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Nasher
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Joined: 2003/7/28
Posts: 404
Watford, UK

 Re: Question & Answer from John MacArthur

Question

Which Jewish holidays, such a Purim, Passover, Hanukkah, would be appropriate for a Jewish believer [in Christ] to still celebrate, and which if any, would no longer be appropriate?

Answer

Well, essentially from the vantage point of the New Testament, there are no Jewish holidays that are still a part of the Christian faith. There are certain holidays that don't have anything to do with the Old Testament: Hanukkah, the Jewish New Year has nothing to do with the Old Testament; I think Purim has nothing to do with the Old Testament; the Feast of Lights is more of a traditional feast than an Old Testament Biblical feast, or festival. But as far as the New Testament is concerned, all of the ceremonies were set aside and we know that because Jesus indicated to us in His attitude with the Scribes and the Pharisees a certain indifference to that, and most particularly, Jesus made the transition from the Passover, which was the main celebration, to the Lord's Supper--it was at a Passover meal, the night of His betrayal, that Jesus took the bread, which had once been in reference to the Passover in Egypt, which was the great historic indication of the power of God to deliver His people and became the basis of the Passover, it was to be a memorial and God instituted it there in Egypt. But Jesus took the elements: the bread and the cup that were connected to the Passover, and said, "From now on, this bread doesn't represent the unleavened bread of the Passover in Egypt--it represents My Body. And this wine, is no longer representative of deliverance in Egypt, and the blood put on the door and the lintel, it is representative of My Blood shed for you. So Jesus Himself transitioned out of the Passover, as such.

When you come into the Book of Acts, in the Jerusalem Council, in the 15th chapter of Acts, the believers there were instructed, however, not to offend the Jewish people, with regard to some of those remaining ceremonies. And in Romans 14 and 15, there is even some instructions about, if people have certain, I suppose you could say scruples, if they have certain convictions, and they are not free to violate those because they don't yet understand their freedom, even as Christians. If they are still holding to, let's say, the Sabbath, or they are still holding to a certain dietary law, the Apostle Paul says, "Don't offend them, don't force them into liberties which their conscience doesn't yet allow them to do--they need to be instructed and they will come to a point where they will better understand the terms of the New Covenant, and they will leave those things aside.

So the objective is, Jesus ends the Old Testament ceremonial law, as such, and with the ceremonial law, go essentially, all the feast and festivals that were a part of it. Then in the Book of Acts there is a gradual sort of disconnect with that, and we know that because as the church was being built under the leadership of, particularly the Apostle Paul, those things were never instituted in the church--they were left to the past. When you get into the Epistles, it becomes very specific and the texts that I would...well, one in the Book of Acts, Acts 10 where there is a vision that Peter has and on this sheet that he sees, a sheet coming down from heaven, there's all kinds of animals, clean and unclean, you know, kosher and non-kosher, and Peter is told, "Rise Peter, kill and eat." And he says, "I can't do that. I can't eat the unclean animals." And the Lord says to him, "Don't you call unclean what I have cleansed." So there is no more distinction between clean and unclean, and that's just an illustration of the break with the past.

When you come into the Epistles, and I would draw your attention to one particular Epistle, and that's Colossians, and the 2nd chapter of Colossians. The Apostle Paul is showing us how things have dramatically changed; he says this in verse 16, Colossians 2:16, "So let no one judge you in food," that is, in any dietary law, "Let no one judge you in drink; Let no one judge you regarding a festival or a new moon or Sabbaths." Now, no dietary regulations; no religious observances, and the festivals were essentially Pentecost, Passover, Feast of Tabernacles--all of those. "No new moon," and that was the point at which the monthly sacrifice was made--on the first day of each month--the new moon. "No Sabbaths," that's the weekly celebrations. So, annual celebrations, monthly celebrations, weekly celebrations--he says, "Don't let anybody hold you to those things," verse 17, "which are a shadow of things to come, but the substance is of Christ." They were shadows, and now the substance has arrived, and the shadow has no more place.

