KrispyKrittr wrote:
The Lord really impressed upon me that the time has come to "shake the dust off"
Krispy

I'm referring to all those little buddy system clicks on SI that PM's each other their comments in between each of their posts, as though they were God's secret agents.

By evening we got the books and furniture adjusted; and I made up, in an open fireplace, a good fire, hoping to spend the evening alone. Just at dark Squire W, seeing that everything was adjusted, bade me goodnight and went to his home. I had accompanied him to the door; and as I closed the door and turned around, my heart seemed to be liquid within me. All my feelings seemed to rise and flow out; and the utterance of my heart was, "I want to pour my whole soul out to God." The rising of my soul was so great that I rushed into the room back of the front office, to pray.

There was no fire, and no light, in the room; nevertheless it appeared to me as if it were perfectly light. As I went in and shut the door after me, it seemed as if I met the Lord Jesus Christ face to face. It did not occur to me then, nor did it for some time afterward, that it was wholly a mental state. On the contrary it seemed to me that I saw Him as I would see any other man. He said nothing, but looked at me in such a manner as to break me right down at his feet. I have always since regarded this as a most remarkable state of mind; for it seemed to me a reality, that He stood before me, and I fell down at his feet and poured out my soul to Him. I wept aloud like a child, and made such confessions as I could with my choked utterance. It seemed to me that I bathed His feet with my tears; and yet I had no distinct impression that I touched Him, that I recollect.

I must have continued in this state for a good while; but my mind was too much absorbed with the interview to recollect anything that I said. But I know, as soon as my mind became calm enough to break off from the interview, I returned to the front office, and found that the fire that I had made of large wood was nearly burned out. But as I turned and was about to take a seat by the fire, I received a mighty baptism of the Holy Ghost. Without any expectation of it, without ever having the thought in my mind that there was any such thing for me, without any recollection that I had ever heard the thing mentioned by any person in the world, the Holy Spirit descended upon me in a manner that seemed to go through me, body and soul. [b]I could feel the impression, like a wave of electricity, going through and through me. Indeed it seemed to come in waves and waves of liquid love, for I could not express it in any other way.[/b] It seemed like the very breath of God. I can recollect distinctly that it seemed to fan me, like immense wings.

No words can express the wonderful love that was shed abroad in my heart. I wept aloud with joy and love; and I do not know but I should say, I literally bellowed out the unutterable gushings of my heart. These waves came over me, and over me, and over me, one after the other, until I recollect I cried out, "I shall die if these waves continue to pass over me." I said, "Lord, I cannot bear any more;" yet I had no fear of death.

How long I continued in this state, with this baptism continuing to roll over me and go through me, I do not know. But I know it was late in the evening when a member of my choir--for I was the leader of the choir--came into the office to see me. He was a member of the church. He found me in this state of loud weeping, and said to me, "Mr. Finney, what ails you?" I could make him no answer for some time. He then said, "Are you in pain?" I gathered myself up as best I could, and replied, "No, but so happy that I cannot live.

ccchhhrrriiisss wrote:
Hi David...

I've always enjoyed reading about the life of Charles Finney. I don't actually trust all of the books by Finney -- since he only wrote one with his own hand (his autobiographical [url=http://www.gospeltruth.net/1868Memoirs/memoirsindex.htm][i]Memoirs of Revival of Religion[/i][/url]). The quote that you mentioned comes from Chapter 2 of the book. There, Finney speaks about a “baptism of the Holy Spirit” that he felt on the evening of the first day that he truly came to Christ. The passage states:

Quote:

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By evening we got the books and furniture adjusted; and I made up, in an open fireplace, a good fire, hoping to spend the evening alone. Just at dark Squire W, seeing that everything was adjusted, bade me goodnight and went to his home. I had accompanied him to the door; and as I closed the door and turned around, my heart seemed to be liquid within me. All my feelings seemed to rise and flow out; and the utterance of my heart was, "I want to pour my whole soul out to God." The rising of my soul was so great that I rushed into the room back of the front office, to pray.

