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 Re:

Quote:
"...as usual..."



Have we been on another thread together?

I answered on page 1 - I won't take this to another level - the level that the other thread went to - that I wasn't on - but my second post on page one answered you.

I still am praying for you to enjoy His Peace and His Love.

 2009/3/17 21:32









 Re:

Some Scriptures from Paul that were going through my mind yesterday - may seem like a lot here - but there are a lot more that maybe can post some other day.

I won't highlight or put any in bold print - I love Paul -

Phillipians 3:10 That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death;

11 If by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.

12 Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus.

13 Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before,

14 I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.

15 Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you.

16 Nevertheless, whereto we have already attained, let us walk by the same rule, let us mind the same thing.

17 Brethren, be followers together of me, and mark them which walk so as ye have us for an ensample.

18 (For many walk, of whom I have told you often, and now tell you even weeping, that they are the enemies of the cross of Christ:

19 Whose end is destruction, whose God is their belly, and whose glory is in their shame, who mind earthly things.)

________________________________________________

1 Corinthians 9:19 For though I be free from all men, yet have I made myself servant unto all, that I might gain the more.

20 And unto the Jews I became as a Jew, that I might gain the Jews; to them that are under the law, as under the law, that I might gain them that are under the law;

21 To them that are without law, as without law, (being not without law to God, but under the law to Christ,) that I might gain them that are without law.

22 To the weak became I as weak, that I might gain the weak: I am made all things to all men, that I might by all means save some.

23 And this I do for the gospel's sake, that I might be partaker thereof with you.

24 Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain.

25 And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible.

26 I therefore so run, not as uncertainly; so fight I, not as one that beateth the air:

27 But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.



Matthew 11:12

12And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent take it by force.

 2009/3/17 21:37









 Re:

One more try.

YES - Jesus' blood can be called "innocent & precious" but if by "divine" you mean that HE had more of an 'advantage' over us, in how HE walked before GOD in obedience - again I'd have to say no.

HE remains our Example by His life in every way.

Hebrews 2:16-17 - Hebrews 4-5 - Philippians 2:5-8



Romans 8:29

 2009/3/17 23:01









 Re:


[b]From Walter to Jesus-is-God:


My post consisted of the following Scripture.
“14. Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same;” Hebrews 2:14.

My explanation of the Scripture that was quoted:

You will notice that the “children” that is, the human children, are said to be partakers of flesh and blood, and then, speaking of Jesus, this verse says that He himself likewise took part of the same. The word “took part” as applying to Christ is an entirely different word from “partakers” as applied to the children. In the margin of my bible, I read that the word translated, “took part” implies “taking part in something outside one’s self.” The Greek word for partakers if KOYNONEHO and means “to share fully,” so that all of Adam’s children share fully in Adam’s flesh and blood. When we read that Jesus “took part of the same” the word METECHO which means “to take part but not all.” The children take both flesh and blood of Adam but Christ took only part, that is, the flesh part, whereas the blood was the result of supernatural conception.

Scripture further states that the Jesus Christ was made of the seed of David according to the FLESH , not the BLOOD. At no time does it mention His Blood, only His flesh.

1.Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God, 2. (Which he had promised afore by his prophets in the holy scriptures,) 3. CONCERNING HIS SON JESUS CHRIST OUR LORD, WHICH WAS MADE OF THE SEED OF DAVID ACCORDING TO THE FLESH; 4. And declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead: (Romans 1:1-7)

The Bible tells us that Jesus birth was a mystery. However, if we examine the Scripture, we can see that Christ’s flesh came from Mary, and Christ’s blood was supplied by God through the Holy Ghost at his conception.[/b]

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Jesus-is-God, your response to my post--about what type of blood flowed through Christ's veins, the blood of Adam, or the divine blood supplied by the Holy Ghost-- you posted the following (that is not supported by Scripture):

"Jesus is called the last Adam, because Adam was born "innocent - though with a freewill". Jesus also was born "innocent" [as the Lamb of GOD] because He was born of the Spirit but also with freewill.