And so, as far as we are concerned in the Church: Jewish Christian, Gentile Christian, there is no necessity to observe any of those things from the standpoint of our Christian faith. However, within the framework of tradition, within the family, there's nothing wrong with participating in those events--nothing wrong with the traditional family celebration of Passover; nothing wrong with other traditional Jewish celebrations: the Jewish New Year, Yom Kippur, whatever it is, and in fact, as a Christian you can bring into that kind of celebration a much richer understanding of the reality of which those things were but a shadow. That's one of the reasons why it is problematic to have what we call, "Messianic Synagogues."

There has been a movement for a number of years and I have addressed it throughout the last, probably, fifteen years, where Jewish people, who are believers, have established, rather than Churches, what they call Messianic Synagogues, and they observe all of the Jewish customs, all of the Jewish traditions, whether it is the annual feasts like Pentecost, Passover, and so forth, whether it is the New Year, the Day of Atonement, the monthly New Moon Sabbath, they observe the weekly Sabbath, they observe it on Saturday, they go through all of that ritual, and in a sense, they are like the Judaizers of the New Testament, who are running around, trying to impose Jewish custom, Jewish ceremony, Old Testament ritual on Christians. I think it is wrong to do that. I don't think that's what the New Testament intends. I think the flow of the New Testament is that is what you are trying to do is to teach those people who come out of that background that they no longer need to hold to those things, but that they can let them go because of their freedom in Christ.

So I think that is the best passage to take people to who are asking that kind of question. We are not under obligation to maintain any of those things, and the most notable of all of them is the Passover. You celebrate the Passover because of God's redemption--the Redeemer comes and the Passover is over and now you have you have the Lord's Supper. You celebrate Pentecost, which is "first fruits" and the last Pentecost, legitimately celebrated, was the Pentecost at which time the Holy Spirit came--remember it was the day of Pentecost the Spirit came--it was the great harvest feast and the Spirit came on that day, and in a sense put an end to the shadow, because now the Holy Spirit had come and the great harvest, as it were, of souls, began.

So I think that it is best to see no Biblical obligation at all for any of those things, but I think that it is wise, if you are in a Jewish context to graciously participate in those kinds of traditions understanding that they all point to the reality, who is Christ.


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Mark Nash

 2004/11/25 10:29Profile
RobertW
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Joined: 2004/2/12
Posts: 4636
St. Joseph, Missouri

 Re: Jewish Roots: Rich, Redemptive & Certainly Not Replaced

Quote:
(If you have seen ‘Fiddler on the Roof’ -still my favourite film - you know the mood. If you haven’t seen it, I recommend it. Take your hanky.)



[b][size=small]Two Jews and Three Opinions[/size][/b]
[size=xx-small]By Robert Wurtz II[/size]


My American, midwest, upbringing, fitted with all manor of personalities, has found it difficult to come to terms with conversations I have had on the topic of Jewish Roots, whether here on this forum or in the classroom. Generally, I have never seen conversations escalate like I have in these circles without a brawl breaking out. People have been thrown through windows in these parts for saying less. ;-) Remember, a man just shot and killed 6 men over a deer stand north of us. That's an extreme example, but you see how well people tolerate debate around here.

He Opened Up a Battery on Me!

When I sat in the Jewish Class for the FIRST time the dean, Jerry Feldman, took me on handily. I seem to recall he did not like my interpretation of circumcision. He was getting loud and inciting others in the class to take me on also and they would not. I recall saying that physical circumcision was an outward expression of an inward circumsion of the heart of the flesh. When a person had their heart circumcised of the flesh they were circumcised of the influence of the flesh. When a gentile (goyim) saw this sign (physical circumcision) he would know that this is a man that "fears the Lord." As Finney would say, Feldman opened up a battery on me. He started asking me questions; what denomination are you? are you a despensationalist? etc.

