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Discussion Forum : Articles and Sermons : Did Ravenhill ever hear about the Toronto / Brownsville "revivals"?

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brentw
Member



Joined: 2005/12/14
Posts: 440
Ohio

 Re:

Did L.Ravenhill Know about the revival?
Answer: I talked with a brother who witnessed Ravenhill hear a testimony about one of these "revivals". "When Ravenhill heard about it his face became pale white (sick)." -This was in a prayer meeting. Some said this is what ended his life after hearing about such a thing.


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Brent

 2005/12/21 11:57Profile
Forevidence
Member



Joined: 2004/7/29
Posts: 711
Riverside

 Re:

Hey bro I am not a cessationist!

I am all for dreams, visions, and etc.

But there are manifestations that Brownsville and Toronto supported that were not biblcal.

And second I am not the enemy here...

I just wanted to give you some things to think about.

Now I agree with you on the issue that he was mentoring them but once again, Jesus discipled Judas. And Judas heard all Jesus' sermons.

I'm not saying those men are Judas.' but to think they were right on just because they were discipled by someone holy implies nothing.

Also about David Ravenhill. I know those things. David decided to stay here in UsA for that reason. But there is a split here as well, because the other son, Paul Ravenhill, left The USA with Martha Ravenhill because they believe that Leonard Ravenhill was the last prophet here to the USA, and that America has no hope. Paul doesn't seem to endorse the things done over in Toronto.

So, once again just giving you some things to think about.


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Giancarlo

 2005/12/21 12:01Profile
brentw
Member



Joined: 2005/12/14
Posts: 440
Ohio

 Re:

I've talked with Paul R. and I confirm what you said. He's done with America.


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Brent

 2005/12/21 12:39Profile
sj
Member



Joined: 2005/12/16
Posts: 83


 Re:

brentw,
The revivals started after Ravenhills death if i have my time line correct..so i find this a little difficult to believe.
Also i know virtually nothing (first hand) about tornonto. And i DONT listen to slander so i reserve judgment on that one.
Repentance was preached at Brownsville, sinners were saved. End of story.

Also,
What manifestations violated what specific Scripture?

 2005/12/22 8:57Profile
brentw
Member



Joined: 2005/12/14
Posts: 440
Ohio

 Re:

SJ,
What I was told about Ravenhill hearing about the "revival" was told to me from a revalist a very dear saint.(older man). He was in the meeting first hand. Believe what you may but this is what a man of God told me.(He was their)
He also heard Paul R. preach in person.
In Him, Brent


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Brent

 2005/12/28 15:57Profile
Cwhite52
Member



Joined: 2008/1/4
Posts: 1


 Re: Fruit of Toronto

A fruit of the meeting in Toronto was the transformation that took place of two burnt out missionaries Heidi and Rolland Baker. They went from 18 years as missionaries in Africa only establishing 3 churches, to over 10,000 churches in the following 6 years after the Toronto outpouring. I've met multiple eye witnesses to the miracles that have happened in her ministry in Africa, and they're not the type of person to exagerate anything. It's not just the miracles either, the geniuness of love that the Bakers and others on their staff have for people and their sacrifice is tremendous. If interested check out a video recently made about their ministry: Compelled By Love.

Bill Johnson who was a pastor out of nowheresville CA recommitted to the Lord in Toronto that he would give the rest of His life to pursue a genuine move of God "and never change the subject." A few years later, he was asked to come to Bethel Church in Redding, CA with this vision, and Bethel has become an epocenter of God's movement in healing and restoring lives. The internationally known worship group Jesus Culture came out of Bethel church. Birthed out of Bill and his staff's desire to make worshipping God on Sunday, the most important thing.

A close relative of mine had an encounter with God like this when she was touring Israel with a Presbyterian church group. In the middle of a night where they were gathered in a room praying, she was filled with joy and bursting out laughing uncontrollably for a considerable amount of time, to the point where she was became embarrassed. She couldn't explain what happened for years, until she heard about some of the things that happened in Toronto.

As far as it being in the Bible or not, when we say that something isn't in scripture, it's important to remember that there were many things that happened for the first time in the scripture itself. These things did not defy the teachings of previous scripture, but instead they were occurences of God moving that further displayed what God wanted to do, unlike teaching which brings definition to truth. Think of how crazy Mary must have been considered for telling people she had a virgin birth... virgin birth had never previously happened anywhere in the Torah. Jesus spitting on dirt and rubbing it a blind man's eyes. Peter's shadow healing people. Paul's tunic. The Holy Spirit being released over gentiles. If you bring in Old Testament, looking at some of the prophet's visions and miracles I could write a book on how crazy or messeed up they sounded. Crazy: Isaiah running around naked as a prophetic sign (Is 20). Messed up: Elisha cursing some kids for calling him bald and them being mauled by bears (2 Kings 2).

 2014/2/12 22:27Profile
sermonindex
Moderator



Joined: 2002/12/11
Posts: 36836
"Pilgrim and Sojourner." - 1 Peter 2:11

Online!
 Re:


Of alot of messages about the Toronto meetings this message by Art Katz rings the most true of the danger of not being a lover of the truth. I highly recommend all listen to it. God is able to use all things for the good.


The Love Of The Truth by Art Katz
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kKhyjDdMWOE


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SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2014/2/12 22:37Profile









 Re:

Quote:
by sj on 2005/12/22 8:57:40

brentw,
The revivals started after Ravenhills death if i have my time line correct..so i find this a little difficult to believe.
Also i know virtually nothing (first hand) about tornonto. And i DONT listen to slander so i reserve judgment on that one.
Repentance was preached at Brownsville, sinners were saved. End of story.

Also,
What manifestations violated what specific Scripture?



You don't know if anyone was saved. Salvation is not a one time event, it is a walk. Walking the aisle and getting your ticket punched means nothing. "He that endures till the end shall be saved".

 2014/2/12 22:53
Mangan
Member



Joined: 2007/4/19
Posts: 161
Sweden (Northern Europe)

 Re:

Len died before the revival but he would certainly have been positive of the Brownsville Revival since his friends Steve Hill and Dr Michael Brown and later on even his son David Ravenhill were doing the Lord's work there.

Len, always said that he rather had fire (real revival) with some smoke (i.e. false and carnal people acting wierd) than no fire at all. He also reminded his hearers to be careful not to judge something of not being of God just because it looked a bit different; the lasting fruit is what counts.

Sincerely Magnus, Sweden


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Magnus Nordlund

 2014/2/13 7:33Profile
TMK
Member



Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 5185
NC, USA

 Re:

Anyone who calls Michael Brown a false prophet is a fool. If you took the time to listen to even a smattering of his many many sermons available online you would realize this.

Dr. Browns fellowhip, FIRE Church in Concord NC is pastored by a man(Scott Volk) who at least partially grew up under the teaching of Art Katz at Ben Israel. Art Katz was a mentor and friend of Dr. Brown, and this ministry.

I think there is a major distinction, from what I have seen and heard between Toronto and Brownsville. I have listened to many many sermons preached during Brownsville (many of which used to be available on fireonthealtar.com but may still be available elsewhere.

I am not saying Brownsville was perfect (what revival is?) and there is going to be some outlier behavior as in every revival. But to say there wasn't true repentance or true salvations that resulted is a tad silly. The same could be said of the Welsh revival, the Hebrides Revival or (gasp) the day of Pentecost revival.


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Todd

 2014/2/13 8:56Profile





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