and you know you received Gods grace when

Rom 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you, for you are not under law but under grace.


so in that sense wrong is put right here on earth

_________________
CHRISTIAN

here wigglesworth brings an excellent word ;


"There is healing through the blood of Christ and deliverance for every captive. God never intended His children to live in misery because of some affliction that comes directly from the devil. A perfect atonement was made at Calvary. I believe that Jesus bore my sins, and I am free from them all. I am justified from all things if I dare believe. He Himself took our infirmities and bare our sicknesses; and if I dare believe, I can be healed.

See this poor, helpless man at the pool. "Wilt thou be made whole?" But there is a difficulty in the way. The man has one eye on the pool and one on Jesus. There are many people getting cross-eyed this way these days; they have one eye on the doctor and one on Jesus. If you will only look to Christ and put both your eyes on Him you can be made every whit whole, spirit, soul and body. It is the word of the living God that they that believe should be justified, made free from all things. And whom the Son sets free is free indeed.

You say, "Oh, if I only could believe!" He understands. Jesus knew he had been a long time in that case. He is full of compassion. He knows that kidney trouble, He knows those corns, He knows that neuralgia. There is nothing He does not know. He only wants a chance to show Himself merciful and gracious to you. But He wants to encourage you to believe Him. If thou canst only believe, thou canst be saved and healed. Dare to believe that Jesus was wounded for your transgressions, was bruised for your iniquities, was chastised that you might have peace, and that by His stripes there is healing for you right here and now. You have failed because you have not believed Him. Cry out to Him even now, "Lord, I believe, help Thou mine unbelief."



David

Romans 6: 22But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life.

Romans 8
1There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

2For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

3For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

4That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

5For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.

6For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.

7Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

8So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

9But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

10And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.

11But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.

12Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh.

13For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.

14For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

15For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.

16The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:

17And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

18For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us.

19For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God.

20For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope,

21Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.

22For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now.

23And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.

24For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for?

25But if we hope for that we see not, then do we with patience wait for it.

26Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.

27And he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God.

28And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.

29For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

30Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

31What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?

32He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not with him also freely give us all things?

33Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

34Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

35Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?

36As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are accounted as sheep for the slaughter.

37Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.

38For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,

39Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.


Nothing...not even our bad health, poor eye sight, balding heads.

Our FRUIT unto God is Holiness...not healthyness.

Romans 6: 22But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life.


Thank you Jesus we are saved BY GRACE through faith, and not by faith through Grace.

Thank you this FREE GIFT that I cannot EARN, but ONLY RECEIVE.

Katy

Katy;

I dont know why the salvation issue??????

Salvation is not my or your idea of doctrinal purity!!!

Salvation is a person....JESUS.


JESUS is salvation
Jesus is healing
Jesus is the resurrection.

20Whither the forerunner is for us entered, even Jesus, made an high priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.




Jesus is our high priest .....OFFICE

Jesus does things besides save people

THESE ARE PRIESTLY DUTIES

Why are you continually laying foundation??


Notice believers ministry..............

" 1Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,

2Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.

3And this will we do, if God permit.

4For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,

5And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,

6If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

7For the earth which drinketh in the rain that cometh oft upon it, and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receiveth blessing from God:

8But that which beareth thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned.

9But, beloved, we are persuaded better things of you, and things that accompany salvation, though we thus speak.

10For God is not unrighteous to forget your work and labour of love, which ye have shewed toward his name, in that ye have ministered to the saints, and do minister.


Foundation has purpose,but if you return to the jobsite and the workers are on their eighth foudation?????

No building!!!



David

This article was taken from "scotwise"


What an amazing man of God Smith Wigglesworth was, he never read a book or a newspaper, only the Bible! He diligently applied what he read to his ministry which lasted almost seventy years. Many people came to Christ through his preaching and many were healed and set free from bondage!