There was no fire, and no light, in the room; nevertheless it appeared to me as if it were perfectly light. As I went in and shut the door after me, it seemed as if I met the Lord Jesus Christ face to face. It did not occur to me then, nor did it for some time afterward, that it was wholly a mental state. On the contrary it seemed to me that I saw Him as I would see any other man. He said nothing, but looked at me in such a manner as to break me right down at his feet. I have always since regarded this as a most remarkable state of mind; for it seemed to me a reality, that He stood before me, and I fell down at his feet and poured out my soul to Him. I wept aloud like a child, and made such confessions as I could with my choked utterance. It seemed to me that I bathed His feet with my tears; and yet I had no distinct impression that I touched Him, that I recollect.

I must have continued in this state for a good while; but my mind was too much absorbed with the interview to recollect anything that I said. But I know, as soon as my mind became calm enough to break off from the interview, I returned to the front office, and found that the fire that I had made of large wood was nearly burned out. But as I turned and was about to take a seat by the fire, I received a mighty baptism of the Holy Ghost. Without any expectation of it, without ever having the thought in my mind that there was any such thing for me, without any recollection that I had ever heard the thing mentioned by any person in the world, the Holy Spirit descended upon me in a manner that seemed to go through me, body and soul. [b]I could feel the impression, like a wave of electricity, going through and through me. Indeed it seemed to come in waves and waves of liquid love, for I could not express it in any other way.[/b] It seemed like the very breath of God. I can recollect distinctly that it seemed to fan me, like immense wings.

No words can express the wonderful love that was shed abroad in my heart. I wept aloud with joy and love; and I do not know but I should say, I literally bellowed out the unutterable gushings of my heart. These waves came over me, and over me, and over me, one after the other, until I recollect I cried out, "I shall die if these waves continue to pass over me." I said, "Lord, I cannot bear any more;" yet I had no fear of death.

How long I continued in this state, with this baptism continuing to roll over me and go through me, I do not know. But I know it was late in the evening when a member of my choir--for I was the leader of the choir--came into the office to see me. He was a member of the church. He found me in this state of loud weeping, and said to me, "Mr. Finney, what ails you?" I could make him no answer for some time. He then said, "Are you in pain?" I gathered myself up as best I could, and replied, "No, but so happy that I cannot live.

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Notice that Finney did not mention that he spoke with tongues. Notice that he didn’t claim that he felt “drunk.” Up to that point, he had been a sinner (although he attended Church regularly and even led the choir). However, Finney did not equate this “baptism” with something as trivial and mind-altering as alcohol. In fact, if you remember correctly, it wasn’t the disciples who went about boasting about being “drunk” on the day of Pentecost. It was the people in Jerusalem (Acts 2:13). And why did they mock them and dismiss them as being drunk? Was it because they were rolling around on the floor while laughing because they felt “physical” drunkenness? Was it because they were staggering as they attempted to walk? Not at all! They were labeled as drunks simply because the crowd heard them speaking in their own tongues (Acts 2:5-12). This meeting didn’t resemble a Rodney Howard Browne meeting at all – yet it is what he alludes to when he preaches.

Let me make this clear: I am quite “pentecostal” in my beliefs. I believe in the gifts of the Spirit as contained within the Word of God. I do not believe that they "ceased" during the first century (as over the years, some have been eager to "explain"). I have received a baptism of the Holy Spirit that was evidenced by speaking in tongues. Yet I also believe that these things are not meant as a spectacle -- but as an equipping of the saints. In fact, I have seen some pretty amazing things during my life.

However, I’ve also witnessed quite a bit of counterfeit displays of what people attribute to the Holy Spirit. I’ve attended Benny Hinn meetings where people all around me fell to the ground, jumped up a moment later, and went on as if nothing eternal had happened. I once heard someone fall to the ground, get back up and discuss where they were going to eat between services and if they had time to watch a movie. I’ve always thought that, if God were to knock me down, the first thing to come out of my mouth would not be about dinner and a movie.

