| Poster | Thread | psalm1
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Joined: 2007/1/30
Posts: 1230
| | Re: | | a healing testimony;
Wiggleswworth;
"At a meeting I was holding, the Lord was working and many were being healed. A man saw what was taking place and remarked, "I'd like to try this thing." He came up for prayer and told me that his body was broken in two places. I laid my hands on him in the name of the Lord, and said to him, "Now, you believe God." The next night he was at meeting and he got up like a lion. He said, "I want to tell you people that this man here is deceiving you. He laid his hands on me last night for rupture in two places, but I'm not a bit better." I stopped him and said, "You are healed, your trouble is that you won't believe it."
He was at meeting the next night and when there was opportunity for testimony this man arose. He said, "I'm a mason by trade. Today I was working with a laborer and he had to put a big stone in place. I helped him and did not feel any pain. I said to myself, `How have I done it?' I went away to a place where I could strip, and found that I was healed." I told the people, "Last night this man was against the Word of God, but now he believes it. It is true that these signs shall follow them that believe, they shall lay hands on the sick and they shall recover. And all through the power that is in the name of Christ." It is the Spirit who has come to reveal the Word of God, and to make it spirit and life to us.
Amen!!
David
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|  2008/4/2 22:37 | Profile |
| | Re: Judging . . . | | [img]http://www.gospeljohn.com/images/judging1.jpg[/img]
Quote:
Don't you ever Judge me or anyone again!!!!! Katy
[u][b]Judge Not Lest Ye Be Judged![/b][/u]
by John Duncan
The most misquoted verse in the Bible is probably Matthew 7:1, "Judge not that ye be not judged." We hear this verse multiple times a day. At Troy State University in Alabama, a professor we met even said that it was one of the Ten Commandments. Too often we have heard sincere, misinformed Christians and unbelievers alike say, "I dont want to judge anybody, but..." Ironically, the one who screams "judge not" is often the one passing judgment on you!
Lets See What the Bible Really Says About Judging:
"The mouth of the righteous speaketh wisdom, and his tongue talketh of judgment." (Psa 37:30)
"With my lips have I declared all the judgments of thy mouth." (Psa 119:13)
"Open thy mouth, judge righteously, and plead the cause of the poor and needy." (Prov 31:9)
Jesus commended Simon, "Thou hast rightly judged." (Luke 7:43)
"Now, thou son of man, wilt thou judge, wilt thou judge the bloody city? yea, thou shalt show her all her abominations." (Ezek 22:2)
"But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man." (1 Cor 2:15)
"Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters?" (1 Cor 6:2)
"Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?" (1 Cor 6:3)
There are many other passages and verses in the Bible about judging. While God is our ultimate Judge, He has also commanded us to judge according to the Word of God.
According to the Websters Dictionary, to judge means "to discern, to distinguish, to form an opinion, to compare facts or ideas, and perceive their agreement or disagreement, and thus to distinguish truth from falsehood." Therefore, when you say that your neighbor is a "good person," you are passing a judgment (forming an opinion) just as much as when you say that the thief is a "bad person."
If there were no judgment...
All the prisons would be empty and thieves, serial killers, drug dealers, rapists, and murderers would be loose in your neighborhood.
You could not discipline your children and teach them not to steal, lie, do drugs, or give in to peer pressure.
School could not be mandated (by parents or govt) but if children did attend, they could not be evaluated as to their progress. Everyone should graduate regardless of their advance. Students could not be graded or disciplined.
You could not judge any false doctrine and would have to allow it to be taught from your churchs pulpit ("discerning" is the same thing as "judging").
You should leave your children with anyone who said was qualified to be a baby-sitter. You should not bother to check his/her background. Later, you should not be upset if this baby-sitter turned out to be a child-molester, because "thou shalt not judge."
You should marry anyone that asked. You shouldnt worry about his/her character or beliefs. What if he beats you up? What if she runs around on you? You shouldnt get so mad because "thou shalt not judge."
