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Discussion Forum : Articles and Sermons : Jesus Said “In The World You Have Tribulation” by Zac Poonen

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 Jesus Said “In The World You Have Tribulation” by Zac Poonen

Jesus said in John 16:33 "In the world you have tribulation. But take courage; I have overcome the world". He never promised that we would escape tribulation - whether small tribulations or the great one. But He did say that we could overcome even as He overcame. He is far more interested in making us overcomers than in saving us out of tribulation, because He is far more interested in our character than in our comfort. Neither did Jesus ever say that escaping the great tribulation was a reward for faithfulness, as some teach. On the contrary, He said that those who forsook everything to follow Him would have even more tribulations than others who didn't follow Him (Mark.10:30). When He prayed to His Father for His disciples, He said, "I do not ask Thee to take them out of the world, but to keep them from the evil." (John.17:15). He did NOT want His disciples to be raptured out of the world at that time, just because they were going to face tribulation.

In the 3rd-century when Christians were being thrown to the lions in the Roman amphitheatres and being burnt at the stake in different parts of the Roman empire, the Lord did not rescue them from such tribulations. The God Who shut the lions' mouths and took away the power of the fiery furnace in Daniel's day, did NOT do such miracles for these disciples of Jesus - for these were new-covenant Christians who were going to glorify God through death. Like Jesus their Master, they neither asked for, nor expected twelve legions of angels to come and protect them from their enemies. From heaven, God watched the Bride of His Son being torn to pieces by lions and being burnt to ashes; and He was glorified in their testimony - for they had "followed the Lamb, wherever He went", even unto a violent physical death (Rev.14:4). The only word that the Lord spoke to them was, "Be faithful until death and I will give you a crown of life" (Rev.2:10). Even today, when the disciples of Jesus are being tortured and persecuted for His Name in many lands, the Lord does not take them away from the earth. And He will not rapture us to heaven before the great tribulation either. He will do something far better. He will make us overcomers in the midst of the great tribulation.

Jesus is far more interested in saving us from evil than in saving us from tribulation. He permits us to go through tribulation because He knows that, that is the only way that we can become spiritually strong.

Such a message is strange teaching indeed to a comfort- loving Christendom that has been coddled in their pews every Sunday for years by ear-tickling preachers. But this is the message that the apostles preached to the early churches. "They (the apostles Paul and Barnabas) strengthened the souls of the disciples, encouraging them to continue in the faith, saying, 'Through many tribulations we must enter the kingdom of God'" (Acts 14:22).

The little trials that we face at home and at work now, are but a preparation for the greater ones that will come in the days to come. That is why it is essential that we are faithful now. For God says, "If you have run with footmen and they have tired you out, then how can you compete with horses?" (Jer.12:5). In Revelation Chapter 1:9,10 John refers to himself as a "fellow-partaker in the tribulation which is in Jesus". Every wholehearted disciple of Jesus should be prepared to partake in the "tribulation which is in Jesus", as long as he is in this world. John did not get this unveiling while living in comfort. He received it, while experiencing tribulation at Patmos, because he had been faithful to "the word of God and the testimony of Jesus" (Rev.1:9). He had to experience tribulation himself in order to be able to write about the saints experiencing the great tribulation from the Antichrist in the last days. God takes us through trials and tribulations first before giving us a ministry to others who are facing tribulation. Perseverance is a great virtue that is emphasised throughout the New Testament. Jesus Himself said "They will deliver you to tribulation. But the one who endures to the end shall be saved" (Matt.24:9,13).


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 2020/4/17 19:23Profile
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 Re: Jesus Said “In The World You Have Tribulation” by Zac Poonen

Hi
Taking aside the fact that I disagree with Zac on the rapture (which has nothing to do with tribulations)I want to point that out not to start an endless trib debate but just to let you know my bias.

I would like to make a few points I have made a few times before but are important
1. Their are times when we have tribulations like Corrie Ten Boon and times when we dont have tribulations like Billy Graham .Their are times when Paul was going through really hard times in prison and times when he preached from his own house in Rome and was glad.
2.
Salvation is best looked as on going as well as historic, I am being saved,I was saved and I will be saved ulitimately when Christ comes or I die.
3.
The "Great Tribulation)" and "tribulations" are fundementally different .The great tribulation is an exact period of time set out by God for a specific purpose and reason.The bit I think that is poor in this sermon is that Zac mixes up the two without giving any scripture to enhance is tribulation view.Zac clearly believes in some way that the two are the same when they are clearly different .God never gives a blanket promise to deliver people from tribulations whether they are pre or post tribulation believers and again all the pre trib preachers I know would never teach this.This is experiential teaching to an extent rather than scriptural ie because God doesnt deliver us from tribulations which is our experience doesnt mean or you cannot jump too he wont take us out before the Great tribulation.
4
Many many Christians have died for their faith in the past and present and will in the future not loving their life unto death and many many Christians have not loved thier life on to death and have not died for their faith .Whether you are martyred or not martyred is not the issue its whether you run the course and finish the race set out for you in faith that is important thing.This course may include martyrdom or not.
5
Fundamentally people with a tribulation view like Zac have a different salvation view than people who hold the opposite tribulation view.I am not saying or trying to start an endless trib debate but just merely pointing out that Salavation views are linked with Tribulation views.
6
Many great Christians have been Post tribulation believers like Zac and many great Christians have been pre tribulation believers.
Many Christians who are Post tribulation believers have been martyred and so have many Pre tribulaion believers too ,its not exclusive to your tribualtion belief.
7.Most of the quacks and con men attach themselves to the Pre tribulation churches but that cannont be a reason in any way to reject this point of view .You cannot throw the baby out with the bath water.Instead reject the pre or post tribulation views because of scripture rather than experience.I think thats the most we can expect.
8
I have stuck up for my belief not because I am saying pre tribulation view is correct but rather to point out my experience of pre tribulation Christians is that we know and expect to suffer and be persecuted for our faith in Christ and we know their are times we may have to go through tribulations because that has also been our experience and is clearly scriptural.It has also been my experience of great times of deliverance too from troubles and times when I was lowered down a basket from a window so as to avoid troubles,
yours staff

A footnote :Most pretrib believing preachers I know seldom if ever teach end times and the blessing of the end times is missed.
When I ask them why ?They say its too devisive and they would like not to offend believers with a different view which is an unfortunate and totally unsriptural position to take.

 2020/4/17 21:08Profile





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