SermonIndex Audio Sermons
Promoting Genuine Biblical Revival.
Looking for free sermon messages?
Sermon Podcast | Audio | Video

Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : Denominational Christianity is Not God's Best for the Church

Print Thread (PDF)

Goto page ( Previous Page 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 Next Page )
PosterThread
MrBillPro
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3220
Texas

 Re: Chris

Some really good thoughts there Chris. I've often heard that the RC Church, doesn't even consider themselves to be any denomination.


_________________
Mr. Bill

 2019/11/7 15:22Profile
staff
Member



Joined: 2007/2/8
Posts: 1390


 Re:

Hi Chris
Good post
Thats a long one so I'l comment in pieces .
I think that their can be no defence of the Church having denominations except that we are not in a postion to change where we are.
Yeah even if we have all the core beliefs then their still will be doctrinal issues that will divide us into denominations.
Denominations all comes down to doctrine and the Jerusalem Council shows that the The Apostles had the Spiritual Authority to sort out divisions even before they arose as in the light burden given to Gentile Christians.
Not ALL division is due to doctrine but all denominational division is due to doctrine.
What you say about humility and denominations is very intersting and hits the mark.
On Pastors and denominations and independant churches we the church have a problem though inso much as the position of Pastor in the modern Church is unbiblical and it usurps its place in the structure of the Church.
I realize we cant solve the problem of denominations ,I realize that but God can and we have to wait for him to make his move.All I am asking is that we recognize that even though we cannot do much if anything about denominations we can recognize that denominational Christianity is clearly Not God's Best for the Church.
My personal belief and I dont want to make a denomination about it ha ha is that God will soon begin to make a move that we didnt even think was possible or probable to remove these man made barriers staff

 2019/11/7 16:17Profile
Oracio
Member



Joined: 2007/6/26
Posts: 2021
Whittier CA USA

 Re:

Chris, I really appreciated your lengthy yet well written post as I share those same sentiments on this topic. In the past, as I've tried finding a church with my wife and two kids, I've been ousted over non-essential doctrinal differences, such on as the timing of the rapture and Calvinism vs free will in salvation. It's been very discouraging to have to experience that kind of thing while trying to find a church to be a part of with my family.

Imo it's unrealistic to think that God will somehow get all Christians to agree on every non-essential doctrine, before Christ's Second Coming. With all due respect I don't see that taught or promised in the Bible, as Chris pointed out from Scripture.

Romans 14 is another scripture that comes to mind. Paul lays out there that we should expect there to be differences of opinion or belief in non-essential matters and that we should not let that divide us as Christians.

To expect all Christians to agree on every single non-essential issue before being able to fellowship is sad and will only continue to flame the fires of unbiblical divisions within the Body of Christ.


_________________
Oracio

 2019/11/9 12:10Profile
staff
Member



Joined: 2007/2/8
Posts: 1390


 Re:

Hi Oracio,
The view you put forward is I agree probably the prevailing view i.e that it is unrealistic that all Christians would come to agree on all issues before the second coming.
I believe although this view is the most popular and rational view ,it is also wrong.
Paul excepts that their are differences of opinion granted but he would never except a difference of opinion that would cause denomination to occur.
If Paul or James or Peter or Jesus even was here they would be able to teach what is of God and what is not and in so doing would eradicate the need for that division or denomination.
Nobody is saying that we need to agree on every single non essential before being able to have fellowship,thats not the point.In fact its denominations that are stopping Christians from fellowshiping not the other way around,
The point is that denominations are not from God and we should recognize that fact.I do believe it is scriptural that God will restore Apostolic Doctrine and Authority to the Church before the second coming and inso doing will eradicate denominational man made barriers that inhibit fellowship as it does now.It is up to God to restore though in his time not up to us and anyway we cant do it even if we wanted too,staff

 2019/11/9 15:04Profile
staff
Member



Joined: 2007/2/8
Posts: 1390


 Re:

We are the Church of the unrealistic,the Red Sea ,water into wine,Pentecost or the resurrected Christ appearing to over 500 .Its not a small thing for God to bring the Body back under one structure and it may look impossible but isnt that what Our God's speciality is? staff

 2019/11/9 17:59Profile
Oracio
Member



Joined: 2007/6/26
Posts: 2021
Whittier CA USA

 Re:

Hi staff, this is from your OP,

Quote:
4.God will restore Apostolic Doctrine to end division in the Church
5.We however cannot restore Apostolic Doctrine,thats up to God but we can pray for it.Its a bit like David and the temple,he couldnt build the temple himself but he could help prepare for it.

