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Discussion Forum : General Topics : True or False?

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TMK
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Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 4964
NC, USA

 True or False?

Reckless Love- Cory Asbury

Before I spoke a word, You were singing over me
You have been so, so good to me
Before I took a breath, You breathed Your life in me
You have been so, so kind to me

Oh, the overwhelming, never-ending, reckless love of God
Oh, it chases me down, fights 'til I'm found, leaves the ninety-nine
I couldn't earn it, and I don't deserve it, still, You give Yourself away
Oh, the overwhelming, never-ending, reckless love of God, yeah

When I was Your foe, still Your love fought for me
You have been so, so good to me
When I felt no worth, You paid it all for me
You have been so, so kind to me

And oh, the overwhelming, never-ending, reckless love of God
Oh, it chases me down, fights 'til I'm found, leaves the ninety-nine
And I couldn't earn it, and I don't deserve it, still, You give Yourself away
Oh, the overwhelming, never-ending, reckless love of God, yeah

There's no shadow You won't light up
Mountain You won't climb up
Coming after me
There's no wall You won't kick down
Lie You won't tear down
Coming after me
There's no shadow You won't light up
Mountain You won't climb up
Coming after me
There's no wall You won't kick down
Lie You won't tear down
Coming after me
There's no shadow You won't light up
Mountain You won't climb up
Coming after me
There's no wall You won't kick down
Lie You won't tear down
Coming after me
There's no shadow You won't light up
Mountain You won't climb up
Coming after me
There's no wall You won't kick down
Lie You won't tear down
Coming after me

Oh, the overwhelming, never-ending, reckless love of God
Oh, it chases me down, fights 'til I'm found, leaves the ninety-nine
And I couldn't earn it, I don't deserve it, still, You give Yourself away
Oh, the overwhelming, never-ending, reckless love of God,

https://youtu.be/hUIpbyCvbI8


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Todd

 2018/10/18 17:19Profile
BranchinVINE
Member



Joined: 2016/6/15
Posts: 426
Australia

 Re: True or False?

The love of God truly passes knowledge.

But, to truly know the love of God is to have this fruit:

Eph. 3:19 –
and to know the love of Christ which surpasses knowledge, that you may be filled up to all the fullness of God.


In Christ all the fullness of God dwells.

Col. 1:19 –
For it was the Father's good pleasure for all the fullness to dwell in Him,

Col. 2:9 (KJV) –
For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.


If we truly know the love of God, we will be filled up to all the fullness of God, that is, filled up with Christ, that is, Christ is in us.

John 17:26 –
and I have made Your name known to them, and will make it known, so that the love with which You loved Me may be in them, and I in them

Col. 3:10 (Young’s Literal Translation) –
and ye are in him made full, who is the head of all principality and authority,


ADD:

Christ will be formed in us (Gal. 4:19).


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Jade

 2018/10/18 19:34Profile
romanchog
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Joined: 2011/10/27
Posts: 308
"Walking in the Valley of the Shadow of Death"

 Re: True or False?

Response by John Piper

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbhz2GkU2zs

 2018/10/18 22:41Profile
BranchinVINE
Member



Joined: 2016/6/15
Posts: 426
Australia

 Re:


Well……this is what the Bible says about God’s love:

John 3:16 –
For God so loved ((((( the world ))))), that He gave His only begotten Son, that ((((( whoever ))))) believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.

Barnes Notes on the Bible: The world - All mankind. It does not mean any particular part of the world, but man as man - the race that had rebelled and that deserved to die.

Pulpit Commentary: For God so loved the world. The Divine love to the whole of humanity in its condition of supreme need


But I do not want to be embroiled in another debate on Calvin’s predestination.



Even if we were to be open-minded regarding the word “reckless”, the song tells only half the story because God’s love has a definite and glorious objective:

Eph. 2:4-7 --
But God, being rich in mercy, ((((( because of His great love with which He loved us, ))))) even when we were dead in our transgressions, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), and raised us up with Him, and seated us with Him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, so that in the ages to come He might show the surpassing riches of His grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus.


“And behold, the half was not told me.”


This is a far better song with real depth:


HERE IS LOVE HYMN

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qdYAPBLQMWA

Here is love, vast as the ocean,
Lovingkindness as the flood,
When the Prince of Life, our Ransom,
Shed for us His precious blood.
Who His love will not remember?
Who can cease to sing His praise?
He can never be forgotten,
Throughout Heav’n’s eternal days.