Where is My TAPE RECORDER?

He even said he wished he could have recorded it all for playback on the radio. Think about this, he was about to take it public! I was not offended. I held my ground. It wasn't the first time he let me have it; because the first time was in a phone conversation and I didn't call back for a while. I finally got the courage up and called back with a less "typical" Christian question. By the way, never call and ask a Rabbi about the Wilderness Tabernacle. So he toned it down a bit and invited me to his school; the rest is history.

I'm Out of Here!

He was a plain spoken man. He would tell you strait what he thought. I was not used to this at all. I was used to the gentle pastoral fuzzy stuff. He would tell people things about Jewish Roots and they would stand to their feet, deliberately fold their books, do an 'about face' (almost military style) and march out. Jerry Feldman just looked them off as they went out. It reminds me of a Russian military display when the soldiers march swinging the arms with their heads turned. This behavior was shocking to me!

Life in New York

It then started to make sense when he woud talk about his life in New York City among the Hasidim (Orthodox Jews, etc.) and would make references to Fiddler on the Roof. He talked about people walking down the street and just going into peoples homes to fellowship and eat dinner. The conversations would be so loud and boisterous that you could here them yelling down the street with the doors and windows open. Were they fighting? They WOULD have been here in Missouri! In fact, the police would have been at the house. He says that this is how they related to each other in many cases and that there were no ill feelings, but it was normal Jewish life. It was an expression of their familial love and relationships I suppose.


Inigmatic Personality

I watched conversations go down in which it seemed that he and others were debating two different sides of an issue at once! I said, these people are just argumentative! But in time, I realized that they refused to simplify the issues and leave an anomaly undealt with. They were tearing their ownself to shreds with everyone else. They wanted to know the truth. Just like here; I see the same type of discussions. When we enguage one another in a way that challenges certain things we always held true, sometimes there is a refining work that is happening. Sometimes we are trying to come to terms with issues we have long wrestled with and wish someone would answer us.

Talking to Ourselves, While Others and Listening

When the right person comes along, that can be a real 'sounding board' with which to discuss an issue, I have found, that we talk to that person like we talk to ourself when we debate within our own heart. It is a tactless conversation often times. If we can remember this in our wording and in our hearing we can have a more peacable conversation. We can realize that a great amount of 'respect' as it were is being afforded mutually in the fact that the conversation has been taken to such a level.

God Bless,

-Robert


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Robert Wurtz II

 2004/11/25 11:00Profile
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 Re: Jewish Roots: Rich, Redemptive & Certainly Not Replaced

Quote:
The term "Messianic Jew" is a clear signal that we celebrate The LORD's Festivals dramatically different from rabbinic Judaism. Our Jewish relatives would obviously recognize the Jewish celebrations in our Messianic Jewish homes and synagogues.

So you are not really celebrating the Day of Atonement but rather remembering the ancient ritual of the Day of Atonement? In a similar way to the way folks might ‘celebrate’ Christmas? The celebration is not a spiritual reality but just a token of remembrance, not dissimilar to breaking bread? The celebration then has no warrant in scripture but is just a memory of a previous Covenant?

I am presuming that as a believer, I will use the biblical term here so as not to cause confusion, you believe that the New Covenant has arrived in Christ and that we who are joined in One Spirit with Him have become beneficiaries of that New Covenant. I seems axiomatic to me that the Old and the New Covenant cannot coexist so I find a preoccupation with personal ethnic history a little strange. Christ’s people, have been redeemed ‘out of’ every kindred and tongue and people and nation. The English word ‘out of’ is the Greek word ‘ek’ (or ex). So in my relationship to Christ and to the redeemed I am ‘ex’ many things. I am ex-kindred (phulE), i.e. no longer of this tribe or that clan. I am ‘ex-language’ (glossA) i.e no longer finding my affinity in a language group. I am ‘ex-people’(loas) i.e. no longer finding my affinity in a people or national group. And finally, I am ex-nation (ethnos) i.e. no longer of this race or ethnic group.