Many Christians today, pride themselves on their vast knowledge of theology and never do anything with it, except maybe to write a book in agreement or disagreement with other theologians, and discounting the miracle working power of the Holy Spirit.
Smith Wigglesworth took the word of God seriously, he studied the word diligently, day and night, not to argue or debate what man would say, but to put into practice by faith, what the word of God instructs us to do, and especially the commands of Christ Jesus...
scotwise


David

Another article;


Smith's ministry was characterised by his unwavering faith in God. He was able to believe for the impossible, and yet his one main concern was that God should always get the glory and not himself. His humility was a genuine concern for not stealing that which belonged to his heavenly father. Among the many stories that are recounted about his life, including people being raised from the dead, deaf ears being opened and captives being set free, there is one story that has captivated the heart and mind of many a Christian. This story is recounted below.

Surely one of the most remarkable cases of a miracle was when Smith was staying at the home of a curate of the Church of England. The man with whom he was staying had no legs. Smith suddenly said to the man, " Go and buy a new pair of shoes in the morning." A most astounding thing to say to someone with no legs. No doubt thinking Smith was totally insane the curate retired to bed, and then the Lord spoke to him saying " Do as my servant hath said."
The curate rose early the next morning and was waiting at the shoe store when the manage arrived to open up. Upon entering the store he was approached by the assistant who asked if he could help him. The curate replied he would like a pair of shoes. The assistant realising the condition of the man hesitated, before replying that they could not help him, obviously referring to his condition...
The curate seeing his dilemma said: " I would like a pair of black shoes, size eight please." The assistant returned with the shoes and as he put his one stump into the shoe a foot and leg instantly formed. The same thing happened with his other leg.Smith was not surprised and his comment was that with God there is no difference between healing a broken limb and forming a new limb.
scotwise



David

David, you said:

Does anyone remember this song?

O God of burning, cleansing flame, Send the fire

Your blood - bought gift today we claim, Send the fire today

God of Elijah, hear our cry, Send the fire

And make us fit to live or die, send the fire today

To burn up every trace of sin, to bring the light and glory in

The revolution now begins, Send the fire today

It's fire we want, for fire we plead, Send the fire

The fire will meet our every need, Send the fire today

Give us strength to always do what's right,

And grace to conquer in the fight

for power to walk this world in white, Send the fire today

Look down and see this waiting host

And send the promised Holy Ghost

We need another Pentecost, Send the fire today

To make our weak hearts strong and brave, Send the fire

To live a dying world to save, Send the fire

Lord, we're here tonight and we're on Your alter, Send the fire

We give our lives to You today, Send the fire

Send the fire today!

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++



David

Part 2

By His Stripes Are We Healed?

There is a popular teaching today, especially amongst Pentecostals and Charismatics, that Christ on the cross took upon Himself all our diseases and, subsequently, all physically afflicted believers, through the exercise of personal faith in this "truth," may realize a divine healing. However, what must be honestly and seriously considered is if this teaching is Biblically based or not.


"All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for TEACHING, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work" (Tim. 3:16-17).

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Does Scripture support the doctrine that at the cross Christ took upon Himself our diseases to the effect that if a Christian conjures up enough faith or the right faith-formula the reality of Christ's work on the cross will be invoked and he will be healed of physical afflictions? Let's take a look:
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The Scriptural basis for this doctrine is the well known Isaiah chapter 53, verse four:

4 "Surely our griefs (or, sickness) He Himself bore, and our sorrows (or, pain) He carried; yet we ourselves esteemed Him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted.
An Apostolic Teaching?
Interestingly, only Matthew references Isa. 53:4 and it is important to recognize that he applies it not to Christ's suffering and atoning death on the cross, but only to His healing ministry to national Israel (see Matt. 8:17).

Isaiah 53 starts out by describing One who was to grow up before God like a tender shoot, not stately or attractive, despised and forsaken, a man of sorrows (pains) and acquainted with grief (sickness). Still describing this One he goes on to say in verse four, "surely our griefs (sicknesses, with which this One was acquainted) He Himself bore."

Matthew, when referencing verse four, employs the Greek word "bastazo" for "bore." It means to carry as a burden, such as to bear one another's burdens. And so Matthew is saying that Jesus, according to His mercy and the power of God, being acquainted with Israel's sicknesses, and as their Messiah (see Lk. 7:18-23), healed their sick and demon-possessed (Matt. 8:16-17). No mention of this being a work of atonement on Christ's cross.


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Biblical Facts:
1. None of the N.T. writers reference Isa. 53:4 to the atoning work of Christ on the cross.
2. Luke does not reference Isa. 53:4 as being fulfilled when Paul healed many Gentiles on his missionary journeys.

