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Discussion Forum : General Topics : Good Fight Ministries on Kanye West

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JFW
Member



Joined: 2011/10/21
Posts: 1230
Dothan, Alabama

 Re: Questions not answers

Yes obviously not one among us gets a “rubber stamp” with which to carry on as they please without being brought to account,... but to whom do they give account? Is it to random (and rather opinionated) strangers from around the world whom they have never even met,... or is it to the same anointing that instructs us? 🤔

See it’s very, and seriously so, important that we don’t become as the elder brother and treat our (prodigal) younger brother spitefully when he returns home... we should be rejoicing and celebrating with not only our brother but with our whole house and all the hosts of heaven!! 😇 Are we sooo holy and set apart that we can lay charge at the feet of Gods servants!??


See we should not only not have all these questions but should in fact have answers for when the unbelieving inquire as to his conversion... using it to show our Fathers mercy and grace:))) yet we throw our hat in with the unbelievers whom question.... :(

So (for me) it all comes down to this...
Why did Jesus do/say what He did?
Because His Father told Him to! -Full stop-

See allot of people read the book and took the test and learned christianese but only those who actually KNOW HIM,... who actually had a personal revelation of who He is, have any part in what is His. For He says so Himself.
If you “know” somebody, you can not only tell if someone else has met or knows them,... you can tell how well they know them and... how long it’s been since they had been with them.

For the record; after I was converted and baptized (in prison) I went straight back to a life of crime... actually committing the largest one I had to date and you know what, the Lord covered me because I was His. Though because I was His, the success of this sin no longer held any pleasure for me and without even realizing it, I gave it up in large part because the desire of my heart had changed. Though for another decade I continued to sin rather consistently and with a certain entitlement till one day (after Jesus just kept giving me more of Himself) I realized I liked being with Jesus more than I liked smoking weed and getting high... so I thought I’ll just hang out with Jesus instead of going to get stoned but I quickly found out I HAD to go get stoned... I was a slave (addicted) to it and didn’t even know it. Now mind you I had been promoting Jesus and all He had done for me publicly and yet I was in bondage to sin. It was then and there that He told me He could “take that from me” if I wanted Him to.... and only because He had ALREADY deposited the faith in my account and had been training me to hear and trust and follow His voice, having His grace abound towards me, was I able to yield to Him and allow Him to set me free from the spirit of addiction 🙏🏻😇😇🙏🏻💯

So maybe we should, at the least, give God the benefit of the doubt that His arm is NOT shortened unto salvation and He is mighty to save!!!
I know it may be unbelievable that He could do this for Kanye but our God is the God of impossible things :))))

And maybe we should ALL prayerfully consider the song “God is” on the album Jesus is King... tell me if after you hear that if you still have any doubts that this man met the Lord of Lords ?





_________________
Fletcher

 2019/11/9 8:11Profile
MrBillPro
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3220
Texas

 Re:

I know most of the old/older generation, still hang on to the old school morals, and thank God we do. A lot of this new generation is lost, really lost, and it's pretty obvious most are not going to listen to us old/older folks. If it takes someone like Kanye West to get their attention, "and I pray he does" please allow God some time to work through Kanye to help bring this lost generation to Christ.

We all should know very well, sometimes God takes a long time to bring the lost to Christ, it took him 45 years to work on me, to get me somewhat straightened out, and I'm still under construction. God is not like a microwave, he's not into fast food, he sometimes sends folks into our lives to feed us a little at a time. I don't know "anything" about Mr. West, but it doesn't matter what I know, what matters is what God knows.


_________________
Mr. Bill

 2019/11/9 10:29Profile
savannah
Member



Joined: 2008/10/30
Posts: 1975


 Re: Born from above...born of God?




