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repentcanada
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Joined: 2005/5/9
Posts: 659


 1 Corinthians 14:13

1 Cor 14:13 Wherefore let him that speaketh in an unknown tongue pray that he may interpret.

Just a question: why is there a lack of interpretation of tongues being spoken today. I hear of so many people who speak in tongues, yet I have never heard of any of them being interpreted.

Thanks

 2006/1/31 11:23Profile
Graftedbranc
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Joined: 2005/11/8
Posts: 619


 Re: 1 Corinthians 14:13

Quote:
Just a question: why is there a lack of interpretation of tongues being spoken today. I hear of so many people who speak in tongues, yet I have never heard of any of them being interpreted.



A New Christian once told me he was in a Charasmatic meeting where people would speak in tounges and another would rise up and give an interpretation.

He said. A person spoke in tounges, and the person sitting beside him began to give an interpretation. But before he was recognized another stood and began interpreting it. He said. "But they gave different interpretations"

This always stuck with me. It always seemed to me to be a waste of spiritual energy to have one speak gibberish and another "interprete". Why doesn't the Lord just give it in English if He is for direct inspiration?

I have always found it instructive thet the only book in the NT which addresses speaking in tounges is the book of 1 cor which is a rebuke of those imature believers who gloried in gifts but were way laking in Life and spiritual maturity.

Paul does not undermine the reality of thier gifts but seeks to lead them on to that which is on the Lord's heart. Not gifts but Christ Himself and the enjoyment of Christ and the living out of Christ and the building up of the Body of Christ. Fot this reason he elevated prophecy (speaking Christ) over tounges because to prophecy is to build up the body.

IN the New Testament, to prophecy is not to foretell the future as many have perverted it to be. But rather to speak forth Christ by the Spirit in a living way to impart Christ to others and to speak the Light recieved from the Word.

This was Paul's burden. Gifts and manifestations are for the beginner to encourage them. But Life and maturity and the building up of the body are the goal of God's economy and the purpose of all the epistles.

Graftedbranch

 2006/1/31 12:04Profile
PreachParsly
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Joined: 2005/1/14
Posts: 2164
Arkansas

 Re:

Quote:
It always seemed to me to be a waste of spiritual energy to have one speak gibberish and another "interprete". Why doesn't the Lord just give it in English if He is for direct inspiration?




1Cr 14:22 [b]Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to them that believe not[/b]: but prophesying [serveth] not for them that believe not, but for them which believe.


1Cr 14:23 If therefore the whole church be come together into one place, and all speak with tongues, and there come in [those that are] unlearned, or unbelievers, will they not say that ye are mad?


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Josh Parsley

 2006/1/31 12:19Profile
GaryE
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Joined: 2005/4/26
Posts: 376
Mifflinburg, Pennsylvania

 Re:


{Quote} Graftedbranch

It always seemed to me to be a waste of spiritual energy to have one speak gibberish and another "interprete".
.................................................

Graftedbranch, the gift of speaking in tounges is not gibberish. You obviously don't know any better than to speak this way though.

In Christ,
GaryE



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Gary Eckenroth

 2006/1/31 13:51Profile
RobertW
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Joined: 2004/2/12
Posts: 4636
Independence, Missouri

 Re:

Quote:
1Cr 14:23 If therefore the whole church be come together into one place, and [u]all[/u] speak with tongues, and there come in [those that are] unlearned, or unbelievers, will they not say that ye are mad?



Notice that this passage says 'all' and not a 'few', 'some', or even 'most.' If everyone were speaking with tongues I may 'think' that the folks were mad also if I were unlearned or an unbeliever. If it were the Day of Pentecost all over again, I may even say they were full of new wine, etc. No telling what I may think. However I think the clear emphasis in this passage is that there needs to be order to these things.


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Robert Wurtz II

 2006/1/31 14:09Profile
Quickend
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Joined: 2006/1/20
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 Re: 1 Corinthians 14:13

Quote:
"Just a question: why is there a lack of interpretation of tongues being spoken today. I hear of so many people who speak in tongues, yet I have never heard of any of them being interpreted"

I fear that there may indeed be a lack of both tounges and interpretation. Lord fogive me if I am in error, but the more difficult it is to authenticate a thing, the more abundant are the counterfits of it.


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Robert.High

 2006/1/31 14:36Profile
Josiah777
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Joined: 2004/2/17
Posts: 99
Sterling, VA

 Re: 1 Corinthians 14:13

Quote:

repentcanada wrote:
Just a question: why is there a lack of interpretation of tongues being spoken today. I hear of so many people who speak in tongues, yet I have never heard of any of them being interpreted.



