gift as simply a means to gain acceptance and so can't be used as a viable "evidence" but only the Fruits of the Spirit can be used as viable and tangable evidence of Holy Spirit Baptism.

You may very well disagree with me but please take into consideration what I have said.

*edited Grammatical errors :)*


_________________
Matthew Guldner

 2011/1/11 7:44Profile
Lesserlight
Member



Joined: 2010/9/19
Posts: 134


 Re:

Quote:
The ONLY Evidence of Holy Spirit baptism that lines up with ALL of Scripture is the Fruit of the Spirit Love, Joy, Peace, Patience, Kindness, Gentleness,Faithfulness, Goodness, and Self Control. These are the only marks of evidence we find in scripture. The Gifts are gifts not evidence.





Mgulder........ thank you for your reply but unfortunately you have been decieved.

Throughout history and the Bible God has always showed his presence through supernatural events or at the least supernatural gifts of the spirit.

Granted love and joy etc etc are to be present but one does NOT have to have Christ within them to display what you are saying are the" ONLY" evidence of the Holy Spirit and I hope for your sake that you are able to grasp that.

When Adam and Eve ate from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil they ate the fruit where the seed is and within that fruit were the seeds of the knowledge of both good and evil. Consequently and because the law of the seed that is one of the laws of God, anyone can produce either good or evil. Thus after they sinned and not before Adam and Eve brought forth both Cain and Abel as in good and evil.

When Paul went to the Greeks he spoke of those who worshipped an unknown God that even though they did not have the law they still followed after the law....... why they did that is the same reason because Adam and Eve eating the seed of the knowledge of good one can have all the nice things that you are speaking of but still not ever have received the Holy Spirit of Christ. Anything less than that is a lie straight from the father of all lies.

However the signs of Pentecost are only from God and are a sign of the Holy Spirit that is the seed that is Christ being given to a person. Just because one is baptized in the Holy Spirit does not mean that they cannot still be swept away by Satan....... unfortunately that happens all the time and the dog returns to its vomit because of the sin that is still in Christians after they have received the Holy Spirit.

Blessings

Doug

 2011/1/11 8:29Profile





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