Los Angeles, California
| Divorce and Remarriage|
The following is a quote from a homosexual activist, Elroy McKinley: http://www.elroy.net/ehr/gay.html from a excerpt of Sister Cheryl's testimony "Why I Repented Of A Marriage God Called Adulterous" found on her website - http://poovy.8m.com/remarriage.html
This Quote from homosexual activist Elroy McKinley is defiantly worth reading, contemplation and discussion.
A divorced man who remarries is entering into an adulterous relationship. And it's not just a relationship; it's an adulterous lifestyle because the remarried man chooses to continue living in the adulterous relationship for the rest of his life (or until he divorces and remarries again). However, if you ask this adulterous man if he is still a Christian, he will say something like, I believe God has forgiven me and I'm now living under his grace. And ask him if he's willing to leave his current wife in order to turn from his adulterous lifestyle, and he will refuse because God's grace has already saved him. But this is the same man who earlier claimed that the homosexual must turn from his sinful lifestyle as a condition of receiving God's grace.
. . .
The Religious Right is nearly half-full with people living in continuous adulterous lifestyles, and those who are not remarried fully accept their remarried brothers and sisters without question. They even perform their adulterous marriage ceremonies in their churches. Yet they have the gall to preach from their pulpits or shout through the airwaves that God wants us to stop the world from accepting homosexuals the same way they have been accepted by God.
Jesus warned us not to be like the servant who was forgiven his debt by the grace of his lord but then used the legal system to throw a fellow slave in jail. The Religious Right, however, claim God's grace for their own lifestyle sins but then turn around and give tremendous amounts of time and money to use the legal system against homosexuals.
It is a double standard. It is a mockery. If Christ took their sins to the cross, and became an adulterer through propitiation before burying that sin in the ground, then Christ also took the gay person's sin to the cross and became a homosexual before burying that sin in the ground. The Religious Right, and everyone else, should either accept that God's grace covers all of us, including those living in sinful lifestyles, or that none of us are covered. They should either condemn their remarried members or shut up about those among us who are gay.
But they don't. And we are left to wonder why.
Why do they pick on one sinful lifestyle but not their own? Why homosexuality and not adultery? They say it's because homosexuality is damaging our families and hurting our children. But which is really worse? Over 50% of American parents get divorced. Most of those remarry. Over 50% of our children have their families torn apart and then merged with the families of strangers (causing a lot of sexual abuse on children by step-parents). But less than 5% of the population is homosexual. Even if they had twice as many relationships as heterosexuals do, they could not possibly cause the kind of damage that heterosexual divorce and remarriage does.
The former vice-president of Focus on the Family, a leading Religious Right organization, stated in his book, James Dobson's War on America (Dobson is the founder and president) that when their donations went down, they could simply broadcast a scary special about the gay agenda (or the evil women's movement or the even more evil abortion rights groups but never remarried people since that would drive away nearly half of their listeners) and their revenues would increase substantially.
There are some very eye opening truths in Mr. McKinleys article. Homosexuals understand what the Bible says about remarriage but so few Christians know, or should I say want to know. Its pretty sad when a homosexual can see the hypocrisy of the modern church and most Christians cannot.
Mr. McKinley is not alone in this observation other homosexuals as well have challenged us to prove that marriage is worth keeping. They are basically saying and they are quite right, as shocking as it may be that a homosexual marriage by two people who love each other and are committed to each other, is every bit as valid and every bit a biblical as remarriage while your first spouse is still living. Basically, these homosexuals are stuffing our feet in our own mouths as evangelical Christians, leaving us with no moral authority to make the argument against homosexual marriages. Few Christian leaders, pastors and preachers purporting to want to rebuild our families will even touch on this sin of divorce and remarital adultery lying under the skirts of the church. The homosexual activists are using this against us, and doing a very efficient job.
This should shock the church back to it senses, to look at this subject in light of Gods word. But is this happening? On any given Sunday morning a large portion of the people sitting in the churches of America including their pastors are either adulterers or fornicators according to biblical standards. They are in violation of Gods holy Word, and are unwittingly taking the lead in tearing down and desecrating the American family. In fact, so bad is this situation, that the divorce rate in the church is 4% higher than the nation as a whole and in the Bible belt with the greatest concentration of so-called evangelical churches, the divorce rate is 50% higher than in the nation as a whole! With such a situation, how can we ever be capable of winning any culture wars? This is basically the pot calling the kettle black.