He came to make a way out for us from what Adam had done. The mystery is not in the "blood" but in HIS Obedience, even to the Cross - as the Sacrificial Lamb. Yes, HE was/is GOD, but while in the flesh - HE took our form 100% and did not speak or work "without the Father, through the Spirit". He never acted on HIS own. He laid aside His Deity and again, became our example - of how to walk totally dependent on the Father - to teach us to not walk on our own.

The Blood type comes from 'both' mother and father. It is formed in "the marrow of the bones". That is why today, tests can be run to find both mother and father of a child - matching both - whereas in 1943 for Brother DeHann, this genetic testing was not available - though testing blood types was. But he should have known that the blood is formed in the marrow of the bones - which is from both parents.


The other important thing about the blood of Jesus, Who is to one Day sit on David’s throne (Luke 1:32-33), had He been begotten by Mary’s husband Joseph, who was of the line of Jeconiah (Matthew 1:12,16), it would have contradicted this divine prediction but the physical descent of Jesus from David came through Mary, whose genealogy is traced to David through Nathan rather than through Solomon (cp. Luke 3:31 with Matthew 1:17).

Jesus came through the line of Mary, so that He fulfilled the OT prophecies of coming from David’s blood line. If Jesus’ blood is “God’s blood”, then Jesus could not be the Messiah prophesied in the O.T., because He could not have fulfilled those prophecies.

Catholicism and others believe this Divine blood theory and others like it - such as "Claiming the blood" in spiritual warfare and other excesses."

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
[b]
Walter Continues:
In my previous post, I asked you to respond by Scripture, and you pointed me to what you posted previously. This is it, nothing more than words and opinions, nothing more than hot air if it is not supported, if it is NOT BASED ON SCRIPTURE.

Please sir, respond with Scripture that supports your position--- that the blood in the veins of Jesus Christ was the same kind of blood found in Adam, the man of original sin!

Sincerely,

Walter[/b]

Quote:

Jesus-is-GOD wrote:
Quote:
"...as usual..."



Have we been on another thread together?

I answered on page 1 - I won't take this to another level - the level that the other thread went to - that I wasn't on - but my second post on page one answered you.

I still am praying for you to enjoy His Peace and His Love.

 2009/3/18 0:17









 Re:

Hi Walter -

You left off part of my post from page 1




And it appears that you missed my post just above yours here - so I'll post it again here ...


by Jesus-is-GOD on 2009/3/17 20:01:03

One more try.

YES - Jesus' blood can be called "innocent & precious" but if by "divine" you mean that HE had more of an 'advantage' over us, in how HE walked before GOD in obedience - again I'd have to say no.

HE remains our Example by His life in every way.

Hebrews 2:16-17 - Hebrews 4-5 - Philippians 2:5-8



Romans 8:29


 2009/3/18 0:34
thomasm
Member



Joined: 2007/8/17
Posts: 116
Lloydminster, Alberta, Canada

 Re: Is Christ's Blood different than my blood?

The saying "Do not go beyond what is written"
There is nothing to disprove with scripture, because nothing was proved with the Four verses used in this article. Lev 17:14 Blood is the life, even my doctor knows that, and do not eat blood, one of the " it would be good to abstain from things from the Jerusalem council."
Heb 2:14 'Jesus became flesh" Still doesn't prove the article.
Matt 27:4 Jesus was innocent and yes His Blood was innocent, still doesn't prove the point.
Rom 5:8-9 A good salvation scripture, but still doesn't prove the point of the article.

Find scriptures that don't have to "go beyond what is written" that actually prove this theory and I will have something to respond to.

God bless you
In His Love tom


_________________
Tom weighill

 2009/3/18 1:25Profile
ChrisJD
Member



Joined: 2006/2/11
Posts: 2895
Philadelphia PA

 Re:

thomasm,

I think you make a good point here about not going beyond what is written.