"Anyone having been born of God does not practice sin, because His seed abides in him, and he is not able to continue sinning, because he has been born of God." 1 John 3:9

"We know that everyone having been born of God does not continue to sin, but the One having been begotten of God protects him, and the evil one does not touch him." 1 John 5:18

“And those on the rocky soil are those who, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no firm root; they believe for a while, and in time of temptation fall away." Luke 8:13

“But there are some of you who do not believe.” For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were who did not believe, and who it was that would betray Him." John 6:64

"Nevertheless, the firm foundation of God stands, having this seal, “The Lord knows those who are His,” and, “Let everyone who names the Name of the Lord depart from wickedness.”"
2 Timothy 2:19

 2019/11/9 12:36Profile
MrBillPro
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3220
Texas

 Re:

"We know that everyone having been born of God does not continue to sin, but the One having been begotten of God protects him, and the evil one does not touch him." 1 John 5:18

So I guess I haven't been born of God, because I probably commit some type of sin everyday. :-(


_________________
Mr. Bill

 2019/11/9 14:43Profile
Oracio
Member



Joined: 2007/6/26
Posts: 2021
Whittier CA USA

 Re:

Due to the prevalence of the hyper-grace message in the past 100 years, many Christians have missed the biblical truth and reality of false conversions. Yet the Scriptures clearly warn about that reality. We are exhorted to examine ourselves to see if we are in the faith (2 Cor. 13:5) and to make our calling and election sure (2 Pet. 1:10). Paul spoke of being “in perils among false brethren” (2 Cor. 11:26). The main theme of the epistle of 1 John is to provide certain evidences of true conversion whereby one can examine one's self to see if one has a justifiable reason to have assurance of one's salvation. The best sermon I’ve ever heard based on 1 John is this one by Paul Washer:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ky8dTyPpiAo

Many times when Christians seek to discern whether or not someone has been genuinely saved, the “Judge not lest you be judged” card is pulled, taking that verse (Matt. 7:1) out of context and misapplying it. It is not taken into account that shortly after that verse in that same chapter Jesus went on to warn and say the following:

“Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. 16 You will know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes from thorn bushes or figs from thistles? 17 Even so, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. 18 A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit. 19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 Therefore by their fruits you will know them. 21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’”

I know from personal experience about the deception of a false conversion. Sometimes when we are confronted with the possibility that we may have had a false conversion experience in the past, our first reaction is to vehemently deny that possibility. I know that that was the case with me. And it’s understandable because who wants to admit straightaway that their religious experience was a total sham? Yet we must let the Scriptures instruct us on what a true conversion looks like. As 2 Corinthians 5:17 says, “Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; old things have passed away; behold, all things have become new.”

Again, the scriptures aforementioned here as well as those referenced by savannah, as well as others such as 1 Corinthians 6:9-11 and Galatians 5:19-21 clearly teach that those who continue to practice sin will not go to heaven, regardless of their profession of faith.

We’re not talking about sinless perfection here. We’re talking about being truly broken over and ashamed of one’s past lifestyle as a God-hater.

In one of the interviews to which I shared the link, Kanye West was asked if he was ashamed of his former lifestyle, to which he replied that he had nothing to be ashamed of whatsoever. It reminded me of when Trump was asked if he believed he needed to ask God for forgiveness, and he said no because he thinks he’s been a good person.


_________________
Oracio

 2019/11/9 15:30Profile
JFW
Member



Joined: 2011/10/21
Posts: 1230
Dothan, Alabama

 Re: brother Oracio

Totally get where you’re coming from -
You wrote;
“ Yet the Scriptures clearly warn about that reality. We are exhorted to examine ourselves to see if we are in the faith (2 Cor. 13:5) and to make our calling and election sure (2 Pet. 1:10). Paul spoke of being “in perils among false brethren” (2 Cor. 11:26). The main theme of the epistle of 1 John is to provide certain evidences of true conversion whereby one can examine one's self ”

Notice in all cases we are admonished to examine OURSELVES .........
just sayin

And just for the record... the “radio show” host are Calvinist
So just to be clear, by the standard you and Savannah are putting forth by your interpretation of scripture, John Calvin himself would miss heaven by a country mile... 🤔


_________________
Fletcher

 2019/11/9 16:28Profile
Oracio
Member



Joined: 2007/6/26
Posts: 2021
Whittier CA USA

 Re: brother Fletcher

Brother, the Good Fight radio show host who founded that ministry is a Calvary Chapel pastor who is definitely not a Calvinist but that is neither here nor there. While I'm not a Calvinist I agree in some areas with their biblical interpretations. On the issue of true and false conversion and the need to exercise discernment and church discipline many Calvinists have gotten it right imo.

