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 Re: End Time Revival?

Is this something to do with ...

Romans 11
11 I say then, Have they [the Jews] stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but [rather] through their fall salvation [is come] unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy.
12 Now if the fall of them [be] the riches of the world, and the diminishing of them the riches of the Gentiles; [b]how much more their [u]fulness[/u]?[/b]

Luke 21:24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, [b]until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled[/b].

Romans 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, [b]until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in[/b].

I'm claiming no expertise here. Just wish to draw atttention to these verses which seem to be talking about the same thing.

Do we forget there are many Jews in the world still? I know many have come to the Lord over the centuries, but are we still waiting for their 'fulness'?



 2005/7/25 14:15
saved_matt
Member



Joined: 2005/7/3
Posts: 233
Lancashire, England

 Re:

hmmm interesting thoughts here dorcas,

I kind of see what you mean, ill try an fumble out an response, my own personal beliefe regarding the salvation of the jews will be that those non-messianic jews will not be taken up with the rapture of the church but that there persecution, being the chosen people of God, during the great trib will actually culminate in the Jesus' return to earth with power, what we commonly visualize as the second coming, when they cry 'Blessed is He who comes in the name of the Lord' such that the antichrist will persecute them to the extent that they turn to God for salvation and Jesus returns to save them. The time of the fullness of the Gentiles i do believe could be seen as being the end of the church age which is (i am led to believe) from pentecost to rapture.

just some thoughts


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matt

 2005/7/25 14:36Profile









 Re: End Time Revival?

Quote:
The time of the fullness of the Gentiles i do believe could be seen as being the end of the church age

Hi matt,

How could the church be complete without the rest of the Jews who shall be saved?

 2005/7/25 15:07
saved_matt
Member



Joined: 2005/7/3
Posts: 233
Lancashire, England

 Re:

ooooo now this is where i get into grey areas but here goes,

the church is the bride of Christ right thus anyone saved during the 'Church age' is in the bride.
now i dont know all the theological terminology involved but outside the church age you have a different dispensation like prior to Christ in the Old Testament.
Thus the old testament saints and those saved in the tribulation mentioned in rev 13:7 are not actually in the 'Church' and thus are not members of the the 'Bride' either.
Now this goes to the jewish marriage ceremony where besides the bridegroom (Jesus) and the bride (the Church) there are also wedding guests (old testament saints) and bridesmaids (post church age converts).
Now forgive me i dont know this too well but from what i can gather in the Jewish marriage ceremony, which is a type of the marriage of the Lamb, the guests (old testament saints) go to the bridegrooms house (heaven) first, then the bride (church), then the bridesmaids (those saved after the church age), this was the illustraion Jesus was getting at in the parable of the 10 virgins they were the bridesmaids.

sorry this is a bit grey in my head but it kinda answers your question, i need to look into the jewish marriage ceremony procedure more but i believe that in it is the key for the sequence of events.

thanx for your question though dorcas helps me think things through.

I'd love for anyone to direct me to somehwere where i can read about the jewish marriage ceremony even perhaps from a messianic perspective.


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matt

 2005/7/25 15:40Profile
yblek
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Joined: 2004/7/2
Posts: 35


 Re: End Time Revival?

I believe God saves the best for last. Just as on the Day of Pentecost, when God poured out His Spirit upon the disciples in the Upper Room, I believe God will pour out a mighty revival and a great number of souls will be harvested for His name sake. Conditions are ripe for revival in America. Other places around the world are already experiencing revival of unbelievable numbers. Africa is nearly blood bought for the Lord Jesus Christ! Multiple millions upon millions are receiving the Lord as their Savior. Japan is experiencing the first time in its history a major powerful revival where thousands of souls are being saved. China is expereincing an even more unbelievable move of God in the underground church, some figures say as high as 10,000 to 20,000 souls are being added to the church everyday!

A key definition of revival needs to be made, however, on what this word means. Revival is a quickening or an awaking of what was once alive. Revival is intended for the church, not the world. Let me clear this up by saying, when the church falls asleep and becomes dry and dead-the world around us is damned for hell. When God awakens the church in different areas across the world, the church begins to function as it was intended to be. I know at times I have even lost hope for another revival in America, but then you see the possibilities of such an enormous move of God in our nation. Charles Finney spoke of the very conditions that exists today in the modern church. Revival requires the church to repent from its slumber and return to the calling it was established to be. That calling was to be "little-christs" (the world gave this name to us-Christians). The first step to seeing this great move of God is to repent and remove the sins that have become acceptable in the church. The second step is to allow the Holy Spirit to start leading us and walking through us to empower us to live Jesus before the world (those without Christ). Too many "Christians" are trying to live a godly life in their own strength and the world is not interested in religion. Nothing within us will attract the world to Jesus, but when we allow God to lead us and direct us as Paul states in Romans Chapter 8 and Galatians Chapters 4-5, we will be walking in the Spirit, not fulfilling the sin nature. When the church is committing the same types of sins the world is doing, you know the need for an awakening is near. I have spent many nights and days on my knees for this Great Awakening, asking God to once again move us back to Himself. I have prayed that God send a revival to every church that is hungry and desiring this move (no matter what the name of the church). I truly believe the next great revival will not be contained in a certain denomination, I believe it will be found in ALL of them. However, some churches in the same denominations will reject this move too. This will always happen and history shows this. I hope you would agree with me to begin praying faithfully and consistantly until the moving of God comes to America one more time.

