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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : A Discussion of God's Judgement Under the New Covenant

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 A Discussion of God's Judgement Under the New Covenant

William writes...

~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Brethren,

Instead of tackling each other why do we not make a proper study of God's judgement and share the findings on a separate thread (especially those who are experienced in the Scriptures) Surely one cannot willy nilly quote scriptures from the OT and broadly apply them to us now, in the NT dispensation?

Questions to be answered: What is God's judgement?
When does He judge? Who does He judge? Difference between historic judgement on His people Israel in the OT and judgement now and of course the judgement to come?

Does He judge the world now or only the church?

Often the scriptures speak of bringing judgement on ourselves (as in the homosexual lifestyle etc)

Eg. the scriptures say Jesus will return and then judge the nations in righteousness

What about the statement: " Mercy triumphs over judgement"?

Jesus said the Holy Spirit will convict of righteousness, sin and judgement...because they believe not. This IS the judgement, not believing...?

Dive in, beloved brethren, and let the wisdom of the Spirit prevail!

Blessings,

~~~~~~~~~~~~

I believe our brother has giving solid wisdom in this. A good scripture to start with might be Romans 1:18-32. Commentators on Romans have said that this is God's judgment in giving men up to his base desires because they do not acknowledge Him as creator.

Perhaps a cross reference to the suggested passage will be John 3:36,

~~~
He who believes in the Son has eternal life, but he who does not obey the Son will not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.
~~~

My scriptures in the thread will be taken from The New American Standard Updated.

Any comments on these scriptures or any other scriptures are welcome in the thread.

Blaine

 2018/2/20 9:54
MrBillPro
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3162
Texas

 Re: A Discussion of God's Judgement Under the New Covenant

Another Brother William quote: "Surely one cannot willy nilly quote scriptures from the OT and broadly apply them to us now, in the NT dispensation?" Ok lets get started.. :-)


_________________
Mr. Bill

 2018/2/20 10:20Profile









 Re: A Discussion of God's Judgement Under the New Covenant

The Aposttle Paul writes...

~~~
For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received, that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures, and that He was buried, and that He was raised on the third day according to the scriptures, 1 Cor. 15:3-4
~~~

Also the Apostle John writes...

~~~
He who believes in the Son has eternal life, but he who does not obey the Son will not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him. Jn 3:36
~~~

Those with a New Covenant orientation would say that Jesus Christ and His gospel message is the center of the New Covenant. Consequently is God's judgment and wrath under the New Covenant ultimately upon those who reject His Son and His gospel message???

Blaine

 2018/2/20 10:27
MrBillPro
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3162
Texas

 Re:

Bear in mind that our Lords patience means salvation, just as our dear brother Paul also wrote you with the wisdom that God gave him. He writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these matters. His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction. (II Peter 3:15,16)

Therefore no one will be declared righteous in his sight by observing the law; rather, through the law we become conscious of sin. But now a righteousness from God, apart from law, has been made known, to which the Law and the Prophets testify. This righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference, (Romans 3:20-22)


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Mr. Bill

 2018/2/20 10:31Profile









 Re:

Mr. Bill writes,

~~~
Another Brother William quote: "Surely one cannot willy nilly quote scriptures from the OT and broadly apply them to us now, in the NT dispensation?" Ok lets get started.. :-)
~~~

Bro I'm tempted to say one issue at a time. But I think there is a case for bringing Old Testament scriptures regarding God's judgement. If we look at 1 Cor. 10 Paul uses God's Judgment of Israel as an example for New Covenant obedience.

But another question would be can we use Old Testament scriptures of judgement on Israel to apply to America? Can we use Old Testament scriptures of judgment on Israel to apply to the New Covenant Church?

Just putting that out on the table for discussion.

Blaine

 2018/2/20 10:34
MrBillPro
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3162
Texas

 Re: Mr. Bear

Mr. Bear writes "Bro I'm tempted to say one issue at a time. But I think there is a case for bringing Old Testament scriptures regarding God's judgement."

I agree 100%...I've always believed the "whole" Bible is still relevant today. If you read the 10 commandments are they still relevant today? If so we could all still be very well judged under them from God today, or am I wrong?


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Mr. Bill

 2018/2/20 10:44Profile
savannah
Member



Joined: 2008/10/30
Posts: 1927


 Re: warning




Warning is very much in keeping with the NT.


"We proclaim Him, warning and teaching everyone with all wisdom, so that we may present everyone mature in Christ."
Colossians 1:28

"These things happened to them as examples and were written down as warnings for us, on whom the culmination of the ages has come." 1 Corinthians 10:11

 2018/2/20 11:40Profile
TMK
Member



Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 5188
NC, USA

 Re:

Of course many of the warnings in the NT pertain to the danger of “falling away.”


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Todd

 2018/2/20 13:54Profile
MrBillPro
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3162
Texas

 Re:

The Bible doesn’t say the righteous are never afflicted. It does say, many are the afflictions of the righteous, but the Lord delivers him out of them ALL. Psalm 34:19


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Mr. Bill

 2018/2/20 14:32Profile
StirItUp
Member



Joined: 2016/6/4
Posts: 941
Johannesburg, South Africa

 Re:

Most of the warnings to the church ( read the whole of Hebrews) is regarding the need for perseverance in believing in Jesus Christ and the need for resisting sin and pursuing holiness in the fear of the Lord, as exemplified in one portion below:

"Endure your suffering * as discipline; * God is treating you as sons. For what son is there that a father does not discipline? But if you do not experience discipline, * something all sons * have shared in, then you are illegitimate and are not sons. Besides, we have experienced discipline from * our earthly fathers * and we respected them; shall we not submit ourselves all the more to the Father of spirits and receive life? ** For they disciplined us for a little while as seemed good to them, but he does so for our benefit, that we may share his holiness. Now all discipline seems painful at the time, not joyful. * But later it produces the fruit of peace and righteousness * for those trained by it. Therefore, strengthen * your listless hands and your weak knees , * and make straight paths for your feet , * so that what is lame may not be put out of joint but be healed."


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William

 2018/2/20 14:52Profile





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