About the passage in Matthew, I did a search and found that the phrase 'innocent blood' occurs 19 times in the KJV. Once, for instance, in 1Samuel 19:



"And Jonathan spoke good of David unto Saul his father, and said unto him, Let not the king sin against his servant, against David; because he hath not sinned against thee, and because his works [i]have been[/i] to thee-ward very good: For he did put his life in his hand, and slew the Philistine, and the LORD wrought a great salvation for all Israel: thou sawest it, and didst rejoice: wherefore then wilt thou sin against innocent blood, to slay David without a cause?"


- 1Samuel 19:4-5(KJV)




About the passage in Hebrews 2:14, unless I misunderstood it, Robertson's Word Pictures says in the entry for this passage, that 'metesche' is a "practical synonym" for 'koinōneō'.


_________________
Christopher Joel Dandrow

 2009/3/18 3:26Profile









 Re:

GOD Bless HIS Saints ~

This was very good today - posted by SermonIndex -

[url=https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=27963&forum=45&0]by Oswald Chambers[/url]

 2009/3/18 11:45









 Re:



[b]Walter’s response to Christ-is-God[/b]

The Word of God, the Bible, says something entirely different than your posted opinions, that are not supported by Scripture!

God has something entirely different to say in His Word, the Bible, than the conclusions you have made about the Blood of Jesus Christ.

[b]In Hebrews Chapter 9:20 we find the following:
20. Saying, This is the blood of the testament which God hath enjoined unto you.

Compare the words of Christ concerning the blood of the new covenant (Matthew 2:28) with those of Moses concerning the blood of the old covenant (Ex. 24:8)[/b]

[b]In Hebrews 9:22 we find[/b] : 22. And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission.
[b]without the shedding of blood[/b].

[b][color=000000] Many liberal Christians, who support the newer Bible versions, and a growing number of evangelicals, who also support the newer Bible versions, argue that references to “the shedding of blood” are merely metaphorical, the essential point being that a sacrificial death has occurred. Thus, they say, it was Christ’s death for our sins that was the redemption price for our salvation, not His blood-which, after all, was just a fluid, no different after being shed than before.The fact is, however, that there are many ways in which a man (or a sacrificial animal may die, but mere death is not enough.[/color][/b][b][color=FF0000] “The life of the flesh is in the blood’ (Lev 17:11) and ”without the shedding of blood is no remission”. No other type of death could purchase our salvation. Therefore, we have redemption through his blood” (Ep 1:7), He ”made peace through the blood” (Col 1:20), He “washed us from our sins in his own blood” (Rev 1:5, and we are now justified “through faith in his blood” (Romans 3:25)[/color][/b]

[b]Hebrews 9:22 (continued) is no remission[/b] [b][color=FF0000]Thus, without the shedding of Christ’s blood, there can be no salvation. It is conceivable that He could have died in other ways, but remission of our sins required not His death, but death through the shedding of His precious blood (1 Peter 1:19)[/color][/b]

Hebrews 9:24 For Christ is not entered into the holy places made with hands, which are the[b] figures of the true; [/b]but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us:

9:24 [b]figures of the true[/b] The wilderness tabernacle and the temple in Jerusalem were only “figures of the true” tabernacle. The latter is not only a structure in heaven, but in a sense is “heaven itself”

9:24 [b]now to appear[/b]
[b]There are three different “appearings” of Christ mentioned in Hebrews, using three different Greek words. Hebrews 9:26 speaks of the past appearing, when He appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of Himself,” Hebrews 9:28 speaks of His future appearing, when He shall “appear the second time without sin unto salvation.” His present appearance, however, in is “heaven itself,” where He “ever liveth to make intercession for them. (Hebrews 7:25)

9:28 bear[/b] [b][color=FF0000]“Bear here is the same word as “offer up’ in Hebrews 7:27. Christ not only bore the penalty of our sins on the cross, but also offered up His sacrificial blood to the Father as proof--contrast: (Heb 9:24-25). Israel’s high priest offered up the blood of animals as an atonement for sins. Our High Priest offered up Himself.[/color][/b]

9:28 [b]look for him[/b] To “look for Him” means to expectantly wait for Him, knowing that He might come at any time. There is nothing is the whole scope of prophesized events in the last days that must be fulfilled before He comes. Many of these events could happen before His return, but none[b] must [/b]happen. We should “look for Him” everyday and “love His appearing” (2 Ti 4:8)

10:5 [b] he saith[/b] Hebrews 10:5-7 (supplemented by another quotation in 10:8-10) is an interpretive quotation from Psalm 40:6-8 confirming that the Psalm 40 is an important messianic psalm, probably depicting the thoughts of Christ as He was hanging on the cross.

