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Christinyou
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 Re:

"Even as Jesus is, so are we in this world. I can do nothing of myself, salvation, redemption, be righteous, None wise, sanctification, or any other wise, for without Christ I am nothing and can do nothing, I only do as the Father tells me to do through the Life of Christ and the Holy Spirit teacher of this mind of Christ that is in me.

Like Christ, so are we in this world. How did Christ do it?

John 5:19 Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise.

As me; I can do nothing of myself.

John 5:30 I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me.

As me; As I hear I judge, by the Christ in me and the Holy Spirit Truth.

John 15:5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in Him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without Me ye can do nothing.

My fruit can only come through the Abiding Christ that is in me. I abide in Him and He abides in me.

This is the whole of who we are in Christ;

Joh 14:1 ¶ Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me.
Joh 14:2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.
Joh 14:3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.
Joh 14:4 ¶ And whither I go ye know, and the way ye know.
Joh 14:5 Thomas saith unto him, Lord, we know not whither thou goest; and how can we know the way?
Joh 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
Joh 14:7 If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also: and from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him.
Joh 14:8 Philip saith unto him, Lord, shew us the Father, and it sufficeth us.
Joh 14:9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?
Joh 14:10 Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works.
Joh 14:11 Believe me that I am in the Father, and the Father in me: or else believe me for the very works' sake.
Joh 14:12 ¶ Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.
Joh 14:13 And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son.
Joh 14:14 If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it.
Joh 14:15 ¶ If ye love me, keep my commandments.
Joh 14:16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;
Joh 14:17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
Joh 14:18 ¶ I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.
Joh 14:19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also.
Joh 14:20 At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you.
Joh 14:21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.
Joh 14:22 Judas saith unto him, not Iscariot, Lord, how is it that thou wilt manifest thyself unto us, and not unto the world?
Joh 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.
Joh 14:24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.
Joh 14:25 ¶ These things have I spoken unto you, being yet present with you.
Joh 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.
Joh 14:27 Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you: not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid.
Joh 14:28 ¶ Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I.
Joh 14:29 And now I have told you before it come to pass, that, when it is come to pass, ye might believe.
Joh 14:30 Hereafter I will not talk much with you: for the prince of this world cometh, and hath nothing in me.
Joh 14:31 But that the world may know that I love the Father; and as the Father gave me commandment, even so I do. Arise, let us go hence.

"commandments"

Strong's Greek Dictionary
1785. entole
Search for G1785 in KJVSL
entolh entole en-tol-ay'
from 1781; injunction, i.e. an authoritative prescription:--commandment, precept.

My old husband Satan has no rule over me anymore, I am dead to him and he is dead to me, I am crucified with Christ, dead to the Law and my New Husband Has made me clean, presenting to Himself without spot of wrinkle a bride, which is the Body of Christ, Me and the whole Church of Christ which are in Him and He in us.

Law; Strong's Greek Dictionary
3551. nomos
Search for G3551 in KJVSL
nomoV nomos nom'-os
from a primary nemo (to parcel out, especially food or grazing to animals); law (through the idea of prescriptive usage), genitive case (regulation), specially, (of Moses (including the volume); also of the Gospel), or figuratively (a principle):--law.

See the difference?

Ro 7:2 For the woman that has a husband is bound by law to the husband while he lives, but if the husband dies, she is discharged from the law of the husband.

Ro 7:4 Therefore, my brothers, you also were made dead to the law through the body of Christ, that you would be joined to another, to him who was raised from the dead, that we might bring forth fruit to God.

1Co 7:39 A wife is bound by law for as long as her husband lives; but if the husband is dead, she is free to be married to whoever she desires, only in the Lord.

Ga 2:19 For I, through the law, died to the law, that I might live to God.

Alive in Christ and He alive in me, Incorruptable Seed born in me by the Word Himself through the Seed of the Father.

In Christ: Phillip




_________________
Phillip

 2011/1/9 22:07Profile









 Re:

I completely agree that we are not saved by the works of the law. One would have to have not read the N.T. to see that and I also agree with all Scripture that tells us what and who we are in Christ. Amen to that!

Quote: ""...... I only do as the Father tells me to do through the Life of Christ and the Holy Spirit teacher of this mind of Christ that is in me.""

I believe this is what we're discussing on this thread. Obedience and freewill.

You say that you "only DO" what the Father tells you to do, through the Life of Christ and the Holy Spirit teacher of this mind of Christ that is in you.

"Doing" is obeying. That's a choice.

Heb 5:8,9 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; and being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him
Rom 8:17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.


You quoted more freewill verses - very good - Joh 14:15 ¶ If ye love me, keep my commandments...
Joh 14:21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.
Joh 14:22 Judas saith unto him, not Iscariot, Lord, how is it that thou wilt manifest thyself unto us, and not unto the world?
Joh 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.



Quote: "I abide in Him and He abides in me."