Hopefully you can see the folly of such silly doctrine by now. The devil has been successful to push the church further and further into a corner, while everyone else comes out of the closet with their sins. Most often, those who tell you "not to judge" them do so because they are either hiding something or want to continue doing it without reaping negative effects for it. In the campuses where we have been, students say that we shouldnt judge (form an opinion of) fornicators, drunkards, liars, homosexuals, or the like. However, they fail to realize that sin harms them and their neighbors. A caring, loving Christian will judge all situations according to the Word of God and call sinners to repentance.
The church has become intimidated by the opinions of the world as they scream, "You religious bigots, hatemongers, and intolerant people (which are judgments in themselves), do not judge me!" However, God clearly commands us to judge so we wont be deceived. Why would the command to judge be so vehemently attacked in society? Obviously, if the church stops judging and using our common sense, we will no longer be able to distinguish good from evil, we will buy into the politically correct idea of moral relativism (whats good for you may not be good for me), and we will bow down to the devils wishes to deceive us, our family, and our friends.
Even more disturbing is to see church leadership saying, "do not judge." Many pastors lead their sheep astray and keep them under their manipulative control by telling them that they have a "critical spirit," they are "prideful," or "judgemental," while all they are trying to do is to discern the truth. If you find yourself in such a church, FLEE for your (spiritual) life!
Now lets take a look at the famous verse that is so misquoted today and put it in its PROPER context. If we are intellectually honest when looking at this passage, we will find that it is actually teaching us to judge, not to refrain from judging! We have inserted a few comments in brackets.
Mat 7:1-5 "Judge not, that ye be not judged [do not judge others if you do not want to be judged by others; everyone will be judged by God]. For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again [if you judge others, they will judge you by the same measures]. And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye? Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye [how can you judge someone when you are guilty of the sin yourself]? Thou hypocrite [this is the audience in the context; a hypocrite is one who is not living what he is preaching], first cast out the beam out of thine own eye [FIRST judge yourself and get your own life cleaned up]; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye [THEN after you get your life straight, you will be able to discern clearly and you are commanded to help clean your brothers eye!].
Other misquoted Scriptures:
Romans 14:3-10. This is about dietary preferences, things that are not essential to salvation.
Romans 2:1-3. We have the same scenario of Mat. 7. We should not judge others if we are guilty of the same things. We must first clean up our own lives through repentance and faith, then we are qualified to judge others.
James 4:11 says that we are not to speak evil of other "brethren" -- those who are obediently doing the will of God (Mat 12:50). This does not apply to those living in willful sin.
How Are We to Judge?
1. We are to judge righteously. Jesus commands in John 7:24, "Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment."
Judge by the Word of God and Its principles, not by someones skin color, whether they are tall or short (inherited physical traits), etc.
2. We are to judge without hypocrisy. "And thinkest thou this, O man, that judgest them which do such things, and doest the same, that thou shalt escape the judgment of God?" (Rom 2:3)
Judge yourself first to see if you are guilty of that sin. Live what you preach. Only after you get your life cleaned up by turning from your sins and receiving pardon through repentance and faith in Jesus (i.e. you get saved) you can go and help others to be saved too. |
| | 2008/4/3 0:43 | |
| | Re: | |
Added for content:
Julian...I added this quote from your article:
I agree:
Quote:
Even more disturbing is to see church leadership saying, "do not judge." Many pastors lead their sheep astray and keep them under their manipulative control by telling them that they have a "critical spirit," they are "prideful," or "judgemental," while all they are trying to do is to discern the truth. If you find yourself in such a church, FLEE for your (spiritual) life!
This is EXACTLY what you did to me! Almost the exact words out of your mouth!
What we judge is sound doctrine.
Why Doctrine Matters
By R. Albert Mohler, Jr.
Tue, Sep. 18 2007
The 20th century witnessed an increasingly energetic revolt against doctrine. A denial of specific formulations of classical Christian doctrine has been evident in some quarters, while others have rejected the very notion of doctrine itself.
