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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : Once Saved...Always Saved???

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 Re:

OSWALD CHAMBERS

Have you given consideration to the title, *My* Utmost For His Highest? Shouldn’t it say, “His” Utmost For My Highest? "The glory which Thou hast given Me I have given them" (John 17:22).

The doctrinal dangers of this book far outweigh the benefits, totally confusing the believer and his walk with the Lord. Here are some examples from his book, and you will know what I mean.


Mr. Chambers' attitude concerning the eternal security of the believer:

God will not give us good habits, He will not give us character, He will not make us walk aright. We have to do all that ourselves; we have to work out the salvation God has worked in. If you hesitate when God tells you to do a thing, you endanger your standing in grace (Nov. 12th).


Oswald Chambers was an in many ways a religious humanist.

Example:

God does not give us overcoming life; He gives us life as we overcome. When the inspiration of God comes, and He says, "Arise from the dead," we have to get up; God does not lift us up (Feb. 16th ). Romans 6 and Romans 8:11-13 say otherwise.

Oswald Chambers did not secure justification, forcing him to over-compensate sanctification.

Have I made this decision about sin, that it must be killed right out of me? Haul yourself up, take a time alone with God, make the moral decision and say, "Lord, identify me with Thy death until I know that sin is dead in me" (April 10th).

Wrong....our identification is once and for all. Look and find where sin ever dies. Sin never dies. WE died with Christ...now we walk in our New Nature. We will always have 2 natures ALWAYS.

Either God or sin must die in my life. The New Testament brings us right down to this one issue. If sin rules in me, God's life in me will be killed; if God rules in me, sin in me will be killed. There is no possible ultimate but that (June 23rd).

Again, Sin never dies and Paul has never taught that sin dies...we died with Christ...we...Adam 1,

By sanctification the Son of God is formed in me, then I have to transform my natural life into a spiritual life (March 18th).

Where does scripture say this... Oswald Chambers dioes not understand our old man died with Christ....what he is really teaching is teh reconstruction of the old adam...reforming the old man... this is not scripture...this is humanism.

Too much “Me, Myself and I” in Oswald Chambers teachings. The Truth is in Romans 6 we YIELD and RECKON and KNOW……

Those who have an ear to hear will understand ……

Love in Christ
Katy-did

 2007/7/1 8:56









 Re:

Those who understand what issues are, may they rebuke you.

 2007/7/1 9:05









 Re:


ROMANS 7
OH WRETCHED MAN THAT I AM, WHO SHALL DELIVER ME FROM THE BODY OF THIS DEATH...I THANK GOD THROUGH JESUS CHRIST OUR LORD...

This my friends is missing in Oswald Chambers teachings.

Jesus said, I came to set you free....
Now ask yoursels

Who set you free
What set you free
When were you set free
Where were you set free
How were you set free
Why were you set free


Don't forget what Jesus Preached in teh Temple..*HE CAME* to SET THE CAPTIVES FREE.

Love in Christ
Katy-did

;-)

 2007/7/1 9:18









 Re: OSAS

I know i'm going to be stoned to death for this but it amazes me how long this thread has gone. Honestly i don't mean to offend anyone even though some will think it so, but i swear to all of you i mean no harm in this, even though what i say is going to be very very blunt.

Here goes:


"Once Saved Always Saved, is one of the biggest lies from the pit of hell, from Satan himself."


Yes i could go on and on and on and on quoting scripture but to what avail ? Another 48 pages on this subject ? No thank you. Ok now, let the rocks fly as i try to get out of the way. Sorry everyone but thats always been my take on OSAS but since i'm not a good debater, i won't get into it. I'll leave that up to all of you to proceed.



Brother Julian

 2007/7/1 11:00









 Re: OSAS

One last thought. Don't forget that Satan knows scripture and the Word of God better than all of us humans and can defend his false doctrine of OSAS by the Word of God, quoting scripture long past when were all gone from this earth.



Brother Julian

 2007/7/1 11:07
LoveHim
Member



Joined: 2007/6/14
Posts: 562
Indiana, US

 Re:

dear brother julian,

i'm sorry you feel that way, but i promise not to throw any stones..

my question to you is "do you accurately understand the doctrine of the perseverence of the saints?"

i only ask that because i use to say the same things about O.S.A.S. being from satan and how could people preach that, but i spoke from ignorance. i did not actually understand what was the real position of such a doctrine.

now, there are people who accurately understand the position and reject it, and for that i say "i understand your position, but i disagree.
let's continue to serve the Lord as brothers and sisters".

just a few thoughts.

 2007/7/1 12:38Profile
rookie
Member



Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4807


 Re:

Sorry, this thread is moving fast...just going back to a post Katydid wrote:

Quote:
Jeff, are you saying when the Author was talking to Jews today in Hebrews...Today is the day of Salvation, using Hebrews 3&4 as an example and proclaiming the Finished work of Christ, that is not for today.



Hebrews 3:

Hbr 3:7 ¶ Wherefore (as the Holy Ghost saith, To day if ye will hear his voice,

8 Harden not your hearts, as in the provocation, in the day of temptation in the wilderness:

9 When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my works forty years.

10 Wherefore I was grieved with that generation, and said, They do alway err in [their] heart; and they have not known my ways.

In this section of Scripture we find that the Holy Spirit is speaking to a generation that preceeded the incarnation of Christ. In this generation Scripture teaches that this generation "grieved" God. In that generation, they tempted God. Remember that the root is Holy and that all the branches are also holy. The branches are representative of each generation. This is found in Paul's teaching in Romans 11.

Going back to what Paul says of that generation who failed to enter into God's rest...