Long ago, I came to a conclusion that not everyone who speaks in tongues REALLY speaks in tongues. Not everyone who claims to feel “supernatural electricity” really feels supernatural electricity. And not everyone who gets “slain in the Spirit” really gets slain in the Spirit. I’ve spoken with many, many people who have admitted (after prodding them with my own experiences) that they weren’t really “slain in the spirit” – even though they fell down in the front of the congregation. Why did they do it? Some said that they were pushed down. Some said that they fell down because of “spiritual peer-pressure” (if that makes sense). Some said they did because they didn’t want to “fight God” and were “helping Him out.”

What am I saying? I don’t want to “throw out the baby with the bathwater.” However, I want to make sure that we aren’t putting the baby in a substance that is anything BUT water. God could easily knock people down (physically). He did it in John chapter 18. He did it to the priests during the Dedication of the Temple of Solomon (I Kings 8:11). But did such things resemble the fickle display of the “supernatural” that you see in many charismatic services?

Sadly, I feel that we often “chase the wind” through such things. In fact, people travel the country (and even the world) in search of something real. During the revival in Pensacola, people that I knew traveled there to “see” and “experience” what was going on. I asked a friend who went (you may know him, he is a missionary to Mexico from Rockport, Texas) what it was like. He told me, “Well, it wasn’t any better than the time I spend alone with God.” Ouch. Yet people waited in line for hours and hours. Now, I am NOT saying that the occurrence in Pensacola was not a legitimate move of God. In fact, I just don’t know enough about it to make any sort of judgment on the matter. Sometimes, things can “get out of hand” and “into the flesh” – even during a meeting where many are diligently seeking God. But such things make me wonder: What does it mean to be “touched” by God?

When God touches someone – they are changed. Remember Jacob? Jacob wrestled with the supernatural at Peniel (named by Jacob afterward, meaning “[i]the face of God[/i]”). After his little wrestling match, Jacob limped away with a wrenched hip (Genesis 32:22-31). And to think – all that he wanted was a “blessing.” But once God truly touches us, we cannot remain the same.

Isn’t this always the case? Can someone get “touched by God” and remain the same? Aren’t we challenged to continuously seek His face and do great things for the Lord? Then why is the Church – especially the Charismatic Church – in such a state of disarray? If God was truly touching these people as much as they claimed, wouldn’t things be different? Wouldn’t they be doing everything that they could to change this world? Yet many of them can fall down and get back up every Sunday or Wednesday. Out of physical discontent, many of them continue to look for the material blessing of “prosperity” instead of the spiritual discontent with the things of this world – where, like Abraham, we prefer the things that are eternal over the temporary blessings of this life.

I agree that the Lord still heals. But if Benny Hinn truly believed in his “gift,” then why doesn’t he visit hospitals? I believe that the dead can be raised. But if David Hogan really believes that he has raised over 500 people from the dead, then why doesn’t he visit the morgue? If people truly believe that they can prophesy, then why don’t they visit the sinner with such supernatural words of knowledge. Instead, the modern Charismatic Church prefers to display such things on the stages of fancy Church buildings and crowded convention centers that are mostly filled with fellow Charismatic believers.

Indeed, God can (and still does) perform the miraculous. I have seen things with my own eyes that are almost unbelievable to many. But the Lord didn’t do such things to build up the name of a Church, a ministry, or a man. He did such things because of His great love for mankind – and His desire to draw all men unto Himself.

When I visited a set of Rodney Howard Browne meetings at the Bayfront Plaza Hotel in Corpus Christi as a teenager, I was amazed at the spectacle that I witnessed. It was one of the first times that I ever wanted to leave a meeting because I was so troubled in my spirit. I was a young believer – but I knew that something wasn’t right (even though the Church that I attended was beginning to dabble in that sort of thing). When our group left the meetings, I noticed that there was a bar on the floor below the meeting hall. Those patrons were unmoved and unaffected by the supposedly “supernatural” events going on upstairs – even though the doors were open and they could hear everything. This is a stark contrast with the events on the day of Pentecost.

