SermonIndex Audio Sermons
Image Map
Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : Pre-Trib vs. Post-Trib: Pls Include Scripture

Print Thread (PDF)

Goto page ( Previous Page 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13 | 14 Next Page )
PosterThread









 Re:

My "church" is awesome... perfect, yet being perfected. If you are born again you also are part of it for WE ARE the Church.

Ephesians 2:
19Consequently, you are no longer foreigners and aliens, but fellow citizens with God's people and members of God's household, 20built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus himself as the chief cornerstone. 21In him the whole building is joined together and rises to become a holy temple in the Lord. 22And in him you too are being built together to become a dwelling in which God lives by his Spirit.


In Christ - Jim

 2007/3/27 14:32
lovegrace
Member



Joined: 2006/8/12
Posts: 313


 Re:

Quote:

JaySaved wrote:
Concerning the rapture, does it occur before or after the First Resurrection?

1 Thess. 4
13But we do not want you to be uninformed, brothers, about those who are asleep, that you may not grieve as others do who have no hope. 14For since we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so, through Jesus, God will bring with him those who have fallen asleep. 15For this we declare to you by a word from the Lord, that we who are alive, who are left until the coming of the Lord, will not precede those who have fallen asleep. 16For the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a cry of command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the sound of the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. 17Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we will always be with the Lord. 18Therefore encourage one another with these words.

Revelation 20
4Then I saw thrones, and seated on them were those to whom the authority to judge was committed. Also I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for the testimony of Jesus and for the word of God, and who had not worshiped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years. 5The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended. This is the first resurrection. 6Blessed and holy is the one who shares in the first resurrection! Over such the second death has no power, but they will be priests of God and of Christ, and they will reign with him for a thousand years.

If the First Resurrection occurs in Revelation 20, then why do some 'expositors' see a 'rapture' in Revelation 4?



Wonderful post. I couldn't have said it better myself. 8-)

 2007/3/27 18:01Profile
staff
Member



Joined: 2007/2/8
Posts: 1547


 Re:

Hi,
Regarding Rev 20 and the First resurection.

The first resurection is a category not an event.
Included in that category are the saints who didnt worship the beast.They are ressurected at different times.Jesus is the first fruits.

4Then I saw thrones, and seated on them were those to whom the authority to judge was committed. Also I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for the testimony of Jesus and for the word of God, and who had not worshiped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years. 5The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended. This is the first resurrection. 6Blessed and holy is the one who shares in the first resurrection! Over such the second death has no power, but they will be priests of God and of Christ, and they will reign with him for a
thousand years.


What about these saints for instance:
Mat 27:52 And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,

Mat 27:53 And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

They had to be part of the first resurection but were not resurrected during the end time.
rgds staff

 2007/3/27 19:05Profile









 Re:

I will believe you, IF you can find me the two passages in the OLD TESTEMENT that say that Elijah comes twice.

 2007/3/27 19:15









 Re:

Quote:
Mat 27:52 And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,53 And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

They had to be part of the first resurection but were not resurrected during the end time.



You need to ask yourself some questions, are you going to listen to what others are saying about the so called end times, or are you going to rightly divide the word of God and go with what that says??

Now I want you to compare those verses that you quoted with Daniel 12

Quote:
Daniel 12:1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.

2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

4 But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.



In order for you to interpret this properly, you'll need to find out what "end" he is talking about here.

We must not negate the resurrection that took place AFTER Christs' resurrection.

 2007/3/27 19:31
lovegrace
Member



Joined: 2006/8/12
Posts: 313


 Re:

Quote:

staff wrote:

The first resurection is a category not an event.
ncluded in that category are the saints who didnt worship the beast.



That doesn't even make sense.

Please speak english and not a 'copy-cat' theology.

 2007/3/27 21:11Profile
psalm1
Member



Joined: 2007/1/30
Posts: 1230


 Re:

is "caught up" and "the rapture" the same thing?When does Jesus come for his bride? Or Does Jesus ever come for his bride?.....David

 2007/3/27 23:56Profile
JaySaved
Member



Joined: 2005/7/11
Posts: 1131
Kentucky

 Re:

staff,

Even if we include the saints brought to life in Matthew 27, scripture plainly teaches that the first resurrection occurs before the rapture.

 2007/3/28 9:23Profile
JaySaved
Member



Joined: 2005/7/11
Posts: 1131
Kentucky

 Re:

Quote:
by psalm1 on 2007/3/27 22:56:28

is "caught up" and "the rapture" the same thing?When does Jesus come for his bride? Or Does Jesus ever come for his bride?.....David



2 Thes. 2
"Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,"

The Second Coming of Christ is when Christians are gathered to Him. First, those who are dead in Christ, then we which are alive and remaining.

After this happens, there will be a Second Resurrection of the unbelievers.

 2007/3/28 9:26Profile
psalm1
Member



Joined: 2007/1/30
Posts: 1230


 Re:

ok,if I am hearing this right,the consensus is that resurection is the focus and basis for your position.Is this true? Also what about 1 thes4;17 it says caught up together with them.This"cathing up" or rapture ,is practically simultaneous With the "first resurrection".Litterally a couple of seconds apart.Look at the word "together".The reason I bring this up is ,I am wondering if you need a gap to make your position?For some reason you seem to focus on 2 resurrections.I have looked at this and read it but am having trouble understanding how you take up a posttrib or no rapture position......thanks,David

 2007/3/28 10:33Profile





©2002-2020 SermonIndex.net
Promoting Genuine Biblical Revival.
Affiliate Disclosure | Privacy Policy