This is quite a list but for myself I can translate this into personal terms. I am ex-Bailey; my spiritual affinities are not the orientated according to my family. I am ex-English, in the sense that my spiritual affinities are not orientated towards my language group. I am ex-British; as regards my spiritual affinities I will instinctively side with the saints of God rather than with the Brits. And I am ex-white European descent. On our census forms I refuse to indicate what ‘ethnic group’ I belong to. I always state simply that I belong to the new nation of Christ’s people.

So there’s my list of ex-es. I wonder what you are ‘ex’. My instinctive affinities are towards the people of God not towards family, language, nation or race. In a hypothetical situation where you might have to choose between [b] …Jews… Gentiles…the church of God[/b] (1Co 10:32 KJV) which group would you instinctively join. This is really a re-wording of my question ‘do you regard yourself as a Christian Jew or a Jewish Christian?’


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Ron Bailey

 2004/11/25 11:30Profile
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Posts: 6566
Reading, UK

 Re:

Hi Robert

Quote:
I watched conversations go down in which it seemed that he and others were debating two different sides of an issue at once! I said, these people are just argumentative! But in time, I realized that they refused to simplify the issues and leave an anomaly undealt with. They were tearing their ownself to shreds with everyone else. They wanted to know the truth. Just like here; I see the same type of discussions. When we enguage one another in a way that challenges certain things we always held true, sometimes there is a refining work that is happening. Sometimes we are trying to come to terms with issues we have long wrestled with and wish someone would answer us.


This sounds very much like the 'destruction testing' that I often ask for. The key thing however is that it is the ideas which are being 'destruction tested' not the person who holds them. :-D

I know that some are troubled by the market place but as long as there is genuine respect and no recourse to underhand debating tactics the exercise can be very valuable. I have had to sharpen my own thinking in many areas as a result of the 'destruction testing' my 'interesting ideas' have received at the hands of my fellow SIers.

As you know I try to operate along the lines of others who have had 'interesting ideas'. I told you I loved the Finney quote. This is another favourite from William Tyndale [i]If I shall perceive either by myself or by the information of another, that ought be escaped me, or might be more plainly translated, I will shortly after, cause it to be mended.[/i]

Soft hearts and hard heads - is the way.


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Ron Bailey

 2004/11/25 11:41Profile
RobertW
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Joined: 2004/2/12
Posts: 4636
St. Joseph, Missouri

 Re:

Quote:
And so, as far as we are concerned in the Church: Jewish Christian, Gentile Christian, there is no necessity to observe any of those things from the standpoint of our Christian faith. However, within the framework of tradition, within the family, there's nothing wrong with participating in those events--nothing wrong with the traditional family celebration of Passover; nothing wrong with other traditional Jewish celebrations: the Jewish New Year, Yom Kippur, whatever it is, and in fact, as a Christian you can bring into that kind of celebration a much richer understanding of the reality of which those things were but a shadow. That's one of the reasons why it is problematic to have what we call, "Messianic Synagogues."



Hi Nasher,

If we remember that there are Jews who will refuse to become like a gentile to be saved, we understand why Messianic Synagogues are necessary. This is not a push to make Gentiles Jews, we are trying to see the Gospel presented to them in a way that does not contain Roman influence. You have to get this or you will never win a Jew to Christ. Jews are more offended at 'Christian' terms that they feel are Hellenistic and pagan than we are at words like Rabbi, Synagogue, Sabbath, etc. In fact, many commonly used themes have their roots in paganism and NOT biblical faith. The reformers filtered a lot of it out, but there is still a lot there.