Enlarge this Image Doctrine has even fallen on hard times even among those who call themselves evangelicals. Some evangelical historians now argue that the defining principles of evangelical identity are not specifically theological at least beyond the most general affirmations. If true, that judgment would be a disgrace to any people of God. As it is, however, evangelicals have a proud doctrinal heritage and have historically given careful attention to confessions of faith and doctrinal issues.
Doctrine is, quite literally, the teaching of the churchwhat the church understands to be the substance of its faith. It is no substitute for personal experience. Evangelical Christians have given clear witness to the necessity of personal faith in Jesus Christ, but that personal faith is based in some specific understanding of who Jesus Christ is and what He accomplished on the cross. After all, we do not call persons to profess faith in faith, but faith in Christ.
There is no Christianity "in general." Faith in some experience devoid of theological or biblical contentno matter how powerfulis not New Testament Christianity. Those called to Christianity in general may believe nothing in particular. But faith resides in particulars.
Some churches seem to think that doctrine is a concern for those of a certain intellectual bent, but unnecessary for most Christians. Interest in doctrine amounts to something like an intellectual hobby. Others steer clear of doctrine for fear of argument or division in the church. Both factors indicate a lack of respect for the Christian believer and an abdication of the teaching function of the church.
Those who sow disdain and disinterest in biblical doctrine will reap a harvest of rootless and fruitless Christians. Doctrine is not a challenge to experiential religion; it testifies to the content of that experience. The church is charged to call persons to Christ and to root them in a mature knowledge of Christian faith.
Sociologists and historians observing the American church scene indicate that one of the first signs of denominational decline is a lessening of doctrinal attention. Many mainline Protestant denominations have followed this course, with a weakening concern for biblical doctrine followed by decline in membership and evangelistic outreach.
Yet, evangelicals should not recapture a healthy concern for biblical doctrine merely as a means of avoiding organizational or congregational decline. We must do so because nothing less is worthy of a New Testament people. The essential issue for the church is faithfulness.
Churches lacking an intentional and effective program of doctrinal instruction risk becoming the company of the confused. Charles Spurgeon told the painful story of the Irishman who attended a sectarian religious society meeting. Telling of the meeting, the man recounted: "Oh, it was lovely: none of us knew anything and we all taught each other."
American evangelicals must curb the decline of doctrinal concern in our midst and recapture the teaching responsibility of the church. Doctrine without piety is dead, but piety without doctrine is immature at best, and inauthentic at worst. Faithful Christians are always concerned with the development of true Christian piety and discipleship in believers. Yet, as John A. Broadus commented over a century ago, doctrinal truth is "the lifeblood of piety."
Those who call for a "doctrineless Christianity" misunderstandor misrepresentboth doctrine and Christianity. Pragmatism and program concerns dominate the lives of many Christians and their congregations. The low state of doctrinal understanding among so many evangelicals is evidence of a profound failure of both nerve and conviction. Both must be recovered if there is to be anything even remotely evangelical about the evangelicalism of the future.
This article was originally published on Monday, December 1, 2003, and is reprinted here by request of readers.
________________________________________________
Quote:
Even more disturbing is to see church leadership saying, "do not judge." Many pastors lead their sheep astray and keep them under their manipulative control by telling them that they have a "critical spirit," they are "prideful," or "judgemental," while all they are trying to do is to discern the truth. If you find yourself in such a church, FLEE for your (spiritual) life!
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| | 2008/4/3 8:28 | | psalm1
Member
Joined: 2007/1/30
Posts: 1230
| | Re: | | Wigglesworth was strong on devotion ,prayer and the word;
Bible Reading-Acts 6.
In the days when the number of disciples began to be multiplied there developed a situation which caused the twelve to make a definite decision not to occupy themselves with serving tables, but to give themselves continually to prayer and to the ministry of the Word. How important it is for all God's ministers to be continually in prayer, and constantly feeding on the Scriptures of Truth. I often offer a reward to anyone who can catch me anywhere without my Bible or my Testament.
None of you can be strong in God unless you are diligently and constantly hearkening to what God has to say to you through His Word. You cannot know the power and the nature of God unless you partake of His inbreathed Word. Read it at morn and at night, and at every opportunity you get. After every meal, instead of indulging in unprofitable conversation round the table, read a chapter from the Word and then have a season of prayer. I endeavor to make a point of doing this no matter where or with whom I am staying.
