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Discussion Forum : General Topics : Forgiveness... your thoughts

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dohzman
Member



Joined: 2004/10/13
Posts: 2132


 Re:

That was a good example. I do believe that forgiveness is instant. On our part we instantly forgive. However the emotional part of us sometimes doesn't, and as when Peter asked how many times shall I forgive my brother, Jesus said 70 times 7, it's a process in our minds sometimes and also our wills to forgive, sometimes we forgive once literally and then 70 times 7 in our mind, will and emotions. I do believe that with the application of God's principles He will always give us grace and help as we ask. Bro. Daryl


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D.Miller

 2005/7/12 16:40Profile
philologos
Member



Joined: 2003/7/18
Posts: 6566
Reading, UK

 Re:

this a Sara Groves' song called Tornado. I am left wondering who the Tornado was. just another facet...

You live your life like a tornado • Destruction follows everywhere you go • And you have no plans to stop or slow oh • I will not let this bitter root grow in me • I will not let you leave that legacy • But it gets so hard when pain is all I see oh • • Every time I find healing you're making a new mess • And I am learning the real meaning of forgiveness • • And I tried to remove myself from your path • But I keep waking up in the aftermath • So I pick up again and say I won't look back oh • And I will not let you leave that legacy • But this constant fight is breaking me oh • Every time I find healing you're making a new mess • And I am learning the real meaning of forgiveness • • And it hurts when you hit at the hearts of the ones I love • When everything you touch is rumble and dust • And it gets so hard to know how to trust • But I will not let that bitter root grow • I will not let it no no • But it gets so hard oh • • Every time I find healing you're making a new mess • And I am learning the real meaning of forgiveness • And I could move and never send you a forwarding address • Or I could learn the real meaning of forgiveness • •


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Ron Bailey

 2005/7/13 7:39Profile









 My struggles in forgiveness

Dearly beloved in Christ,
You know the bible says to bare one another's burdens. It's like a stick one would drive along side a tomato plant to help support burden of the branches. Could I share a burden with you that has really wounded my heart?

I love people who do ministry of anykind. I'm especially drawn to pastors who have "the right stuff". What is the right stuff? Yes they are men of God. But more, they are outstanding in every way. They are men of character and integrity. They are model husbands and fathers. They are deeply compassionate to all without regard to personal stature (no respector of persons). They follow Christ, and it shows by their example in almost every thing they do.

I had a pastor friend once, more a dear brother in Christ at who is like that. It grieves me that I did not even measure up to this man, much less Christ, yet he loved me. We had some intimate fellowship. We've went places together. Oh how I loved to be with him (he drowned along with his son a couple years ago). Our theology had been on the same page right down the line. He even asked me to preach in his absence, an honor that will forever thrill my soul.

This man was not lazy. Far from it. He rarely took time for himself, but was continually giving his life and his labor to his family and his church. I loved this man. I'm was thrilled to be known as his friend.

This pastor invited one of his pastor friends from out of state to come and conduct some meetings in his church. My pastor friend gave this person a great build up. I couldn't wait to have fellowship with this visitor and hear him preach. He came and was there for 4 or 5 days. He preached 5 messages that were wonderful...good stuff. In his messages he revealed some experiences he had in Africa as a missionary. If you know me, you know that I love missionaries and I cherish their fellowship.

The pastor friend of my pastor friend came and went. I went to all his meetings. I introduced myself. Not once did my pastor introduce me to his friend pastor as being his friend. I was not invited to some special things that were going on that other people were invited too. I was completely overlooked as "close" friend. I was wounded deeply.

When it was all said and done, I went to my pastor friend and shared with him in love my wound. He assured me that it was not by intent and that he had intended to have me involved in the fellowship. I of course forgave him. Yes our relationship had a dent in it, but I knew time would heal it. I knew this man. He was not the kind that would hurt anyone intentionally, much less his close friends. He apologised to the max, I forgave him of course, even before I spoke to him about it. Now we will move on.