I dont know of a single prominent ministry in this country, especially those that purport to be rebuilding the family, which will focus on their own constituency and address them on the issue of divorce and remarriage. They will not do it. So now we the church have set ourselves up for absolute defeat. We have absolutely no moral authority to speak against the homosexuals who insist on their right to marriage. We dont have righteousness in this nation, we dont even have righteousness in the church. In our nation pastors have a divorce rate that is the second highest in this country! If this sounds unbelievable, check the statistics for yourself! Visit http://www.saveus.org for the statistics. George Barna, pollster to the church, has spent the last ten years gathering statistics on this and many other issues involving the church.
Until the church from pulpit to pew repents of this matter, the church is and will continue to be powerless in winning the lost. Racked with its own adultery and fornication, it has the nerve to hypocritically point the finger at homosexuals and their lifestyle while preachers and pastors remain silent on divorce and remarriage. Homosexuals make up about 5% of the population but have more of an impact on society than the church does.
Christ is returning for a spotless bride. Will he find it in the American churches? Why would a homosexual want to enter our church gates if all he sees is hypocrisy on our part? I cant blame the homosexuals; I no longer want to attend many of the so-called Christian churches of our day either. Since the religious leaders of our day remain silent, it is we the rocks who cry out against the unrighteousness within the church walls. If someone doesnt speak against this, the church will spiral more toward the apostate church predicted by Christ in the end times. I cringe now when I hear a pastor speak of the sin of homosexuals, while not willing to speak of the sin of remarital adultery! Just because our denominations have changed their interpretations of the scriptures in the last 50 years does not mean that the word of God has changed.
| 2005/9/6 16:05||Profile|
| Re: Divorce and Remarriage|
This is a difficult subject for me as i am on the hurting end. My ex-wife left (divorced) me 10 years ago because she said, God told her to.
She said this to our pastor and to my mother both of which were her mentors. Since my ex divorced me and also, momma passing away 3 years ago, i am so alone, lonely and hurt ever day of my life. I hate not being married. I miss it. I've been single and not even dated since my ex left me.
| 2005/9/6 16:59||Profile|
Before we re-run the tapes on this, it might be a good thing to read [url=http://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?viewmode=flat&order=0&topic_id=3334&forum=36&post_id=&refresh=Go]Marriage/divorce - remarriage.[/url]
| 2005/9/6 17:34||Profile|
North West England
Tommy, my heart goes out to you, It may be little comfort but Jesus promises to look after the widows and orphans, I am sure He will comfort you too.
I am one of the few people I know who believe remarriage is wrong, I know many Christians who are in their second marriage and I understand the excuises they use. But I believe God wants us to be faithful to our first Spouse until death and I thank you, Tommy that you have the strength to stick to what you believe.
Remember that you are bringing Honour to Gods Name each day you continue to stand up for His word.
A note on Homosexuality, what the guy said was true, but it only shows that there is hypocracy in the church, it is not a reason to stay in a gay lifestyle when you know it is wrong.
I am neither Gay nor Divorced so I guess my opinion is only worth 2 cents.
| 2005/9/6 17:40||Profile|
| Re: Truth on Marriage, Divorce and Remarriage|
Dear Allhavesinned and ChristisKing,
I am encouraged that you both stood up and defended Biblical teaching on the sin of remarriage after divorce. It is rare indeed to find any in this generation that know the truth and have the courage to stand opposed to the fallen church on this subject, let alone finding two of you at once. How did you come to realize the truth when nearly all others are blind and falling in the ditch?
I look forward to finding out what made the rare difference with you. May God bless you as you follow Him.
| 2005/9/6 19:47||Profile|
| Re: Divorce and Remarriage|
Just because our denominations have changed their interpretations of the scriptures in the last 50 years does not mean that the word of God has changed.
Before I go on, I want to state clearly that what follows is not an excuse, justification, or defense. It is my experience, and it may encourage some who read this. At the same time it may offend others. If I do offend, please forgive me, I write this because I too believe that I serve the Lord.
Even though I agree with everything that brother Patrick writes, I have to go on the record, that I am married for the second time. My first wife was very discontented with me and to make a long story short, we divorced. The fact that I became a Christian was the last nail in the coffin of our marriage, as she stated. I did not want to divorce. After we divorced and she re-married. I always taught the young people and adult classes at our church that one should never marry again after a divorce.
When I understood, after being single for over 10 years, the Lord to say to me that I should get married again, I questioned it seriously. I had no desire, but this is what I understood. I studied Scriptures and various interpretations about re-marriage. One Scripture in particular stood out: "And I say to you, whoever divorces his wife, except for immorality, and marries another woman commits adultery." (Matthew 19:9). In my case I didnt want the divorce; my wife had the affair and then married another man. I forgave her, but she wanted out.