David |
| | 2008/4/3 9:28 | Profile | psalm1
Member
Joined: 2007/1/30
Posts: 1230
| | Re: | | Wigglesworth on Gods word, the Holy Spirit, and the destiny of the believer;
The Psalmist said that he had hid God's Word in his heart, that he might not sin against Him; and you will find that the more of God's Word you hide in your heart, the easier it is to live a holy life. He also testified that God's Word would quickened him; and, as you receive God's Word into your being, your whole physical being will be quickened and you will be made strong. As you receive with meekness the Word, you will find faith upspringing within. And you will have life through the Word.
The twelve told the rest to sepatate out seven men to look after the business end of things. They were to be men of honest report and filled with the Holy Ghost. These were just ordinary men who were chosen, but they were filled with the Holy Spirit, and this infilling always lifts a man to a plane above the ordinary. It does not take a cultured or a learned man to fill a position in God's church; what God requires is a yielded, consecrated, holy life, and He can make of such a flame of fire. Baptized with the Holy Ghost and fire!
The multitude chose out seven men to serve tables. They were doubtless faithful in their appointed tasks, but we see that God soon had a better choice for two of them. Philip was so full of the Holy Ghost that he could have a revival wherever God put him down. Man chose him to serve tables, but God chose him to win souls. O, if I could only stir you up to see that as you are faithful in performing the humblest office, God can fill you with His Spirit and make you a chosen vessel for Himself, and promote you to a place of mighty ministry in the salvation of souls and in the healing of the sick. There is nothing impossible to a man filled with the Holy Ghost. It is beyond all human comprehension. When you are filled with the power of the Holy Ghost, God will wonderfully work wherever you go.
David
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| | 2008/4/3 9:37 | Profile | psalm1
Member
Joined: 2007/1/30
Posts: 1230
| | Re: | | Thank you Jesus for the Holy Spirit , a million thanks for all you have done for us!!!
Words cannot express your beauty and loveliness.
David |
| | 2008/4/3 9:49 | Profile | psalm1
Member
Joined: 2007/1/30
Posts: 1230
| | Re: | | the flowers are blooming in my area. They are everywhere.
They reach as high as they can lifting up their beauty to the heavens to adore their creator.
All creation worships you Jesus.
David |
| | 2008/4/3 9:54 | Profile |
| | Re: Was Wigglesworth serious? | |
Hi David... You started this story on p11.... what happened next, please?
Quote:
At first they would not take any notice of my request, but because I was persistent, they at last got out his clothes, and, when they were aired, I took them into his room.
:-) |
| | 2008/4/3 9:57 | | PaulWest
Member
Joined: 2006/6/28
Posts: 3405
Dallas, Texas
| | Re: | | Quote:
They reach as high as they can lifting up to the heavens to adore their creator. All creation worships you Jesus.
The fragrance of your mood today is sweet, brother. Keep it coming. Flowers are good! My cucumber vines are growing; I think seeds and soil and the principle of growth and bloom and fruit yielding contain all the essence of God's miraculous at work in the mortal sphere. Flowers are good!
_________________
Paul Frederick West
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| | 2008/4/3 10:15 | Profile | crsschk
Member
Joined: 2003/6/11
Posts: 9192
Santa Clara, CA
| | Re: Weary | | Quote:
maybe you are not aware of this , but I do not answer every thread here on SI. As a matter of fact, very few. Why...because I do not know the answer to all of these threads. But those I do, comes from HEART knowledge, not head.
Anyone can comment on anything from the head...but the Heart comes from a personal relationship...wrought in.
Your words do not convey this truth but the opposite.