Jesus 'commanded' that we "abide in Him" - another act of your/our freewill -

Joh 15:1 I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.
Joh 15:2 Every branch "in me" that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.
Joh 15:3 Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.
Joh 15:4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
Joh 15:5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
Joh 15:6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.
Joh 15:7 If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you.
Joh 15:8 Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit; so shall ye be my disciples.
Joh 15:9 As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love.
Joh 15:10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.
Joh 15:11 These things have I spoken unto you, that my joy might remain in you, and that your joy might be full.
Joh 15:12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you.
Joh 15:13 Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.
Joh 15:14 Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.




That is called "obedience" - "walking in the spirit" - and not "grieving the Spirit" - which can be or not be done because we still have freewill. This is an act of your will. GOD does not make robots. We cooperate with His Spirit because we Love Him. Sanctification is an ongoing process of Him doing and us being willing to do His will. "Reckon yourselves dead unto sin" - is another act of our freewills.

Freewill is the issue and always shall be until we breath our last breath.


"This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church" ....

Acts of freewill toward our "Husband" -

Eph 5:22 Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as unto the Lord.

Eph 5:23 For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body.
Eph 5:24 Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in every thing.
Eph 5:25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

Eph 5:26 That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,

Eph 5:27 That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.

Eph 5:28 So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself.
Eph 5:29 For no man ever yet hated his own flesh; but nourisheth and cherisheth it, even as the Lord the church:
Eph 5:30 For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones.
Eph 5:31 For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh.

Eph 5:32 This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.

Eph 5:33 Nevertheless let every one of you in particular so love his wife even as himself; and the wife see that she reverence her husband.


Choosing to love is the greatest commandment that fulfills all the law and the prophets and without love, we will not be saved.


 2011/1/9 23:26









 Re:

Phillip (Christinyou)

You have just illustrated a perfect example of how I understand the application of the mosaic law, how marriage between man and women also gives us insight into our relationship to God.

And the various 'unclean' things which they had to follow Gods instructions to become clean again, relate to how we became unclean (fallen humanity), and how Jesus has provided the way to be spotless through him.

I used to read it and think is was just the teachings of ancient superstitious people.

It is as someone says here shadows and types. It actually happened and it foreshadowed what was to come, that's the beauty of it, I can't see how anyone but God could manage something like that!




 2011/1/10 0:07
Christinyou
Member



Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3707
Ca.

 Re:

Matthew 11:27 All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father; neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him.

Is this free will, or the will of God?

I don't think we are to seek our own will either, even as Christ seeks not His own will but the will of the Father.

John 5:30 I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me.

If I seek my own will, I am lost and will do nothing to will my salvation. I can only believe the Will of the Father which He has sent to me, to reveal Christ in me, that is Christ birthed in me and now all that Christ is I am, will be. The only thing I cannot do is to become Jesus Christ the Only Begotten Son, but a son, yes I am a son by the Son birthed in me, I am becoming a son, by the Christ birthed in me and I will be a son by the Son birthed In me when on resurrection day I will have a body just like His. He saved me, He doth save me and He will save me.

Where does my free will take effect in all that God has, is and will do for my salvation in Christ. He did it all. I did nothing all I can say is at a Special time in my life I believed that Jesus Christ is the Son of God, not my will but His. Now that I believe I am being perfected and conformed to the image of Christ that is in me, all I want to do is the will of the Father whom the Son will reveal Him to me.

With Christ in me then I can; Matthew 7:7 Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you: I could not seek the Father or believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God unless it is revealed to me from above. "No man seeks His face".


Praise God In Christ, by His Faith I believe and am becoming I am and will be becoming an I am throughout all eternity in Christ, and with the Holy Spirit teaching me and He also the Holy Spirit being in me will bring forth the Son of God in me manifest to the whole of creation and we are called the son's of God.

Free will in my salvation, No. Free will after conversion, Yes, to seek His face and love Him as He loves me and keep His Commandments which are not grievous, but now warranted because of the Love of Christ that is in me.

In Christ: Phillip


_________________
Phillip

 2011/1/10 1:26Profile









 Re: Saint or sinner


Hi Doug,

Jesus said, For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed [the righteousness] of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven. Matt 5:20


Surely Jesus became 'the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth' BECAUSE His righteousness exceeded the that of the scribes and Pharisees.

Unless we are found in Him, the Lamb without blemish who was slain from the foundation of the world, we fall short of our Father's will.

 2011/1/10 3:12









 Re:

Doug,

Consider for a moment the thieves who Luke tells us were crucified on either side of Jesus. One of them realized his true condition. He believed Jesus and turned to him in repentance. Whereas the other thief believed Jesus had the power to save himself, but did not see himself as under the same divine sentence. He only wanted Jesus to save his flesh self.