I feel I should share what God has given me so that it may help you understand why we have so many voices but no uniformity,staff



My concern is that on the one hand, you seem to acknowledge that denominations were started on account of non-essential doctrines over which Christians should not divide (at least it seems that way in your other posts after your OP); and on the other hand, you seem to say we should pray for and expect for God to show all Christians the correct understanding regarding those non-essentials so that there won't be anymore divisions and denominations, right?

My question is, why not pray for God to break down denominational barriers by helping us see the foolishness and carnality of dividing over non-essentials? To me that seems more biblical than to expect for God to show all believers the correct understanding of all non-essential doctrines.

In other words, I believe we should pray for and work toward accepting one another in spite of our differences and disagreements on non-essentials.


_________________
Oracio

 2019/11/9 18:01Profile
Oracio
Member



Joined: 2007/6/26
Posts: 2021
Whittier CA USA

 Re:

staff, this is my challenge to you brother, do you believe God is able to break down denominational walls by opening eyes to the foolishness of dividing over non-essentials? My point is that it would take just as much of a miracle for all believers to unite via God convicting us of the foolishness of dividing over non-essentials as it would for us to unite via Him revealing all true interpretations on non-essentials. The former, however, seems to be more biblical for us to pray for and expect imo.


_________________
Oracio

 2019/11/9 18:09Profile
Oracio
Member



Joined: 2007/6/26
Posts: 2021
Whittier CA USA

 Re: brother staff

Hey brother, it seems that I may have misunderstood your viewpoint in this thread and for that I apologize.

I thought you came across as having a mindset of demanding that all Christians agree on non-essentials.


_________________
Oracio

 2019/11/9 20:57Profile
staff
Member



Joined: 2007/2/8
Posts: 1390


 Re:

Hi Oracio
Im really just saying deonominations arent Gods best and I think he will do something about it but we cant because it would involve a souverign move of God to do it.
Im also saying the divisions that cause denominations to exist are doctrinal and for God to make a move he will have to nullify any doctrinal issues that are causing these divisions.These issues usually I find are big issues and
are not non esseietial issues .

After all divisions like once saved always saved vs losing ur salvation or even are the gifts of the Church for today have answers.One is right and one is wrong; both cant be right. Jesus if he was sitting here between you and me in conversation would come down on one side or the other and give scriptural reference why.
So he definitely can if he wants bring everyone back under the Apostles Doctrine which doesnt cater for divisions that are the cause for denominational Christianity ,thanks for being understanding when we write things down they become harder to explain than face to face urs staff

 2019/11/9 21:26Profile
Sree
Member



Joined: 2011/8/20
Posts: 1703


 Re:

I think no one can claim that denominations are God's first hand plan. But God has definitely caused denominations to be born.

1 Cor 11:19 - And indeed, there must be divisions among you to show which of you are approved.

God has caused these divisions (Denominations) to separate the approved people from those who are not.

Many Christians see denominations as some wrong or detestable thing. Catholics often make fun of protestants by showing the divisions among them. But if a person knows God's heart, he will acknowledge that God favors divisions over 1 whole bunch of corrupted people in some kind of unity. God calls people always to come out of Babylon which is a corrupt Christian system. He does not tell them to stay there and preserve unity over quality.

For example the birth of protestants itself was a division from Catholic Church which was a single denomination. We all know God caused it to separate a people for himself out of dark Catholic church.

Similarly in generations to come, God has made certain denominations to be born out of darkness. For example Methodists by John Wesley was one such movement. Salvation army by William Booth is also another. Today I believe CFC Churches planted by Zac Poonen is one such initiative by God.

If I was in John Wesley's time then I would have joined the Methodist movement and similarly Salvation army if I was in Booth's time.

Such denominations were formed by God but later the leaders missed the objective of the founders of these movements and clung on to the pattern formed by the founders. That is why Most of such denominations which started well are today very corrupt.

If we are a disciple of Jesus then we should identify the movement of God and long to be part of it. Even if such movement requires us to give up our traditional denominations, we should be willing to pay the price. Many Christians of Luther's time found the movement of God through Luther and came out of their Church system to form the Protestants of today.


_________________
Sreeram

 2019/11/10 7:52Profile





©2002-2019 SermonIndex.net
Promoting Genuine Biblical Revival.
Privacy Policy