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philologos
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Joined: 2003/7/18
Posts: 6566
Reading, UK

 Re:

Hi Jeff
In terms of what God said to Israel under the covenant of Mount Sinai, "You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your strength. And these words which I command you today shall be in your heart." Duet 6:5-6 This applied to the nation of Israel.

this was a command which Israel broke.


"...My covenant which they broke through I was a husband to them says the Lord. But this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord; I will put My law in their minds, and write it on their hearts; I will be their God, and they shall be My people." Jeremiah 33:32-33

this one is a promise which God keeps.

love to you, by brother,


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Ron Bailey

 2003/12/23 5:12Profile
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 Re:

Quote:
I am not accusing you. I am trying to focus on a teaching which exalts Christ after He has been obedient. This is a teaching of JWs.



Wheter or not a particular teaching is held by the JWs should not bother us. Our concern is wheter or not it is scriptural.

The bible is essentialy a book of the ages. God dwells in eternity where there is no past present or future (I can't begin to get my mind around that) but He created the ages and has used them as a canvas on which to paint his masterpiece. They were created in and by Christ before the foundation of the world. They ages have a begginning a middle and an end, they follow one another in a chronological order; there are ages past, this present age, and ages to come. The wonder of it all is that Christ himself the creator of the ages has entered into them. The artist has entered the painting. For the most part the bible deals with events as they happen in time, as its written to us who dwell in time. So when we read of Christ's exaltation happening at a certain time (and we do read of it thus) it doesn't mean that he wasn't exalted previously "in eternity". In fact Jesus said in John 17:5 [i]And now, Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.[/i]

We read of Jesus being [u]given[/u] all authority; of him being exalted and [u]given[/u] a name the is above ever other name. Whats all that about? how could the Creator be given authority, or a name? only as part of the creation, as part of the "painting". these events all happend in time, in the ages; but in no way do they take from His eternal glory, which was before the ages.

In a similar way I can say that I was chosen in christ before the ages but that doesn't negate the fact that I said [i]yes Lord[/i] to Him at a certain point in time.

Stuart


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Stuart

 2003/12/23 7:53Profile
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 Re:

Thankyou for forgiving me as Christ has forgiven us.

Good afternoon brother Ron,

In response to your post, in Jeremiah 33:32, "My covenant" refers to Duet. 6:5-6. So the question remains, which covenant was Jeremiah and Moses talking about?

In Christ
Jeff


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Jeff Marshalek

 2003/12/23 11:12Profile
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Joined: 2003/6/3
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 Re:

Hi brother Stuart,

I am sorry for not pinpointing the nature of my statement about the Jws. You see as I reach out to them, I here over and over again the words of Scripture applied to the logic of man. They have developed a systematic arguement for tearing down the faith in Jesus' predestined work. They look to Hebrews 1:4 as one of the foundations on which their whole arguement rests.

As you have said, God exists outside of time. The Scriptures as they have been given to us have been revealed over 2000 years. What we have is the progression of revelation of God's work and plan for man. As time continued within the church age, we had the catholic church up until the time of Luther and Calvin. And then we have the influences of their thoughts. And now man continues to look to God through His revelation in Scripture. I see man continually in bondage to the thoughts of others. Yet the New Covenant teaches that no longer will man say know God for all shall know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them. This is the gift that Scripture teaches. In my short time as a believer, I have realized the weakness of His church comes from not realizing the magnitude of the gift we have in Jesus. Man continually debates about other men's thoughts. Men continually look to be fed by other men. Men continually live in the wilderness. The only solution to the wilderness experience is to believe every word in the Scriptures applies to us in some way or another. It is Christ through the Holy Spirit who lines up wonderfully the truth for us. I am trying to point men in the only direction I know that will be fruitful. Look onto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith. I point out these things to cause people to search the Scriptures for themselves. I am not the source, my thoughts can only sow or water, each one of us must come to hear His voice. Choose to be blind and believe what He tells you.

Sorry for going on this rant.
In Christ
Jeff


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Jeff Marshalek

 2003/12/23 12:15Profile
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 Re:

Ron wrote: pretaining to Genesis 3:15

Quote:
You will know that this verse is actually part of God's curse on the serpent. In that sense it is neither promise nor covenant but a prophetic threat issued at the point of Satan's apparent victory. A promise is a one of thing with no ongoing relationship.