Jesus didn't tell him "sorry the key to the salvation I offer is in your scriptures, it's too late for you". He said ""Truly I say to you, today you will be with me in paradise". Jesus is the key, he is the way the truth and the life.

 2011/1/10 7:40









 Re:


So the Bride has a one sided relationship with her Husband.
He does everything - but yet Philip - you claimed that "I 'ONLY' DO what the Father tells me to' - that is "obedience" - but also in this case, the claim of "sinless perfection" or the Perfect Image of Christ ... because you used the word "only" with do.

To shorten this dialogue with one last question about one quote -

" Praise God In Christ, by His Faith I believe and am becoming "I am" and will be becoming an "I am" throughout all eternity in Christ...." [emphasis mine]


So you are becoming GOD and will be throughout eternity.

Not just The Bride but "I AM" as well ?

 2011/1/10 9:36
Lesserlight
Member



Joined: 2010/9/19
Posts: 134


 Re:

Quote:
Hi Doug,

Jesus said, For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed [the righteousness] of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven. Matt 5:20


Surely Jesus became 'the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth' BECAUSE His righteousness exceeded the that of the scribes and Pharisees.




Good Morning Linn

Although the law was good it was weak through the flesh meaning that even when the Jews desired to follow the law they could not because the desires of the flesh overcame their desire to fulfill the law.

Unfortunately the word "law" is not as simple as something always being written in stone or on paper for us to read. Paul spoke of the "law of faith and the "law of sin" and these particular laws are not written on either paper or stone but are laws that are alive within us. They are "spiritual laws" that exist spiritually within us that produce actions in the natural that if described within the definitions of grammar are nouns that produce verbs in the image of the noun. The Bible calls these living nouns to be "principalities" and there are both good and evil principalities living within us.

Both the law of sin and the law of faith are subject to the law of the seed that is a law of God that simply stated says that each seed reproduces in its own image. Thus we see how the seed that is Christ in us brings forth works in the image of Christ. On the other hand the serpent seed (from the fall back in the Garden) begat the law of sin in man and is what makes the spirit of man unclean, brings forth the works of man that at best are not any better than being "filthy rags". Thus the law of sin is seen through acts (works) of sin that we may do while the law of faith is seen through acts (works) of faith that we may do.

Look at it this way....... Christ never sins so when a Christians sins it is not Christ in them that is committing the sin but is the spirit of man in them committing the sin. Whichever spirit is ruling the heart determines whether a person either sins or lives the righteousness of God that is way above the best that man can do. Consequently when a Christian sins it is because the "man of sin" is sitting in the temple of God". Unfortunately many of the fundamental churches today teach that the "man of sin" is an end time superman of sin sitting in a temple yet to be built in Jerusalem. (2The.2:2-4) when the truth is that the unclean spirit of man has returned to the heart and is ruling over the Christian instead of the Holy Spirit of Christ that should be ruling over them.

The righteousness of the Pharisees (who followed the law "religiously") could never fulfill all of the law but the Law of Faith in us that is the seed that is Christ in us fulfills all of the laws of God today just as it did when Jesus walked on the earth 2000 years ago...... This is why Paul said with the law of Faith he served God but with the law of sin he served the flesh (spirit of man).

Hopefully I have said that well enough so that it may be understood that even though you now have Christ the seed (Christ the Spirit) in you, the seed of man (the spirit of man) that has been in you since the day that you were conceived in your mother’s womb is still in you. Each spirit has its own mind thus James says for us not to be double minded and Jesus said that those who overcame as He overcame (by His Spirit ruling in your heart) would be given the gift of the morning star........ Jesus Christ is the morning star and is the fullness of Christ in you and not just the simple seed of Christ that you started with when you were first "saved".

That is the difference between being given the power (in the seed) to become a son of God (Jn.1:12) versus actually becoming a son of God (but with a small "s" in Ro.8:19)

How are we doing so far?

Blessings

Doug


 2011/1/10 10:03Profile
Christinyou
Member



Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3707
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 Re:

Matthew 6:9-10 After this manner therefore pray ye: Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name. Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven.
It does not say my free will be done. His will be done, not only in earth, but as in heaven. His will my salvation, wisdom, righteousness, sanctification and redemption. That about says it. His will for a new creature in Christ, my will to love Him and His commandments kept by His power that is now in me and by the Holy Spirit revelation of Christ who loved me and gave His life for me.

In Christ: Phillip


_________________
Phillip

 2011/1/10 11:34Profile
Christinyou
Member



Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3707
Ca.

 Re:

Quote: Not just The Bride but "I AM" as well ?

Not "I AM", but i am. Only by the Christ Seed that The Father has birthed in me. Without Him "I AM" nothing.

He is the only perfection I claim, He that is in me. That is why I still have the privilege of physical death, spiritual death to self and life unto God.

In Christ: Phillip


_________________
Phillip

 2011/1/10 11:41Profile





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