To be true to your above statement you have to allow the liberty of what you imply and not set a limitation on that liberty. "Let no man judge you in meat, drink, etc..." is a passage that cuts both ways. If a Jew wants to keep Sabbath they have all the rights in the world to do it so long as they do it lawfully; and if a Gentile wants to work they can do that. Christians esteem Sunday as the new Christian "Sabbath." Why is that? Most evangelicals will question your spirituality of you do not recognize Sunday as the "Lord's Day" or the "First day of the week." Most preachers preach tithe and not circumcision? Hmmm? Isn't that Judaizing?

Most Christians would also look at you strange if you did not celebrate Easter and Christmas. Are you a Jehovah's Witness or something? Who would question what I say here? We all know it is true; especially the Jews. How did they suddenly make pagen holidays into Christian holidays when God has already given them days to remember if they wanted them? If I were a Jew, I would want a clear answer to that one! :-( That is not to say I can't celebrate Christmas because I can and will. That is MY liberty and if they want to not celebrate it and celebrate the festivals; that is their liberty.


Yes, the festivals have been replaced by the Church; but with what? Yes, Sabbath has been replaced by the Church, but with what? Removing these things creates a serious vacuum that has to be filled. These things don't bother us, but they are a stumblingblock to the Jews that is unnecessary. From AD 135 to Wycliff the Church was taking hit after hit from the paganism of the Greeks. Soon there were idols of Mary in the Church and all sorts of madness. Yet, there is an entrenched mindset in the Church that allows them to believe that celebrating all what we do is pious, yet if a Jewish Believer wants to celebrate Passover or suggests that we out to give it a try they are somehow Judaizing. You say, I don't want to! Well, you don't have to. Just don't tell someone they can't.

God Bless,

-Robert


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Robert Wurtz II

 2004/11/25 11:42Profile
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Joined: 2003/7/18
Posts: 6566
Reading, UK

 Re:

Quote:
Most Christians would also look at you strange if you did not celebrate Easter and Christmas. Are you a Jehovah's Witness or something? Who would question what I say here? We all know it is true; especially the Jews. How did they suddenly make pagen holidays into Christian holidays when God has already given them days to remember if they wanted them? If I were a Jew, I would want a clear answer to that one!

I am a Christian, and I would like a clear answer on that one too. ;-) I think we have to differentiate between a true biblical Christianity and a Christianized Heathenism usually called Christendom. I don’t believe that Catholic propaganda that Catholicism represent authentic Christianity.

Quote:
Yet, there is an entrenched mindset in the Church that allows them to believe that celebrating all what we do is pious, yet if a Jewish Believer wants to celebrate Passover or suggests that we out to give it a try they are somehow Judaizing. You say, I don't want to! Well, you don't have to. Just don't tell someone they can't.

I haven't heard anyone say "they can't". I have heard Dr Eukel say 'we should' and I will oppose such Jusaizings as strongly as I can.


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Ron Bailey

 2004/11/25 11:52Profile
RobertW
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Joined: 2004/2/12
Posts: 4636
St. Joseph, Missouri

 Re:

Quote:
I seems axiomatic to me that the Old and the New Covenant cannot coexist so I find a preoccupation with personal ethnic history a little strange. Christ’s people, have been redeemed ‘out of’ every kindred and tongue and people and nation. The English word ‘out of’ is the Greek word ‘ek’ (or ex). So in my relationship to Christ and to the redeemed I am ‘ex’ many things. I am ex-kindred (phulE), i.e. no longer of this tribe or that clan. I am ‘ex-language’ (glossA) i.e no longer finding my affinity in a language group. I am ‘ex-people’(loas) i.e. no longer finding my affinity in a people or national group. And finally, I am ex-nation (ethnos) i.e. no longer of this race or ethnic group.



Hi Bro. Ron,

I agree with this to an extent, but would like to suggest that the primary thing that we are called out of is this world system. For the sake of those who don't already know let me backtrack and say; The Greek word for Church is ekklesia, which essentially means "called out". It's where we get the English word "ecclesiastical" (clergy). In ancient Greece it meant an assembly called out by the crier . Christ called us out. But out of what?