1Cr 10:3 And did all eat the same spiritual meat;

:4 And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.

According to this Scripture Paul teaches that that generation eat of the same spiritual meat...and that that generation drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them; and that Rock was Christ.

Then Paul also says...

1Cr 10:9 Neither let us tempt Christ, as some of them also tempted, and were destroyed of serpents.

These verses written by Paul speak of the same events in Hebrews 3.

Have you ever considered when Christ calls on us to take His yoke upon us, that He is behind us directing us in the way that we should go? Just like the generation that God rejected because of disobedience, that message is for today.

Because most, not all refused to take the yoke, God said this of that generation...

Hbr 3:11 So I sware in my wrath, They shall not enter into my rest.)

Scripture teaches that the rest was made available to them as well as us...first...

Hbr 3:17 But with whom was he grieved forty years? [was it] not with them that had sinned, whose carcases fell in the wilderness?

18 And to whom sware he that they should not enter into his rest, but to them that believed not?

19 So we see that they could not enter in because of unbelief.

The reason they did not enter was "unbelief." According to the Scriptures, they did not know the ways of God.

Likewise today, we can easily speak of the events in Scripture. We often chop up the Scriptures and only want to listen to men...but as babes in Christ we are to feed on the 'pure milk of word." The pure milk of the word will prepare one to eat the meat. The eating of the meat of Scripture will teach one not only the events of Scripture but much more importantly the "ways of God."



Hbr 4:1 ¶ Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left [us] of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it.

:2 For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard [it].

You see in this next section of Scripture we find that "that generation" had the gospel preached to them as well as it is preached to us in this generation.

Hbr 4:3 For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.

and

Hbr 4:6 Seeing therefore it remaineth that some must enter therein, and they to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief:

Do you see that this Scripture says that the promise of rest "remaineth," and that it is "unbelief" that prevents one from entering into that rest.

Have you ever considered who the Holy One is in the OT?

God Bless
jeff







_________________
Jeff Marshalek

 2007/7/1 13:54Profile
rookie
Member



Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4807


 Re:

LoveHim wrote:

Quote:
ps. and cain made manifest that he was not a child of promise, he was wicked and satan was not a new father, but was his father..



Scripture teaches that after the fall of Adam and Eve, man was given the ability to know both good and evil.

Gen 3:22 ¶ And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:

This precept is demonstated to us in Genesis 4...

Gen 4:6 And the LORD said unto Cain, Why art thou wroth? and why is thy countenance fallen?

We find that God speaks to Cain in a Fatherly manner. He is concerned for Cains' failure to please Him. This is the precept of "knowing good."

Then Scripture teaches us that God exhorts Cain...

Gen 4:7 If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee [shall be] his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.

Now we see that God encourages Cain, saying to him if he does well (according to God's ways)will not God accept Cain also.

Then look at the warning, "and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door." This is the precept of 'knowing evil." Satan was waiting at the door, tempting him.

Now what does God say to Cain? And unto thee [shall be] his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.

Is this not speaking of Satan?

Now we find in 1 John that Cain chose to not resist Satan but to take on the desires of his father Satan...

This is kind of what Brother Ormly is talking about when we many times look only to the future and not dwell in the moment. God is here in the moment of our lives seperating us from the captivity of Satan. If we do not live in the moment we end up like the tares that are allowed to grow in the midst of the wheat...

Only by listening to the Holy Spirit in the moment are we enabled to see the next step towards Him.

In Christ
Jeff


_________________
Jeff Marshalek

 2007/7/1 14:12Profile









 Re:

Rookie,
I love the words "ENTER IN".
I love Hebrews 10:19 Having therefore , brethren boldness to "ENTER IN" to the holiest, by the Blood of Jesus, by a New and LIVING way, which He hath consecrated for us, throught he veil, that is to say His flesh. I am crucified wuith Christ...

They ENTERED IN to the Promise land. Joshua parallels Ephesians. The Jordan represents the Cross. The Promise Land, Christ Himself.

It's also interesting to see the parallel when Abraham looked at the Promise Land..*the length, breadth, depth and height, also found in Ephesians 3 of Christ...the, length, depth, width and height. Yet it says in Hebrews, Abraham did not look for an earthly city, but that Heavenly City..

We ENTER IN to His rest...His finished work, through the Cross. We are justified by His Blood and saved by His life..His risen life..the Promise Land.

Our sin was washed in the blood of Jesus Christ, our old man was crucified with Christ.

Love in Christ
Katy-did :-)

 2007/7/1 15:54









 Re:

Quote:

Katy-did wrote:
Rookie,
I love the words "ENTER IN".
I love Hebrews 10:19 Having therefore , brethren boldness to "ENTER IN" to the holiest, by the Blood of Jesus, by a New and LIVING way, which He hath consecrated for us, throught he veil, that is to say His flesh. I am crucified wuith Christ...

They ENTERED IN to the Promise land. Joshua parallels Ephesians. The Jordan represents the Cross. The Promise Land, Christ Himself.

It's also interesting to see the parallel when Abraham looked at the Promise Land..*the length, breadth, depth and height, also found in Ephesians 3 of Christ...the, length, depth, width and height. Yet it says in Hebrews, Abraham did not look for an earthly city, but that Heavenly City..

We ENTER IN to His rest...His finished work, through the Cross. We are justified by His Blood and saved by His life..His risen life..the Promise Land.

Our sin was washed in the blood of Jesus Christ, our old man was crucified with Christ.

Love in Christ
Katy-did :-)



That's three times by my count that you have posted from them....Why don't throw your biased/slanted commentaries away? They are doing you a disservice.

 2007/7/1 16:04





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