I think one thing will help when you read tongues in the book of Acts and in 1 Corinthians 12-14 is their context. When tongues were manifested in the book of Acts (chapter 2, 10 and 19) it was the direct result of the outpouring of the Holy Spirit (i.e., baptism in the Holy Spirit, gift of the Spirit, Promise of the Father). You will notice in these Acts passages how all the participants spoke in tongues simultaneously. In the Acts 2 passages, there was a special sign given that we see nowhere else, namely, that the hearers from all over the world could understand the tongues. How they understood them, I do not know whether it was because these Spirit-filled Galileans spoke in the dialects themselves or the Holy Spirit granted an interpretation to the listeners. The how is not so important to Luke as that is did happen.

When you get into Paul's teachings in 1 Corinthians, the context is a church meeting. The Corinthians, as is well known, were disorderly because of pride and lack of love, so Paul brought some guidelines for which these gifts to flow. Therefore, Paul is giving guidelines for tongues as a gift to the body of believers, which needs to have an interpretation for it to edify that assembly. The Corinthians thought it was very spiritual to have multiple speakers just keep getting up, give a message in tongues, have no interpretation, and think they had a very spiritual meeting. Paul says not so. Therefore, you see his orderly correction in 14:27 to have two or at most three speak in a tongue, with an accompanying interpretation.

The gift of tongues in Acts that came with the outpouring of the Spirit was a special gift to praise the Lord, magnify God, bless, give thanks, etc. 'He who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men but to God...' (14:1). We know this is what prayer is. So God in the 'usual' sense of tongues is the intended recipient, not any individual. However, the Holy Spirit may of His own will during a believer's meeting use one, two or three believers to give a special tongue which is intended for that group of believers to hear its interpretation and receive a blessing. This special scenario is what Paul is speaking toward here. Some people have taken 12:30 'Do all speak with tongues?' out of context. The rhetorical answer is, of course, no. In context here, not every believer is going to give an utterance in tongues with an interpretation to build up the body of Christ. However, you cannot apply these guidelines to Acts. God wasn't restricting tongues to 'two or at most three' on the Day of Pentecost because He was the One receiving the blessing. As mentioned, He did so in a way that unbelievers could hear and understand. The house of Cornelius in Acts 10 was a good number of folks too. We don't know how many but Acts 10:24 says Cornelius invited 'his relatives and close friends' so that means more than 3 :) They all spoke with tongues. There was no interpretation required because these people were praying to God, who doesn't need it.

One comment about 1 Corinthains 14:23 about the whole church coming together and all speaking in tongues. It is an easy inference to think that means that every individual in the place is speaking in tongues all at once, like these accounts in Acts. However, read the next verse: 'But if all prophecy, and an unbeliever or an uninformed person comes in, he is convinced by all, he is judged by all.' Did Paul mean here by 'all prophecy' that every single person in the church was prophesying all at once. The obvious answer is no. He was speaking to tongues and prophecy in the assembly in the orderly manner of two or three. While it is true that the disciples were accused of being drunk with new wine on the Day of Pentecost for everybody speaking in tongues all at once, but that is not the context here.

When it says tongues are for a sign; they are, but are not limited to that. For as mentioned in 14:1 tongues are to pray to God; they are for Him. That is the most common expression of tongues as given in Scripture. So tongues have many purposes we can see--an individual's communion with his heavenly Father, a sign to unbelievers, a gift to the body of Christ.

I know this is a controversial topic, but we should stick what the Bible says about it. Just because the devil has his counterfeits doesn't mean we should abandon the real thing. The real thing is what brings glory to God.


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Ken Marino

 2006/2/3 13:08Profile
joelshack
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Joined: 2005/11/29
Posts: 5
Oklahoma

 Re:

I think it is fair that I explain speaking in tongues in 3 parts: scriptural definition, purpose, and application in modern worship. My study and examination of this topic centered around 1 Corinthians 12 and 14, and Acts 2.