We are not only exhorted to examine ourselves but also to examine the fruit of those who profess to know God. We're given Matthew 18:15-20 and 1 Corinthians 5 as instructions on how to exercise church discipline, on how to determine when to excommunicate someone who professes faith in Christ. Notice particularly 1 Corinthians 5:9-13,

"I wrote to you in my epistle not to keep company with sexually immoral people. 10 Yet I certainly did not mean with the sexually immoral people of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or idolaters, since then you would need to go out of the world. 11 But now I have written to you not to keep company with anyone named a brother, who is sexually immoral, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or an extortioner—not even to eat with such a person. 12 For what have I to do with judging those also who are outside? Do you not judge those who are inside? 13 But those who are outside God judges. Therefore “put away from yourselves the evil person.”

In 2 Tim. 2:3 Paul describes false teachers in the last days as those "having a form of godliness but denying its power," and admonishes, "And from such people turn away!"

In Titus 1 Paul gave the following admonition to Titus regarding certain false teachers of his day (which applies today regarding any who would set themselves up as teachers within the church yet lack certain fruit in keeping with repentance):

"They profess to know God, but in works they deny Him, being abominable, disobedient, and disqualified for every good work."(Tit. 1:16). In verse 13 Paul says, "Therefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith."

From what I can tell, Kanye West does not really have any real accountability to any godly men. This is desperately needed especially if and when one is a new convert. A godly and mature brother can exhort and rebuke when needed, and a true believer will appreciate that kind of biblical correction and guidance.

I know that a Calvinist pastor was trying to disciple him for some time but it seems Kanye sort of got away from that and went off and did his own thing afterward.

Anyway, in the end only God truly knows if Kanye is truly born again. Our place is to pray for him but at the same time to exercise discernment. And as Joe Schimmel said in the radio show, we must be careful not to quickly fall hook line and sinker for the deceptions of the enemy in these last days.


_________________
Oracio

 2019/11/9 17:30Profile
savannah
Member



Joined: 2008/10/30
Posts: 1975


 Re: interpretation assumption



"So just to be clear, by the standard you and Savannah are putting forth by your interpretation of scripture..."

Just to be clear, please tell me and the forum the standard I'm putting forth by my interpretation of Scripture. Please do so from my one post on this thread, prior to this one, my second.

Thanks

 2019/11/9 17:42Profile
savannah
Member



Joined: 2008/10/30
Posts: 1975


 Re: guessing



Mr. Bill,

Very sorry to hear that you have come to such a conclusion after reading God's inspired Word.

But God...

 2019/11/9 17:51Profile
JFW
Member



Joined: 2011/10/21
Posts: 1230
Dothan, Alabama

 Re: Ok but...

Brother Oracio,

Again, I get where you’re coming from but,... when did Kanye “set himself up to be a teacher” ?
Everyone keeps sayin things like that but -
Seems like he’s just witnessing and again where do the scriptures EVER license us to throw rocks at other believers that we’ve never even met?
Please site those scriptures for me because in my ignorance I keep missing them.
I don’t know Kanye, and will probably never meet him this side of heaven,... but I will offer praise to God for what He has done!

I mean 38,000,000 people downloaded the album Jesus is King in the first 12 hrs it was available!
So even if this is some super elaborate scheme of the devil who intends it for evil.... even if that is the case here,... Our God will use EVEN THAT to the good to glorify His Son our Lord Jesus 🙏🏻😇

It honestly seems like you all don’t want him to be a Christian!
I mean this is really ridiculous to even be having this discussion!
Because IF ANY of you detractors were spending half as much time before the Lord in prayer on behalf of this young brother, his wife, and their children then you all wouldn’t have time to cynically offer your public unbelief-

Why do christians kill their young!??


_________________
Fletcher

 2019/11/9 19:43Profile





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