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 Origin of Demons


"for these things also He evidently made for man— committed the care of men and of all things under heaven to angels whom He appointed over them. But the angels transgressed this appointment, and were captivated by love of women, and begot children who are those that are called demons;"
[Second Apology of Justin Martyr, Chapter 5]

" For the truth shall be spoken; since of old these evil demons, effecting apparitions of themselves, both defiled women and corrupted boys, and showed such fearful sights to men, that those who did not use their reason in judging of the actions that were done, were struck with terror; and being carried away by fear, and not knowing that these were demons, they called them gods, and gave to each the name which each of the demons chose for himself."
[First Apology of St. Justin Martyr, Chapter 5]



Have any other saints here considered this question and are there any scriptures or other early church viewpoints that could be helpful.


It appears the early Church believed that demons were the offspring of fallen angels from Genesis 6.


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SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2017/8/17 19:14Profile
TMK
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Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 5390
NC, USA

 Re: Origin of Demons

I have heard this as well and it may have some merit.


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Todd

 2017/8/17 21:04Profile
drifter
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Joined: 2005/6/6
Posts: 660
Campbell River, B.C.

 Re: Origin of Demons

Why would God create demons without giving them a choice, just predestine them to hell because their parents sinned?

I believe Jesus was very clear when He said angels cannot marry or be given in marriage. (They can't reproduce, they don't have physical bodies with a genetic code like we do.)


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Nigel Holland

 2017/8/17 21:40Profile
SteveHale
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Joined: 2007/2/15
Posts: 191
NSW Australia

 Re: Origin of Demons

From the book of Enoch:

And He answered and said to me, and I heard His voice: 'Fear not, Enoch, thou righteous man and scribe of righteousness: approach hither and hear my voice. And go, say to the Watchers of heaven, who have sent thee to intercede for them: "You should intercede" for men, and not men for you: Wherefore have ye left the high, holy, and eternal heaven, and lain with women, and defiled yourselves with the daughters of men and taken to yourselves wives, and done like the children of earth, and begotten giants (as your) sons? And though ye were holy, spiritual, living the eternal life, you have defiled yourselves with the blood of women, and have begotten (children) with the blood of flesh, and, as the children of men, have lusted after flesh and blood as those also do who die 5 and perish. Therefore have I given them wives also that they might impregnate them, and beget children by them, that thus nothing might be wanting to them on earth. But you were formerly spiritual, living the eternal life, and immortal for all generations of the world. And therefore I have not appointed wives for you; for as for the spiritual ones of the heaven, in heaven is their dwelling. And now, the giants, who are produced from the spirits and flesh, shall be called evil spirits upon the earth, and on the earth shall be their dwelling. Evil spirits have proceeded from their bodies; because they are born from men and from the holy Watchers is their beginning and primal origin; they shall be evil spirits on earth, and evil spirits shall they be called. [As for the spirits of heaven, in heaven shall be their dwelling, but as for the spirits of the earth which were born upon the earth, on the earth shall be their dwelling.] And the spirits of the giants afflict, oppress, destroy, attack, do battle, and work destruction on the earth, and cause trouble: they take no food, but nevertheless hunger and thirst, and cause offences. And these spirits shall rise up against the children of men and against the women, because they have proceeded from them.
From the days of the slaughter and destruction and death of the giants, from the souls of whose flesh the spirits, having gone forth, shall destroy without incurring judgement --thus shall they destroy until the day of the consummation, the great judgement in which the age shall be consummated, over the Watchers and the godless, yea, shall be wholly consummated." And now as to the watchers who have sent thee to intercede for them, who had been aforetime in heaven, (say to them): "You have been in heaven, but all the mysteries had not yet been revealed to you, and you knew worthless ones, and these in the hardness of your hearts you have made known to the women, and through these mysteries women and men work much evil on earth." Say to them therefore: "You have no peace."'


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Steve

 2017/8/17 22:04Profile
a-servant
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 Re:

Since the whole Bible is about God, angels and humanity only
it's difficult to consider any other "aliens" from another source

Genesis 6:2  That the sons of God saw the daughters of
men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all
which they chose.

angels are called "sons of God" here in contrast to
daughters of men

Job 1:6  Now there was a day when the sons of God
came to present themselves before the LORD, and
Satan came also among them.

and they received worship:

Deuteronomy 32:17  They sacrificed unto devils, not to God;
to gods whom they knew not, to new gods that came newly up,
whom your fathers feared not.

In the NT they are called unclean spirits, or here unclean devil
what hints at their nature and relationship with the number one
rebellious angel:

Luke 4:33  And in the synagogue there was a man, which had a
spirit of an unclean devil, and cried out with a loud voice,

They came from angels that left and were following L in rebellion:

And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their
own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under
darkness unto the judgment of the great day. Jude 1:6  

Where do all the sagas and mythologies come from, and the ancient
'gods of great power'? - these days their offspring seems to be
more involved in ground work, spirits that possess human bodies.