3. None of the writers of the New Testament Epistles teach the doctrine that Christ took upon Himself our diseases on the cross and, subsequently, based on this act, by faith, we may claim physical healings.


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Isaiah's Suffering Servant

Isaiah does not address the DEATH of the suffering Servant until verse five:

5 "But He was pierced through for our transgressions, He was crushed for our iniquities; the chastening for our well-being fell upon Him, and by His scourging we are healed."
Here Isaiah states that He was pierced through "for our transgressions" and "crushed for our iniquities."
"But the Lord has caused the iniquity of us all to fall on Him" (vs.6b)
This is atonement language. It is dealing with transgressions and iniquities. Disease is not the issue nor is it mentioned.
A Guilt Offering


"But the Lord was pleased to crush Him, putting Him to grief; if He would render Himself a guilt offering." (vs. 10a)
A "guilt offering" has to do with sins, not disease. Unlike sin, disease is not a moral issue between man and God requiring the death of His Son.

"Yet He Himself bore the sin of many, and interceded for the transgressors" (vs. 12b).
The sacrificial death of Christ dealt with man's sins. "For the wages of sin is death." Some may acquire disease because of a sinful lifestyle, however, it is sin that separates man from God, not disease:
"For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God" (Rom. 3:23).
"But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were yet sinners (not diseased ones), Christ died for us" (Rom. 5:8).

Scripture reveals it was reconciliation with God that was provided for the sinner through Christ's work on the cross:
"But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from the wrath of God through Him. For if while we were enemies, we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more, having been reconciled we shall be saved by His life" (Rom. 5:8-10).
It is sin that made Adam's posterity "ungodly" - not disease. His shed blood justifies the ungodly through faith and guarantees our safekeeping from the future wrath of God.
The Consequence...Not The Cause

Disease is a consequence of man's fall in the Garden, however, nowhere is it Biblically taught that man's diseases were atoned for through the death and shed blood of Jesus Christ. His death and shed blood were to adjudicate the moral issue centered around man's sinful state acquired through Adam and the individual's personal sins.

"..and He Himself bore our sins (not diseases) in His body on the cross, that we might die to sin and live to righteousness; for by His stripes we are healed" (1 Pet. 2:24).
Notice Peter references "by His stripes we are healed" to "sin" and the believer subsequently living to righteousness. According to Scripture, physical healings are not based on the sacrifice of Christ on the cross, but on the power/will of God according to His grace/mercy. That is why when sinners believe in Christ they are, at that time, pardoned forever of sins but are not instantly healed of all diseases.
Miraculous healings and other miracles attested to the veracity of the Apostolic message after the ascension of Christ, but the Apostolic message never taught Christ bore our diseases on the cross.

Muddy the Waters

A popular talk radio host, Hank Hanegraaff, often repeats an adage that "healing was in the atonement but not guaranteed." Two immediate problems that arise from his cliche are (1) by that statement, though Mr. Hanegraaff does not teach that Christ bore or diseases on the cross, nevertheless, he agrees with the erroneous notion that disease is a moral obstacle between God and man requiring the blood sacrifice of Christ which, as shown above, has absolutely no Biblical support; and (2) if one may suggest that healing is "in the atonement" but "not guaranteed," then why couldn't one just as easily claim forgiveness of sins is in the atonement but not guaranteed?

Probably Mr. Hanegraaff is suggesting that because of the atonement of Christ God will eventually bring in the eternal state of righteousness where sickness and disease will not exist. This is true. However the absence of physical infirmities in the eternal state is not because "healing was in the atonement," but because those reconciled to God and redeemed from sin through faith in Christ and His finished work on the cross on their behalf will then be existing in their glorified bodies. A gracious, creative act of God, not a "healing" act of God based on Christ's atoning blood sacrifice for diseases.

Lastly it should be pointed out that all of Christ's healings were accomplished before He went to the cross. It is never taught or even suggested in Scripture that Christ was morally righteous to heal Israel's physical afflictions because the cross was anticipated. He never said to those whom He healed, "your disease has been atoned for." Nor should we!

Written by: Gary Nystrom

Katy-did,