You listed many things; but I would say that in the case of the Jews there are certain things which were still valid expressions of their faith in God in which God allowed them to take with them. They would find little meaning for us, but they are part of their own personal identity as a Jews. There is "neither male or female" also, but there still must be a distinction so that the male can maintain his identity as a 'male' and so on. Here we read; Is any man called being circumcised? let him not become uncircumcised. Is any called in uncircumcision? let him not be circumcised. Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God. (I Corinthians 7:18,19)

We see then, that the objective is to walk in the Spirit and in so doing fulfill the "spirit of the Law." But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter. What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet." (Romans 7:6,7)


Understand, I do not recognize Rabbinic Judaism or Pharisaical Judaism in any way to be accurate depictions of Biblical Judaism. The Nazarenes were the only valid sect within Judaism in the 1st Century. The Ebionites were too "Essene like" and radical to fit the biblical pattern of genuine faith. This is what the Messianics MUST come to terms with. They must resist the compulsion to become like the Rabbi's of today and emulate a post-biblical version of the Messiah and His Ekklesia. That is just as much a danger and provocation to Christ as anything worldly that could be done in the Church. I share the concerns that you express; but I am somewhat in the middle. I think we need to split the horns of this issue and find a Christ honoring, Biblical, position.

Jews are taught from a child in many cases to shun nearly everything about the Church. Centuries of this, some with warrant, and some with not, has created a difficult situation for us in reaching them unlike any other group.

Let me share one last story to make my point; A Messianic Believer I know told us a story of how he became a Christian and went back to see his Jewish parents. He was talking at one point to his father and opened his wallet only to have his student ID card from the seminary he attended fall to the floor. When his dad looked at it his countenance fell. He looked at his son as if to say; My son is dead!... My SON is DEAD!. The picture on the id was one of a sword shaped cross and the motto blazed across it, "THE CRUSADERS"

God Bless,

-Robert


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Robert Wurtz II

 2004/11/25 12:29Profile
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Joined: 2004/2/12
Posts: 4636
St. Joseph, Missouri

 Re:

Quote:
I haven't heard anyone say "they can't". I have heard Dr Eukel say 'we should' and I will oppose such Jusaizings as strongly as I can.



Brother Ron,

A person could tell me we "should" all they want and because I have celebrated Passover before I must say "I can't." The food does not match what I can commonly eat. :-? And with that, I had to just listen to the explainations. I know I looked silly, but wheeew! I still enjoyed the remembrance and all. ;-)

God Bless,

-Robert


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Robert Wurtz II

 2004/11/25 12:33Profile
Nasher
Member



Joined: 2003/7/28
Posts: 404
Watford, UK

 Re:

Quote:
To be true to your above statement



Sorry Robert, I didn't mean to confuse you but this is not my statement, it was a question from someone answered by John MacArthur.



Quote:
If we remember that there are Jews who will refuse to become like a gentile to be saved



No-one has to become like a gentile to be saved, every person must yield their life to Christ to be "saved".

Therefore I ask the question "why are Messianic Synagogues "necessary"?"



Quote:
This is not a push to make Gentiles Jews, we are trying to see the Gospel presented to them in a way that does not contain Roman influence. You have to get this or you will never win a Jew to Christ.



Robert, who is presenting the gospel here with Roman influence?
My task is to preach the gospel, it is the Holy Spirit who does the rest.



Quote:
If a Jew wants to keep Sabbath they have all the rights in the world to do it so long as they do it lawfully



What do you mean "lawfully"? Which law?



Quote:
Christians esteem Sunday as the new Christian "Sabbath."



Not this one.



Quote:
Most evangelicals will question your spirituality of you do not recognize Sunday as the "Lord's Day" or the "First day of the week."



The "Lord's Day" and the Sabbath Day are/were different things.



Quote:
Most preachers preach tithe and not circumcision?



Not this one.