Judgment is coming and is already started in our nation for the great apostasy it has committed. The American church is to blame for this. So as the church goes, so does that nation. Look at Europe and how dry and dead the church conditions are there and compare it to the Great Awakenings of the past. You would not even know that God had mightly poured out His Spirit just a few hundred years ago with great godly men like George Whitefield and Jonathan Edwards. Our future will end up like Europe unless God brings a mighty revival to America. LORD SEND THE FIRE AGAIN! SEND A HOLY SPIRIT LED MOVE OF GOD SO STRONG IT WILL BREAK UP THE FALLOW GROUND AND PRODUCE A HARVEST AGAIN FOR YOUR NAME SAKE!

God Bless You

Kelby


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Kelby

 2005/7/25 19:40Profile
letsgetbusy
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Joined: 2004/9/28
Posts: 957
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 Re:

Sorry, want to answer GrannieAnnie:

Yes, we are living in the last days. The latter times of Scripture started with the New Testament age. We are in the New Testament age (latter days) right now, and have been for some time. What I was trying to say is that anyone that tells you that the rapture will occur in about X number of years is either guessing or lying, to put it bluntly.

I do agree that the earth has birthpangs, etc, but these could go on for 2 months, 10 years, or 100 years, or more. There was a huge scare at the end of the year 999. Imagine all the Biblical things you could link up to that. I'm just saying that we should make sure we are looking Christ-ward, whether He comes today or after we are all dead.


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Hal Bachman

 2005/7/25 22:36Profile









 Re:

If no one minds me answering 3 in one.

~ Matt, I'm sorry that your question went the eschatological way ... but it was difficult to answer about a "last days" revival, without bringing it up to the 'Last Days'.

Regardless of our differences, in the 'Timing' of the Resurrection, the answer is still about the same, in that, any True revival can only happen, when we have personal revival first, in our own lives. "Big" is another word that may cause confusion. Jesus only mentions the "few" and when it came to apostasy, and the affects of persecution and because "iniquity did abound", etc, He said "most", will fall away or be offended.

I think that only The Word of God can answer your or my questions, with the help of The Comforter - John 16:13.

~

Quote:
by Eli_Barnabas on 2005/7/25 8:53:05



I wanted to post your whole Post Eli, but I don't know how to.
Well, it's on page 1 here anyways ... :-)

I fully agree and thank you for the exhortation to "endure unto the end". I pray to be counted worthy and have the patient endurance He speaks of.
And your quote of Jesus - Mar 13:37 "And what I say unto you I say unto all, Watch."

Yes, Sir !

~Letsgetbusy, I don't think either one of us wants to debate about when the Biblical "Last Days" began. I gave my opinion on that, on page one and I understand your position.

I'm new here, but I'm sure you all must have had this debate here somewhere's already, over the timing and all.

I think, what might just be needed here is, just to agree where we all can agree ... that we All are always in need for personal revival and a burden for the lost.

I trust the Holy Spirit to work the rest out ...

In His Love. Thanks.

GA

 2005/7/25 23:26
Eli_Barnabas
Member



Joined: 2005/2/16
Posts: 621
Cache Valley, Utah

 Re:

Hi saved_matt,

Quote:
I'd love for anyone to direct me to somehwere where i can read about the jewish marriage ceremony even perhaps from a messianic perspective.



Check out Art Katz's sermons on this subject. He covers it very well, though, not everyone may agree with his message, I believe it is from the Lord. He himself is a messianic Jew!

In Christ,
-Eli


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Eli Brayley

 2005/7/26 8:52Profile
saved_matt
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Joined: 2005/7/3
Posts: 233
Lancashire, England

 Re:

Hi Eli

Quote:


Check out Art Katz's sermons on this subject. He covers it very well, though, not everyone may agree with his message, I believe it is from the Lord. He himself is a messianic Jew!



thanx a lot ill check him out

may the Lord bless you

matt


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matt

 2005/7/26 11:11Profile
letsgetbusy
Member



Joined: 2004/9/28
Posts: 957
Cleveland, Georgia

 Re:

Grannie,

"I think, what might just be needed here is, just to agree where we all can agree ... that we All are always in need for personal revival and a burden for the lost."

I think if more people thought like that we would have revival.


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Hal Bachman

 2005/7/27 0:07Profile





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