We really need a move of God. We truly need a revival in our land. But will it be a revival that resembles the meetings that we witness in which people walk around like they are in a physically drunken stupor? Or will it be a revival of the knowledge that men and women everywhere need a relationship with the Creator of all things?

This world is growing increasingly dark. Sin is becoming increasingly “tolerated” and even promoted by leaders in government. Abortion – the slaughter of defenseless, unborn children – is applauded by the same people who campaign for the protection of animals and trees. People are slowly losing their belief in the God of the Bible. Muslims now outnumber those who claim to be Christians. In fact, over 83% of the world doesn’t claim to believe in Christ. Out of those 17% who do, nearly half of them follow the doctrines of Rome. Many more are involved in “Christian” cults (like the Mormons). And even those who follow more truly sound persuasions spend their times arguing about petty differences in doctrinal views. All the while, two people die every single second and face a horrendous eternity with Jesus!

We really need a revival in this world! Like Keith Green used to say, “[i]This generation of believers is responsible for this generation of souls.[/i]” That means we have a great responsibility upon our shoulders. What are we to do? Are we to simply give them the same charismatic junk food that we watch on television which slowly clogs the arteries of sincere believers around the world? Or are we supposed to give something REAL – with great substance? May God help us – revive us – to fall upon our faces in pure communication before Him! May he teach us how to become His people upon this Earth!

The end is near. Even if we have a hundred years for which we can spread the truth of Jesus Christ -- would it be enough? Over five of the six billon people on Earth do not even claim to believe in Jesus. And out of that billion that do, how many truly meet with Him in prayer? This should shake us to our bones! This world is doomed, yet we continue to eat, drink and be merry in our own little Christian worlds. Do we not tremble before God because of these things? I wonder: Will we be held responsible for those "talents" (truths?) that we buried and kept from the world?

May the Lord revive us that we might sound the alarm to the rest of the world!

:-(

EDIT*
- Let me add that I admire your heard and passion for Jesus, dear brother! While we might not agree totally on all things, I believe that it is apparent that your heart truly seeks after the things of God. I think that this is true of most of us here. Why would we even be spending time at a website dedicated to true Biblical revival and truth if we were not seeking it for ourselves? The Lord bless you mightily!

KrispyKrittr wrote:

Quote:

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I'm referring to all those little buddy system clicks on SI that PM's each other their comments in between each of their posts, as though they were God's secret agents.

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If this is in reference to the "confirmations" I received via PM's... I assure you that the PM's I received were not about David, but about the author of the PM being concerned that [b][size=small][color=CC0000]I[/color][/size][/b] was in danger of moving out of a spirit of concern for a brother, and moving into a spirit of self... and argument... etc.

It was about ME...

I hardly ever PM. I get PM's, but they are usually words of encouragement, or a question someone has about something I've written about. I think some folks here are [b]paranoid[/b] about PM's... afraid people are talking about them behind their backs. I think thats silly, personally. Maybe it does happen, but I hardly think it happens as much as some people think.

Everyone should know, if I have something to say to you... I'll tell it to your face. I have no fear in doing that.

:-)

Krispy

psalm1 wrote:
Quote;
"We really need a move of God. We truly need a revival in our land. But will it be a revival that resembles the meetings that we witness in which people walk around like they are in a physically drunken stupor? Or will it be a revival of the knowledge that men and women everywhere need a relationship with the Creator of all things? "


I will anxiously await the true revival that EVERYONE on SI anticipates.
The Holy Spirit now has a "heads up" as to what it will look like.
As we watch the videos of the true revival with absolutely no emotion and no fleshly displays of those charismaniacs. I'm sure we will be inspired by the earnestness of the faces in the crowd as they sit lifelessly and orderly knowing that any emotion they may feel will have to be controlled fearing a false manifestation.



Does this mean I am really seeing revival break out in dead churches but we just haven't discerned it yet?

David

psalm1 wrote:
Does this mean I am really seeing revival break out in dead churches but we just haven't discerned it yet?