[i]A foolish son is ruin to his father, and a wife's quarreling is a continual dripping of rain.[/i] Pro 19:13
[i]A continual dripping on a rainy day and a quarrelsome wife are alike; to restrain her is to restrain the wind or to grasp oil in one's right hand.[/i] Pro 27:15,16
Could but pray otherwise that this would be taken to heart but it is a wearing exercise that you continue to be obstinate, haughty and proud. What is refused to be looked at is just your culpability and constant berating, oneupmanship over and over again. You will admit to no fault but defend yourself tirelessly even in the face of such glaring observations. Everything has a retort, an excuse or good reason behind it. Now it's a doctrinal assertion that you will hide behind, often it is, and yet you will speak as though they are from "heart knowledge". In no way do you convey this. You overstep your bounds as a woman as did many of your defenders who became offended and emotional that [i]For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again[/i] and left, not without making sure that everyone was informed of the great evil supposed in their imagination was laid out for good measure, "the last word" had been spoken.
To your credit, at least you had the fortitude to not join in their folly. It was never addressed to them in the first place. What is thought to be known and what was laid out as accusation, how things might be dealt with here and what might be going on amongst the moderators at any given moment seemingly something that is a "right to know" and even more so a demand. I have no sympathy for evil imaginations nor prying over what amounts to 'none of your business'.
Quote:
Don't you ever Judge me or anyone again!!!!! Katy
On the contrary, everyone is judged. I am well fed up with this idea that some sisters think they can argue like men until they are called on it and then revert back to being feminine and unsheathe a "How dare you" mindset for doing so. If you cannot stand the heat, get out of the kitchen.
But it goes further than this and applies more broadly. Over and over again these discussions are not discussions at all but debates of the wrong sort and the wrong spirit. It was brought up recently the matter of a 'critical spirit', it is that and yet it is more. It is at the same time an unwillingness to suffer perceived wrong and lack of any spiritual backbone that cannot, will not accept correction or even dare say criticism. The abundance of defending, 'self-defense' is more grievous than the 'offense' presumably given in the first place.
What appears to be the greatest blight upon many of us is that we will just not become truly honest about matters. We can be more hypocritical spiritually than we know or will frankly admit to.
This may be a bit confusing to others not privy to some of the recent upheaval that had some offended and leaving this confine but I want to set some matters clear here. Even in the midst of
the imaginative accusations and insinuations which by attempting to defend would only perpetrate more and more of the same, namely confusion and strife there is a refusal to defend any of it. Let the misconstruing be what it is, let the misunderstandings be what they are. The whole point here is that there was still truth to be told even in the outbursts. There are indeed failings on our part, more so on my part as a moderator here. Some things should have been handled differently. Indeed I often have a penchant for long worded, rambling expressions. I know that I am wrong, have done wrong and been overtly critical. I failed time and again. There are no 'buts' about it. I repent of it and repent before all of you, never lightly but without an adequate expression to convey just how much all these things that take place here effect me personally.
No one should ever need to leave this forum but there is no doubt that some cannot control themselves. If there is anything lacking and a constant irritant from 5 years of observation here it is the withholding of confession. Where many of us err is in attempting to force one. I may be the most guilty of all in these attempts.
So who is haughty, obstinate and proud? Why it is me myself! I wouldn't dare to speak of it if I didn't have a well to draw from and a certain measure of experience to even attempt to speak from.
We need to face some hard truths about ourselves and our opinions and our ability to receive correction from each other. The minute we come back with a defending retort as our first inclination ought to be telling us something. It ought to tell us first of all that we have not even considered, that we frankly do not want to hear anything that might turn us out as uninformed, lacking knowledge, immature, peevish, quarrelsome, contentious ... My God, what will people think of me? And therein lies the problem. We are often protective of our poor selfish psyche's and perceive everything as injury, criticism for criticisms sake, judging ... on and on it goes. Some of it is indeed of a wrong, critical spirit and that 'spirit' if we need to categorize it this way needs it's own sharp criticism leveled at it.
Unfortunately and I know we love things laid out in nice, easy to comprehend, step by step manners but the truth is, none of it is easy, simplistic or without 'hurt'. It is the price we will have to pay to become more and more honest.
No revival without confession.
_________________
Mike Balog
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| | 2008/4/3 10:30 | Profile |
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