Well, .......then the Holy Spirit began to deal with me. He probed my heart with this question. "How many times has Jesus been left out of your fellowship with your friends, Lahry?" Oh agony upon agony. Countless times no doubt. I've been with people I cared about and failed to introduce them to the Holy One I "claim" to love most of all. Oh God! Oh please forgive me. Oh the agony of this is almost more than I can bare. I am a man of unclean lips. I proclaim to some how much I love Jesus and how close we are. But with others, I never mention His name.

In my pain of injury from my pastor freind, I was able to see a deeper wound, a wound that breaks my friend Jesus' heart. He laid down His life for me. Too often I treat Him as if I don't know Him at all. I claim to have a "personal relationship" with Christ, but I keep Him at a distance far too often. Oh God! Please forgive me.

Broken and spilled out,

Lahry

 2005/7/13 7:48
philologos
Member



Joined: 2003/7/18
Posts: 6566
Reading, UK

 Re: My struggles in forgiveness

Quote:
Broken and spilled out,


Lahry
Heb. 5:8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; ...some things we can only learn this way.


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Ron Bailey

 2005/7/13 8:11Profile
RobertW
Member



Joined: 2004/2/12
Posts: 4636
Independence, Missouri

 Re:

I think that we spend a lot of time on how victims ought to forgive and very little on how victimizers should react to the things they have done.

The example I related earlier of my cousin who was shot through the spine on accident just keeps speaking to me. Here was a man who accidentally shot and paralyzed him from the chest down. The shooter followed him every step of the way from the trip to the hospital to the ER and the surgery and weeks in ICU. He took him to appointments afterwards and rehab. Took him to the gym. In Abraham my friend Ron relays a story of a woman who donated a kidney without hesitation to her son. She did not know that people have 2 kidneys so what she 'thought' she was doing was essentially giving her life for her child. Was she doing the Christlike thing here? She was being a mother. When the man followed my cousin to tend to his wounds he was not being a 'Christian' he was being a human being.

Sometimes sinners are more spiritual than believers. I think of I Timothy 5:8

But if any provide not for his own, and specially for those of his own house, he hath denied the faith, and is [u]worse[/u] than an infidel.

This is shocking. Is it possible that a person could conduct theirselves in a way that was actually 'worse' than an infidel while simultaneously believing they were 'spiritual'. I believe so.

But how could it be that a Christian could do great damage to people and not at least try to pick up the pieces. Many just get their receipt for forgiveness and keep on walking by. It's like they threw some pour soul into the ditch naked and wounded and waited for someone else to pass by and help them out. all many are concerned about is if they were 'forgiven'. And once they hear "yes your forgiven" they believe their responisbility is over. But is it?

I think again of my cousin and how this winter his back and legs will hurt terribly bad due to the weather change. The bones will ache. He will need someone to rub his back or legs all over again. The spiritual crowd would tell him to rebuke the devil for reminding him of the pain and claim healing in faith! How insinsitive can you be!? The victim just keeps on getting victimized by the mindset of a callous people.

In like manor people who have been emotionally hurt go through seasons in their life where the trauma of what has happened for but a little while comes to the surface and the pain is felt all over again. Maybe it happened 5 years ago- but a change in seasons reminds them of the pain. Like the sore back or legs of a former paralyzed man- they need their legs rubbed again. Again the hyper spiritual would tell them to rebuke the devil and give it to Jesus. How callous! How cavalier an attitude people take towards the pain they cause. A Samaritan man pulls a hurt man from a ditch- but a Christian will wound and smugly walk on as if they were justified in inflicting the pain. Their battle cry? Forgive me and [u]get over it[/u]! What about my legs? They still hurt. What about my back- its aching again.

For all I know the shooter may have been an infidel, but at least he had the good sense to know what he did and tried to help. In this I see clearly how a Christian can be worse than an infidel and offer up 10 proof texts to justify their behavior. Yet, [i]does not even nature teach you that it is a shame...[/i]




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Robert Wurtz II

 2005/7/13 9:07Profile





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