The last demon a pastor and my wife asked to state his name said
that his name is 'Rabbi' and he came here to teach, originally from a
city about 1000 miles away. He said this with a man's deep voice
coming out of a girl that rolled her eyes in a wild frenzy. The girl
had indeed tried to agitate Christians the days before she started
"manifesting" and her roommates called for help.



 2017/8/17 22:46Profile
savannah
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Joined: 2008/10/30
Posts: 2010


 Re: Origin of Demons


All efforts to identify these with angels or other supernatural creatures should be rejected.


THE "SONS OF GOD" WERE NOT ANGELS

The reasons why this passage cannot be applied either to angels or to other supernatural creatures are as follows:

No angels have been mentioned in the Bible up to this point, and the supposition that they make their first appearance in Scripture under the title "sons of God" is untenable.

In the N.T., particularly, it is human beings who are led by God's Spirit who are called "sons of God" (1 John 3:1; Romans 8:14; Galatians 4:6, etc.).

Note too that these "sons of God" "took them wives of all that they chose," an unmistakable reference to marriage; and Jesus our Lord flatly declared that angels do not marry (Matthew 22:30). The myth-hunters who attempt to drag mythology into this passage are contradicted by this, and we may only smile at some of the tactics of avoidance employed. Skinner, for example, after mentioning this, wrote, "But this must not be pressed."[3] Indeed, why not? We are delighted to "press it" as a complete refutation of the error of finding "angels" in this passage.

If angels, or other supernatural creatures, had been to blame for the gross wickedness about to envelop mankind, then God would have announced their punishment and destruction, instead of the punishment and destruction of men. Those who would like to place the blame for human debauchery upon the supernatural creatures are frustrated by the fact that God's punishment always falls upon the guilty, and that it was men, not angels, who received the punishment here.

The two classes of men visible in these verses had already been carefully introduced in Genesis 4 and Genesis 5, the sons of men (in their hardened state) being the line of the Cainites, and the "sons of God" being the people in the line of Seth. Scholars who deny the obvious unity and logical sequence of this narrative are, of course, totally unaware of this. - Coffman Commentary

 2017/8/18 11:52Profile
RogerB
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Joined: 2007/4/5
Posts: 248
Bruceton TN

 Re: Demons

It's obvious from Jesus many encounters that demons lack a body. What happened to theirs is the question. If they were living before the flood in a physical body they lost it when the flood came as they weren't on the ark.

We also read of those written in the Book of Life from the foundation of the earth. These then appear to be planned. We also read of those whose names were not written in the Book of Life from the foundation.

How then did they get here? Even though scholars think this or that it does appear that angels took on the form of men and seduced women. Their offspring would not be in the Book of life. They lost their home, their body at the flood, and now are continually looking for a host.


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James R Barnes

 2017/8/18 13:42Profile
savannah
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Joined: 2008/10/30
Posts: 2010


 Re: ET




So maybe the movie ET was prophetic?

WOW...This is so exciting!

 2017/8/18 13:48Profile
followthelamb
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"Pilgrim and Sojourner." - 1 Peter 2:11

 Re:


From what I understand, the modern, more reasonable interpretation of Genesis 6 did not appear until hundreds of years of church history had passed away.

Though the angels in heaven indeed do not marry and are not given in marriage, there were particular angels who left their first estate and took human wives and apparently those particular angels are still imprisoned in Tartarus/ the abyss until the time of the end.

Irenaeus said: "And wickedness very long-continued and widespread pervaded all the races of men, until very little seed of justice was in them. For unlawful unions came about on earth, as angels linked themselves with offspring of the daughters of men, who bore to them sons, who on account of their exceeding great size were called Giants."

The ancient Jewish historian Josephus, in Antiquities of the Jews, wrote: "Many angels accompanied with women, and begat Sons that proved un just, and despisers of all that was good"

"This notion, that the fallen angels, were in some sense, the fathers of the old giants, was the constant opinion of antiquity." William Whitson, translator of Josephus


I know they are not infallible, but early church fathers like Justin Martyr, Irenaeus, Tertullian, Athenagoras, Lactantius, Eusebius, Ambrose, etc all shared the same nterpretation of the Genesis 6, 2 Peter, and Jude passages regarding the angels who took on human form and begot the nephilim/ giants, whose disembodied spirits are the demons.


Though many translations of Genesis 6:2, 4 say "sons of God," the Septuagint widely used by the early disciples reads, "Angels of God."

 2017/8/18 14:35Profile
a-servant
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Joined: 2008/5/3
Posts: 435


 Re:

If someone starts reading Job 1:6 and continues....
then asks the simple question where this meeting took place

it should get clearer of who attended - and where

 2017/8/18 21:08Profile





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