I did find a Christian lady who had been single and unattached for her entire life, and after continually seeking the Lord, we married. Prior to this, I did contact my first wife and asked if she was willing to reconsider the choices she had made, but she didnt. Some or maybe many of you may find this hard to accept or understand, but my life as a Christian has grown exponentially. Since I am married with a Christian woman, we counsel Christian couples who have difficulties in their marriage. We also counsel women who are unequally yoked and disciple with respect to forgiveness and intercessory prayer for their partners and children.
Since my youngest daughter was suicidal during the separation and my son struggled for many years after the divorce, I am convicted that if a marriage can be saved, even after adultery, it should be done. God can and will grant forgiveness and healing after repentance. Having said this, when I see a woman with bruises on her face and body from physical abuse and this continues after the husband has been counseled, I never recommend that women have to remain in this situation. Even though this is not adultery, I dont believe for one moment that husbands are allowed to physically abuse their wives and they have to stay under the same roof with them.
I unequivocally agree with brother Patrick that the Church has no business to tell the world how to live or how to behave, since She doesnt know how to obey Gods Word. Jesus never told the world how to live neither did he lead a protest march to Rome to complaint to the Emperor. He only scolded the religious leaders, never the political ones according to my knowledge. Paul tells us to pray for our leaders, not to tell them how to run the country.
The Lord gave me a message for the Church. She has to repent and return to His word and obey it. If the fact that I am married for the second time takes away from that warning, it is up to God to deal with that. Before the Church condemns the world She has to look within Herself first.
In His Love,
| 2005/9/6 21:58||Profile|
| Re: Divorce and Remarriage|
Thanks Patrick for posting some of my testimony.
It is a very difficult thing to repent of an adulterous remarriage.
But it's also a more difficult thing to kick against the pricks of the Holy Spirit's conviction. I remember distinctly the Lord trying to tell me not to marry a divorced man. I even went and cried telling my mom that I couldn't marry this man. But in time I listened to other christians and my selfish desires instead of God and went on into the adulterous marriage.
As far as the Word of God goes there are many who say this verse doesn't mean this and that verse wasn't translated right and so on, but I have found that we are led by the Spirit. The Holy Spirit will convict and teach you the scripture. Romans 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God. Romans 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
The Holy Spirit and the Word of God convicted me of being in remarital adultery, and believe me I had enough people to try to explain it all away, inluding pastors. And I've read just about every viewpoint on Divorce and Remarriage, but I will not be swayed by men. So none of what folks bring up on these boards is new to me. I've read it all before. I am led by the Spirit and when the Spirit convicts of sin we must repent.
Most of the time people who are under strong conviction of the Holy Spirit run to and fro trying to find some way to quench that conviction and explain it away.
I'm a very private person and in some ways it is a difficult thing to have my testimony on the web for so many to see but I feel the need for people to see the truth on this issue.
I don't debate this issue much. I know what the word of God has to say about it.
My testimony is at http://poovy.8m.com
| 2005/9/6 22:38||Profile|
North West England
I've just gone to the link Ron posted, I didn't read all 13 pages! This is why I very seldom comment upon remarriage after devorce. The couple that took us through our Marriage Matters course were both remarried and so were the other 2 couples in our group. It's a sticky subject, some people believe God has told them to remarry, others say that even living with an abusive spouse does not mean you may leave ("for better or for worse"). I have my own opinion and it is very black and white. I may be wrong, in this case I am happy to be wrong, but until I see something to convince me that God alows someone to have sex with a person other than their first spouse, I will keep my beliefs (to myself if necessary) and pray that my wife doesn't leave me and make me put my money where my mouth is.;-)
I think that it is possible for someone to live in 'sin' under grace and still be used by God, but how much more could He do with them if they were willing to die to self and live for Him alone?
As the original post was relating to a homosexual comparing living with his partner 'in sin' with a couple living in adultary because one partner had a previous spouse, I guess I am saying that the gay person can still be used by God. Hmm do you see how compromise can lead to liberalism.
Still confused as to how to deal with this one. I may even read those 13 pages to get some 'words from the wise' :-?
| 2005/9/6 22:38||Profile|
North West England
Thanks Cheryl for opening yourself up to us. I think many will read your testimony and save themselves from years of grief.
God Bless you.
| 2005/9/6 22:43||Profile|
sir, you wrote:
I have my own opinion and it is very black and white.
I pray one day that God the Holy Ghost deliver you from that.
We had a VERY long thread regarding this topic, wher in all transparency I provided my own testimony.
It's a very long thread, but then again everyone has a lot of "opinions".
God bless you today is my prayer.
| 2005/9/6 22:46|