"Then he showed me Joshua the high priest standing before the Angel of the Lord, and Satan standing at his right hand to oppose him. And the Lord said to Satan, The Lord rebuke you, Satan! The Lord who has chosen Jerusalem rebuke you! Is this not a brand plucked from the fire? Now Joshua was clothed with filthy garments, and was standing before Angel. Then He answered and spoke to those who stood before Him, saying Take away the filthy garments from him. And to him He said, See, I HAVE REMOVED YOUR INIQUITY FROM YOU, and I will clothe you with rich robes...Hear, O Joshua, the high priest. You and your companions who sit before you. For they are a wondrous sign; For behold, I am bringing forth MY SERVANT THE BRANCH, FOR BEHOLD, THE STONE THAT I HAVE LAID BEFORE JOSHUA; upon the stone are seven eyes..." Zechariah 3:1-10

I see God working out His plan for the redemption of faithful souls throughout history being played out as in the life of Joshua the high priest. Jesus removed the iniquity of Joshua and The SERVANT IS BEFORE JOSHUA ALONG WITH THE HOLY SPIRIT. Jesus is our High Priest in the order of Melchizedec.

In Christ
Jeff


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Jeff Marshalek

 2003/12/23 15:49Profile
philologos
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Joined: 2003/7/18
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 Re:

Jeff,
'amen' to the whole 'rant' :-P

I am indebted to a man, now with the Lord, who once told me. 'We have got to learn to read the Bible to see what it says and not what we have been told it says. Not what we think it should say but what it actually says. To that end I have covenanted with the Lord that, although I will listen to what other men may say, He will be my No 1 teacher'.

It was almost 40 years ago I first heard that and my stand now is what it became then.
"me too, Lord".


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Ron Bailey

 2003/12/23 15:53Profile
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 Re:

The battle for the souls of men in all generations requires that there be a priesthood continually in the order of Melchizedek.

In Christ
Jeff


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Jeff Marshalek

 2003/12/26 13:40Profile
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"Pilgrim and Sojourner." - 1 Peter 2:11

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 Re:

Quote:
The battle for the souls of men in all generations requires that there be a priesthood continually in the order of Melchizedek.


Yes Christ is a priest forever in the priesthood of Melchidzekek:

[b]Hebrews 7:17 (niv)[/b] - For it is delcared: "You are a priest forever in the order of Melchizedek."

[b]Hebrews 7:21 (niv)[/b] - but he became a priest with an oath when God said to him: "The Lord has sworn and will not change his mind: 'You are a priest forever.'"

[b]Hebrews 7:24 (niv)[/b] - but because Jesus lives forever, he has a permanent priesthood.

I also believe we share in this priesthood, as a representive of Christ to men.

[b]1 Peter 2:9 (niv)[/b] - But you are a chosen people, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people belonging to God, that you may declare the praises of him who called you out of darkness into his wonderful light.


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SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2003/12/26 13:51Profile
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 Re:

This was Jesus' command to Paul. "...I now send you, to open their eyes, in order to turn them from darkness to light, FROM THE POWER OF SATAN to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among those who are sanctified by faith in Me." The permanent priesthood brings us into the fellowship of saints. And like Paul we are called to turn them from darkness to light.

David in Psalm 110 stated, "The Lord said to my Lord...Thou art a priest forever after the order of Melchizedek." vs 1-4 This psalm covers past, present, and future. Let us seek to be sanctified by faith in Him.

"And for this reason He is the Mediator of the new covenant, by means of death, FOR THE REDEMPTION OF THE TRANSGRESSIONS UNDER THE FIRST COVENANT, that those who are called may receive the promise of the eternal inheritance." Hebrews 9:15 Are not all men condemned under the first covenant?

In Christ
Jeff


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Jeff Marshalek

 2003/12/29 22:43Profile
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Joined: 2003/6/3
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 Re:

"Which is easier, to say, "Your sins are forgiven you, or to say, "Rise up and walk? But that you may know that the Son of Man has power on earth to forgive sins..." Luke 5:23-24

The scribes and Pharisees thought to themselves, "Who is this who speaks blasphemies? Who can forgive sins but God alone?" Luke 5:21

The Pharisees were correct in thinking that only God could forgive sins. What they didn't understand was that Jesus was God. Likewise I believe that many make the same mistake in their understanding of Jesus' work prior to His incarnation. Jesus prior to the cross had the power to forgive sins.

His priesthood is everlasting, since the foundations of the world.

In Christ
Jeff


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Jeff Marshalek

 2004/1/6 11:26Profile





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