10:5 [b]a body[/b]. ‘Mine ears has thou opened” (Ps 40:6) is here translated as “a body hast thou prepared me”. The openings in the ear of an indentured servant (see Ex. 21:6) indicated the intent of that servant to serve his master forever, as it were, hearing onlyt the voice of his master and doing only his will. This was a type of Christ, who willingly became a bondservant (Ph 2:5-8), willing even to die in accord with His Father’s will. But before He could do this, He had to have a human body, with human ears.

10:5 [b]prepared me[/b] The word [b]prepared[/b] [b][color=FF0000]here (Greek Kataritzo) is the same word translated “framed” in Hebrews 11:3. That is, God formed the human body of His Son with the same mighty power and wisdom with which He had formed the universe. This can only mean that the body of Jesus, like that of Adam, was a special creation, not formed by the normal process of genetic inheritance.[/color][/b]

Heb 10:6 [b]sacrifices for sin[/b] Compare (Psalm 51:16-19) and (Micah 6:7-8)

10:7 [b]the book[/b] The book of God had been written in heaven long before it was transmitted to men on earth, and this certainly included God’s great plan of redemption. Note Psalm 119:89; 139:16; then also 1 Peter 1:18-20; Revelation 13:8

10:7 [b]thy will[/b] The Lord Jesus Christ frequently confirmed the fact that He had come into the world specifically to do the will of His Father (Jo 4:34; 5:30; 6:38)

10:12 [b]sat down[/b] The high priests in Israel could never be seated while ministering (10:11), for their work was never finished. They could only enter the most holy place once each year, but Christ sat down at God’s right hand after offering one sacrifice for sins forever.

10:13 [b]footstool[/b] this refers to the promise of Psalm 110:1 which also speaks of Christ as “of the order of Melchisedec.”

10:16 [b]saith the Lord[/b] Again citing Jeremiah 31:33-34.

10:17 [b]remember no more[/b] There is a remarkable illustration of this divine “loss of memory” in chapter 11 of Hebrews. It recounts the great works of faith of Noah, Abraham, Moses, David, Samson, and many others, but never mentions any of their sins. “As far as the east is from the west, so far hath he removed our transgressions from us” (Ps 103:12). See (Micah 7:19)

10:19 [b]boldness to enter[/b]. Because of what Christ has done for us, we can come boldly (certainly not ARROGANTLY or PRESUMPTOUSLY, however) into God’s presence in prayer (Hebrews 4:16) & (Ephesian 3:12) We can also have confidence (same Greek waod as “boldness”) in witnessing for Christ (Acts 4:29, 31).

Sincerely,

Walter
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Christ-is-God said:
Jesus is called the last Adam, because Adam was born "innocent - though with a freewill". Jesus also was born "innocent" [as the Lamb of GOD] because He was born of the Spirit but also with freewill.

He came to make a way out for us from what Adam had done. The mystery is not in the "blood" but in HIS Obedience, even to the Cross - as the Sacrificial Lamb. Yes, HE was/is GOD, but while in the flesh - HE took our form 100% and did not speak or work "without the Father, through the Spirit". He never acted on HIS own. He laid aside His Deity and again, became our example - of how to walk totally dependent on the Father - to teach us to not walk on our own.

The Blood type comes from 'both' mother and father. It is formed in "the marrow of the bones". That is why today, tests can be run to find both mother and father of a child - matching both - whereas in 1943 for Brother DeHann, this genetic testing was not available - though testing blood types was. But he should have known that the blood is formed in the marrow of the bones - which is from both parents.