First, there are two distinct phrases Paul uses to describe this: “tongue” and “tongues”. Grammatically, one is plural the other not. By the way, I am studying out of the NKJV. In 1 Cor 14: 2 “For he who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men but to God, for no one understands him; however, in the spirit he speaks mysteries.” And 1 Cor 14: 4 “he who speaks in a tongue edifies himself, but he who prophesies edifies the church.” Here Paul is basically saying that the person that speaks in a “tongue” is arrogant, (edifies himself). I don’t think you want to fall into that category. We are told to be humble and meek. That is what the Lord is after, people that don’t want the attention. People that lock themselves in a closet and pray. The next definition of “tongues” is referring to a known language. 1 Cor 14: 6, “But now, brethren, if I come to you speaking with tongues, what shall I profit you unless I speak to you either by revelation, by knowledge, by prophesying, or by teaching?” I hope you see the difference, if you continue to read after verse 6 in Chapter 14, Paul describes an instruments that doesn’t make a “distinct sound” how can they be known. He goes on, a trumpet that doesn’t sound like a trumpet is useless. I paraphrase, but you get the picture. If our language is slurred together in a jibberish context, it is like a useless trumpet in war.

Second, Paul says “tongues” (notice I didn’t say “tongue”) is inferior to prophecy, and it is for unbelievers. “tongues” could be used in todays worship if there were people visiting from Brazil, or Russia that didn’t know English, and if the Lord willed it, I believe the Spirit would enable those people to hear the Gospel and trust in Christ.

Finally, as mentioned earlier “tongues” is for a distinct language barrier. I do not see any where in scripture mentioning a prayer language. On the day of Pentecost, believers starting speaking in known languages (Acts 2:4) “And they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.” Again notice the plural use of the word “tongues”

I think the “gift of Tongues” is a true gift of the Spirit. There is no denying that. I think it is misapplied monumentally in today’s worship. This is where so many people are misled teaching false doctrines. People want to look at 1 Cor 14:2, and say that is their prayer language to God. That is incorrect. Paul never describes any unorthodox, spur of the moment tongue speaking. It was always methodical and systematic.

This is a topic that has been rehashed several times over and over again. I really think most Christians are sincere in wanting more of God. The bible says we are “sealed with the Holy Spirit (Eph 1:13).” I interpret this as one time event. We don’t receive a second “dose” of the Holy Spirit. He dwells in us once we repent and accept Christ.

Again, I want to emphasize this is something I believe from interpretation of scripture. If you genuinely believe something….search the scripture…God’s word has the answer.

Peace and Grace
Joel


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Joel Shackelford

 2006/2/17 19:42Profile
GaryE
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Joined: 2005/4/26
Posts: 376
Mifflinburg, Pennsylvania

 Re:

{Quote} Joel

If our language is slurred together in a jibberish context, it is like a useless trumpet in war.

The gift of the Holy Spirit of speaking in tounges is not jibberish. You obviously have not learned that yet.
………………………………………………………………………………………………………………

{Quote} Joel}

The bible says we are “sealed with the Holy Spirit (Eph 1:13).” I interpret this as one time event. We don’t receive a second “dose” of the Holy Spirit. He dwells in us once we repent and accept Christ.

Act 8:14 Now when the apostles which were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent unto them Peter and John:
Act 8:15 Who, when they were come down, prayed for them, that they might receive the Holy Ghost:
Act 8:16 (For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.)
Act 8:17 Then laid they their hands on them, and they received the Holy Ghost.

So Joel, you must think that these people who were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus hadn’t accepted Christ yet. Do you believe that the disciples had accepted Christ before Pentecost? If so, wasn’t that a separate experience?

Consider that there is a difference between the words sealed, baptized, indwelling, and filling.
……………………………………………………………………………………………………………..

Act 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Act 2:39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

Joel, aren’t you called?
……………………………………………………………………………………………………………..

Act 4:31 And when they had prayed, the place was shaken where they were assembled together; and they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and they spake the word of God with boldness.

They were all filled.
……………………………………………………………………………………………………………

Act 10:42 And he commanded us to preach unto the people, and to testify that it is he which was ordained of God to be the Judge of quick and dead.
Act 10:43 To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins.
Act 10:44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.
Act 10:45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.

The Holy Ghost fell on all that heard the word.
…………………………………………………………………………………………………………

Act 11:15 And as I began to speak, the Holy Ghost fell on them, as on us at the beginning.
Act 11:16 Then remembered I the word of the Lord, how that he said, John indeed baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost.
Act 11:17 Forasmuch then as God gave them the like gift as he did unto us, who believed on the Lord Jesus Christ; what was I, that I could withstand God?

This gift that fell on them as at the beginning was the gift of speaking in an unlearned tounge.
…………………………………………………………………………………………………………..

Joe 2:28 And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out my spirit upon all flesh; and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions:
Joe 2:29 And also upon the servants and upon the handmaids in those days will I pour out my spirit.