On the mount of crucifixion,
Fountains opened deep and wide;
Through the floodgates of God’s mercy
Flowed a vast and gracious tide.
Grace and love, like mighty rivers,
Poured incessant from above,
And Heav’n’s peace and perfect justice
Kissed a guilty world in love
.
Let me all Thy love accepting,
Love Thee, ever all my days;
Let me seek Thy kingdom only
And my life be to Thy praise;
Thou alone shalt be my glory,
Nothing in the world I see.
Thou hast cleansed and sanctified me,
Thou Thyself hast set me free.

In Thy truth Thou dost direct me
By Thy Spirit through Thy Word;
And Thy grace my need is meeting,
As I trust in Thee, my Lord.
Of Thy fullness Thou art pouring
Thy great love and power on me,
Without measure, full and boundless,
Drawing out my heart to Thee.


1 John 4:16 --
God is love, and the one who abides in love abides in God, and God abides in him.


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Jade

 2018/10/19 1:31Profile
Elibeth
Member



Joined: 2011/8/14
Posts: 866


 Re:

Jade,

Doesn’t it really matter when we change just (1) Word here, and (1) Word there?,...
By changing just (1) word, ...can’t it take us to a whole new meaning,... take us in a direction that is false( lie),..a deception,.. and not true (Truth) ?

At this point, I am thinking about this specific word,
“SHALL”, vs “SHOULD “ ,.. in. Scripture verse below of Jn. 3:16,that , I see many write..
Why was this Word changed ? And who changed this Word ?

John 3:16 –
For God so loved ((((( the world ))))), that He gave His only begotten Son, that ((((( whoever ))))) believes in Him “SHALL” not perish, but have eternal life.

Todd,
I am questioning the words in this song, and their leadings.
The Lord does draw us (Grace) by His Spirit, But we have a part in this,.. as He lets us choose.
This song writer sounds as it it is ALL The Lord, and there is NO ending,
But we know The Lord will not strive with us always,.. that the door can be shut.,... and that we can reject Him.
And although it is freely given, it also comes with an obligation,, to hear His voice and to follow Him,... (Abrahamic faith)
So I would say about this song ,...????

————-♥️
elizabeth

 2018/10/19 10:02Profile
TMK
Member



Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 4964
NC, USA

 Re:

E-

I certainly agree with your sentiment and it does seem that the song stops just a tad short- although I really hadn’t thought about that before. I guess one response to this criticism might be that the songwriter was only expressing God’s attitude and his intention was to stop there. Maybe some day he will write a song that expresses our side and our responsibility.

But, also addressing your point, John Piper says he can easily sing this song wholeheartedly through his Calvinist lens because it IS all God’s doing (namely, unconditional election, irresistible grace).

I certainly don’t know the songwriter’s background but I doubt he wrote the song as a paean to reformed theology. I think he wrote it because that is how he perceived God’s love for and pursuit of him while he was still a rebel and foe.

The main reason I posted the lyrics was because a while back an article was posted here and the author went to great lengths to explain how much God hates sinners—not just sin— but sinners.

Obviously God either hates sinners or he loves them- he can’t do both at the same time.


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Todd

 2018/10/19 13:02Profile
Gloryandgrace
Member



Joined: 2017/7/14
Posts: 819
Snoqualmie, WA

 Re:


To me, its a tempest in a tea pot.

the hub bub about "reckless" is over done. The term 'reckless' is an anthropomorphism that from a human-perspective God's love is simply too much, its too extreme, its goes way beyond the normalcy of sacrifice and desire...no one does so much for an enemy.

Yet, the remainder of the song has little debate. I didn't know so many reformed folks are out there?

It's good there are songs like this out there, the old songs played like a death dirge get little attention.


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Marvin

 2018/10/19 14:02Profile
TMK
Member



Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 4964
NC, USA

 Re:

I agree Marvin.

We have been singing this in church on occasion and I think it’s pretty powerful.

There are songs about Gods love that I cannot stomach (or at least parts of the songs) like the line in “He Loves Us” — “so heaven meets earth like a sloppy wet kiss” that has been sanitized for radio versions of the song to “unforeseen kiss.” But every time I hear it I think of that sickeningly line so the song is forever ruined for me at least.


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Todd

 2018/10/19 14:59Profile
cup
Member



Joined: 2018/9/6
Posts: 56


 Re: Love of God

Romans 5:5 could read "Because the love of God has been squandered and continues in that condition within our hearts by means of the Holy Spirit, Him having been devoted to us."


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Vern

 2018/10/19 16:18Profile
BranchinVINE
Member



Joined: 2016/6/15
Posts: 426
Australia

 Re:



Elizabeth,

That was from the New American Standard Bible. Guess you have to write to them to complain?

Maybe someone with good knowledge of Greek can help?

Anyway....how has "shall" falsified the verse?


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Jade

 2018/10/20 4:01Profile





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