My Summation:

Colossians 2:6
As ye have therefore received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk ye in him


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Mark Nash

 2004/11/25 13:23Profile
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Posts: 6566
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 Re:

Quote:
The Nazarenes were the only valid sect within Judaism in the 1st Century.

Valid to whom? My understanding is that Nazarene is simply what orthodox Jews called Christians. The term was originally used of Jewish converts but perhaps later applied to all ‘Christians’. [b] For we have found this man a pestilent fellow, and a mover of sedition among all the Jews throughout the world, and a ringleader of the [u]sect of the Nazarenes[/u]: [/b] (Act 24:5 KJV) The Greek for sect is ‘heresy’ but ‘heresy’, in Greek, means a sectarian group rather than a doctrinal aberration. I understand that ‘Nazarenes’ were not officially excluded from synagogue worship and branded ‘heretics’ until the Bar Kokhba revolt of 135AD. I understand that the ‘Nazarenes’ refused to take part in the Bar Kokhba revolt.

This single reference to Nazarenes in the New Testament is significant coming as it does in a passage where it comes from the lips of a hostile witness. Both ‘Nazarene’ and ‘Christian’ were derogatory accusations in their first usage.

I think the Nazarenes were tolerated in Judaism rather than validated. There must have been fascinating variety of gatherings in the early days of the church. There was variety but unity. Paul split the believers away from the synagogue in Ephesus; [b] And he went into the synagogue, and spake boldly for the space of three months, disputing and persuading the things concerning the kingdom of God. But when divers were hardened, and believed not, but spake evil of that way before the multitude, he departed from them, and separated the disciples, disputing daily in the school of one Tyrannus. [/b] (Act 19:8-9 KJV) In James the expected hearers are in a synagogue; [b] For if there come into your synagogue a man with a gold ring, in fine clothing, and there come in also a poor man in vile clothing; [/b] (Jam 2:2 ASV) Some synagogue congregations were plainly moving in one direction while others were moving in the opposite direction.

The Ebionites are an interesting group who might well have called themselves Messianic Jews had they been familiar with the phrase. Not that I am accusing Messianic Jews of Ebionite error. I am referring to their determination to hold on to their heritage that isolated and ultimately doomed them. There seems some evidence from textual criticism that they had their own translated versions of some New Testament documents and no doubt their insistence upon their historic terminology further separated them from their Gentile brethren.

My position on this is really quite simple. I believe there is only One Church. I do not believe there is a Gentile church and a Jewish church; in fact, I think that view would be heresy. I don’t believe there is an American church either or a British church. I don’t even accept Wesley’s separation into the ‘church militant’ and the ‘church triumphant’; there is One Church. From the two He made One, not One of two halves but One. This is not a weld but a new alloy which includes each and does not add one group to a previously existing group. This is new. I will build my church (ekklesia) must have been an astonishing statement to Jews who already regarded themselves as part of the ekklesia (of Qahal) of God. I oppose children’s church and youth church, because the idea of such a thing militates against One Body and One Church. I am not in favour of an English church in Jerusalem nor of a Hebrew church in New York; any such defining adjectives undermine the concept of One Church.

It was Peter’s action in establishing a pattern of separate meetings that provoked Paul’s action recorded in Galatians. [b] For prior to the coming of certain men from James, he [u]used to eat[/u] with the Gentiles; but when they came, he [u]began to withdraw[/u] and [u]hold himself aloof[/u], fearing the party of the circumcision. [/b](Gal 2:12 NASB) The NASB tries to capture the mood here with its tenses but in fact the tenses I have underlined are all ‘imperfect tense’ which translates as ‘was eating, was withdrawing, was setting himself apart’. A new pattern was emerging and Paul took it by the throat! If he hadn’t, the result would have been two churches throughout Galatia; Jewish Christians and Gentile Christians. What a travesty that would have been to God’s intention to ‘make both one’.


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Ron Bailey

 2004/11/25 13:43Profile





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