Isa 28:11 For with stammering lips and another tongue will he speak to this people.
Isa 28:12 To whom he said, This is the rest wherewith ye may cause the weary to rest; and this is the refreshing: yet they would not hear.


Luk 11:13 If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?



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Gary Eckenroth

 2006/2/18 0:14Profile
Logic
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Joined: 2005/7/17
Posts: 1791


 Re: 1 Corinthians 14:13

Quote:
Just a question: why is there a lack of interpretation of tongues being spoken today? I hear of so many people who speak in tongues, yet I have never heard of any of them being interpreted.



The gift of tongues is a much-abused gift. Many speak in tongues of there own will and not as "the Spirit gives them utterance."

I don't speak or pray in tongues because I haven't yet received the gift. I have a friend who, I believe, truly has the gift. He told me that he was praying in tongues to God once and then God lifted the gift. He then tried to keep praying in "tongues and God spoke to his spirit saying, "Stop It!". He then stoped and will never try in his own effort again.

He once told me how the experience of speaking or praying in tongues is like. It is like as when you pray, you gradually become filled with the Holy Spirit. Moreover, when you are full of the Holy Spirit and when the gift of tongues comes upon you, it is like a cup full of water filled to the rim about to spill over. When you then put an ice cube in that same cup full of water, what happens? It cannot help but over flow. It is the same with tongues.

The Gift of tongues should be in the form of a [b]prayer[/b] when interpreted since it is a prayer to God in the first place. Prayers can be in many forms like praise or in v.16 blessing and giveing thanks, or in any way anyone can pray.
1Corinth. 14:14 For if I [b]pray[/b] with a tongue, my spirit [b]prays[/b], but my understanding is unfruitful.
:15 What is it then? I will [b]pray with the spirit[/b], but I will pray also with the understanding; I will sing with the spirit, but I will sing also with the understanding.
:16 Since otherwise, if thou blessest with the spirit, how shall he who fills the place of the simple Christian say Amen, [b]at thy giving of thanks[/b], since he does not know what thou sayest?

My own church in the error with the gift of tongues also. Every time some one speaks in tongues there is always an interpretation in the form of a prophesy and my friends and I who are learned, can tell when it is contrived and from the fleash. It is also never a real language, it is always a contrived made up language. Some "pray in tongues" useing the same made up word over and over again like "honday, honday, honday." There is no natural language on Earth that makes any sense using the same word over and over, so the Spirit would be the same if not more so.

I ask my self, if it really is from God, why they always need "tongues" when a prophesy is needed and not just prophecy alone. My guess is that people who are not learned in the gifts or taught correctly, when they are at Church singing and praising God, they feel a great rush of emotion. When that happens, they feel that they want to express it spiritually so they "speak forth in tongues". Then the church is so expecting an interpretation that some one speaks out in the form of prophesy, even thought it is doctrinally sound what they speak out, it is still not the true gifts.

Don’t get a wrong idea, God really does move at times. There are times when God moves and would give someone an Utterance of Tongues and there is a true interpretation with it, and it is usually in the form a prayer and some time in song. In addition, there are times when, at bible studies, and during prayer time, someone has spoken in a tongue then an interpretation is given and it was a Word of wisdom or of Knowledge or even prophesy, but the gift is usually a real language.
But for the most part, the Gift of Tongues if a form of prayer.

Joel wrote:
Quote:
And 1 Cor 14: 4 “he who speaks in a tongue edifies himself, but he who prophesies edifies the church.” Here Paul is basically saying that the person that speaks in a “tongue” is arrogant, (edifies himself)



I think you have the wrong spirit of what Paul is saying. It is not wrong to edify your self.
Aren't you edifying yourself when you read the Bible? When you pray with understanding? When you pray with understanding you edify yourself and the one being prayed for and the listeners.
My friend sais he is edified when God lets hom pray in tongues.

Joel also wrote:
Quote:
People want to look at 1 Cor 14:2, and say that is their prayer language to God. That is incorrect



reread 1Corinth. 14:14-16. it is a prayer language.
You are correct in that it isn't [b]their[/b] prayer language but it is Gods with which He give to us.

Also:
Quote:
(Eph 1:13).”I interpret this as one time event. We don’t receive a second “dose” of the Holy Spirit. He dwells in us once we repent and accept Christ.



True, but don't forget

Ephes. 5:18 "And be not drunk with wine, wherein is excess; but continue being filled with the Spirit;"

This is not a one time event. We need to continue being filled because we are being poured out of all day.

 2006/2/18 2:46Profile





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