The other important thing about the blood of Jesus, Who is to one Day sit on David’s throne (Luke 1:32-33), had He been begotten by Mary’s husband Joseph, who was of the line of Jeconiah (Matthew 1:12,16), it would have contradicted this divine prediction but the physical descent of Jesus from David came through Mary, whose genealogy is traced to David through Nathan rather than through Solomon (cp. Luke 3:31 with Matthew 1:17).

Jesus came through the line of Mary, so that He fulfilled the OT prophecies of coming from David’s blood line. If Jesus’ blood is “God’s blood”, then Jesus could not be the Messiah prophesied in the O.T., because He could not have fulfilled those prophecies.

Catholicism and others believe this Divine blood theory and others like it - such as "Claiming the blood" in spiritual warfare and other excesses.

These others may explain better & further -

http://www.spurgeon.org/~phil/articles/blood.htm

http://home.sprynet.com/~eagreen/blood.html

http://www.christinyou.net/pages/bloodofchrist.html


Romans 8:29

 2009/3/18 17:41









 Re:

Brother Walter, I LOVE Apologetics as much as the prophetic, but right off the bat I'm going to tell you that you have me all wrong and what I post all wrong.

I watched the "1 John 1:8" thread and felt 'that' should stay between you brothers.

I did notice your temper.

The "only" reason I came unto this thread was to expose the lie of the "Divine blood" heresy.

I do not see where you have exegeted [b]Hebrews 2:16,17[/b] - nonetheless Hebrews 4 & 5 nor the verse from Phillippians nor ANY that I've posted thus far.

You choose to believe in the "divine blood" theory because it gets you off the hook on obedience to HIS Example to "us"....
which was to stop all of our own thinking, planning, trying to follow HIM in our 'flesh', intellect, emotions and to "look up" as HE did --- Taking that Minute [or howeverlong] to ASK GOD for wisdom for "THIS" second --- walking "second by second" in Complete Dependence on God The Father - Through The Son - By HIS Spirit to guide, teach, lead and so forth - AS HE DID.
[again, not yelling but emphasis]


THAT has been my reply in every post since page one. I have no anger toward you at all and would love to continue to post with you but won't be able to.


Why is that so hard for you to see other's posts? I'm praying for you Brother. I call you Brother because I believe you are a Brother ... but just a Brother with an anger issue that needs to come under HIS control... by you surrendering your will to HIM or HIS.


I also am your SISTER.

Because I am a sister - I prefer not to get involved in certain threads - I don't "teach" - I "exhort" my fellow believers whenever possible to be Brave - Strong in HIM ALONE - and to be wholly and totally dependent on HIM as HE was on The Father, through His Spirit while here - setting that Example for us, in the flesh.

JESUS IS GOD !!!


THAT is our Foundation.

On that our futures stand - with 'that' understanding.

That Creator GOD was on that Cross dying for you.

That Creator GOD 'fully' took our form, to show us HOW to "look up to HIM" for Everything ... for as HE said .... "Without ME - YOU can Do NOTHING." ......... just as HE DID NOTHING without The Father by The Spirit, while here in the flesh, "fleshing it out", so to speak, [i]for "us".[/i]

Rather than teach Brother - maybe for now it wouldn't hurt if you were taught by other Brothers.

I can recommend that maybe we all - myself included always - to look at our Foundation - which is GOD - The Triune GODHEAD.

We "need" to start there - because if THAT Foundation is off - everything else that you or I try to build on any 'off' foundation will be 'off'.

Here's a reasonably good site for that - though there are many -

http://www.christinyou.net/pages/3divineonenesses.html


I will bow out of this conversation now, for three reasons. Number One - I am a female. [1 Timothy 2:12]
Number Two - [1 John about Love.]
Number Three - your temper scares me. [3 places in Proverbs.]


Again - I still am praying for you to enjoy His Peace and His Love.


Double Shalom with His Love to you from Him.

 2009/3/18 18:22





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