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Man0fG0d
Member



Joined: 2012/5/27
Posts: 174


 Re:

Havoc and Sree,

Thanks for your input, excellent comments. Wish I had a 'like' button!

Tmk,

How have you been?

What is garbage? What's debateable? The Bible plainly says

1 John 2:4 KJV
He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

Revelation 21:8 KJV
But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

1 John 5:3-5,18 KJV
For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous. [4] For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith. [5] Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God? [18] We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

2 Corinthians 6:14-18 KJV
Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness? [15] And what concord hath Christ with Belial? or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel? [16] And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them ; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people. [17] Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing ; and I will receive you, [18] And will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty.

Luke 6:46 KJV
And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?

Thanks for your input. God bless


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Elijah

 2017/8/8 20:11Profile
proudpapa
Member



Joined: 2012/5/13
Posts: 2936


 Re:

Please read the entire book of first John very slowly and than read the Book of Galatians very slowly and multiple times

1 John 1:10
If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us

1 John ch 3 v 23
" And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment. "

 2017/8/8 21:10Profile
Man0fG0d
Member



Joined: 2012/5/27
Posts: 174


 Re:

Proud papa, we all have SinnED.

1 John 1:9 KJV
If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

1 John 2:1,3-4,6,15-17,28-29 KJV
My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous: [3] And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. [4] He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. [6] He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked. [15] Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him. [16] For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world. [17] And the world passeth away, and the lust thereof: but he that doeth the will of God abideth for ever. [28] And now, little children, abide in him; that, when he shall appear, we may have confidence, and not be ashamed before him at his coming. [29] If ye know that he is righteous, ye know that every one that doeth righteousness is born of him.

1 John 3:3,6-10 KJV
And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure. [6] Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him. [7] Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous. [8] He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil. [9] Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. [10] In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.



Jesus Christ said man shall not live by bread alone, but by every Word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God. Jesus Christ is the Word made flesh, if one doesn't believe The Word of God then one doesn't believe in Christ.


2 John 1:6-7,9 KJV
And this is love, that we walk after his commandments. This is the commandment, That, as ye have heard from the beginning, ye should walk in it. [7] For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist. [9] Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.

Great Scriptures you posted, but one scripture doesn't contradict another. All Scripture is given by inspiration of God. Thanks for your input.


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Elijah

 2017/8/8 21:23Profile
JFW
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Joined: 2011/10/21
Posts: 1425
Dothan, Alabama

 Re:

Elijah,

When was the last time you sinned?


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Fletcher

 2017/8/8 21:26Profile
havok20x
Member



Joined: 2008/9/14
Posts: 798


 Re:

Sorry for the long post guys!

Jesus said that at the judgement, there would be many people who are shocked by their rejection from glory, and they will attempt to use their works as the basis by which they should gain admission. Here are the verses:

Mat 7:21 "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven.
Mat 7:22 Many will say to Me in that day, 'Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?'
Mat 7:23 And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!'

There are a couple observations I want to make about these guys.

1) Their hearts are revealed in their responses. They truly believed that their works secured their access to heaven. Clearly they lacked faith. They believed more in the works than in Christ.

2). They clearly were surprised. They probably didn't hear rebukes from other believers because they fit in so well. TMK, I agree with lots of what Sree and Man0fGod are saying, but I think you agree with the content and not the delivery. I am fairly certain that a person claiming to be a follower of Christ that is motivated by selfishness only is likely a wolf, especially if it is that way their whole lives.

To strengthen my point, look at these familiar verses:

Mat 25:31 "When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the holy angels with Him, then He will sit on the throne of His glory.
Mat 25:32 All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate them one from another, as a shepherd divides his sheep from the goats.
Mat 25:33 And He will set the sheep on His right hand, but the goats on the left.
Mat 25:34 Then the King will say to those on His right hand, 'Come, you blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:
Mat 25:35 for I was hungry and you gave Me food; I was thirsty and you gave Me drink; I was a stranger and you took Me in;
Mat 25:36 I was naked and you clothed Me; I was sick and you visited Me; I was in prison and you came to Me.'
Mat 25:37 "Then the righteous will answer Him, saying, 'Lord, when did we see You hungry and feed You, or thirsty and give You drink?
Mat 25:38 When did we see You a stranger and take You in, or naked and clothe You?
Mat 25:39 Or when did we see You sick, or in prison, and come to You?'
Mat 25:40 And the King will answer and say to them, 'Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did it to one of the least of these My brethren, you did it to Me.'
Mat 25:41 "Then He will also say to those on the left hand, 'Depart from Me, you cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels:
Mat 25:42 for I was hungry and you gave Me no food; I was thirsty and you gave Me no drink;
Mat 25:43 I was a stranger and you did not take Me in, naked and you did not clothe Me, sick and in prison and you did not visit Me.'
Mat 25:44 "Then they also will answer Him, saying, 'Lord, when did we see You hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and did not minister to You?'
Mat 25:45 Then He will answer them, saying, 'Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to Me.'
Mat 25:46 And these will go away into everlasting punishment, but the righteous into eternal life."

I want you to examine this passage carefully. Most people use this to say the true believers had works but the fake ones didn't. If you read the responses, that isn't true. They both had works. The true believers laid down their lives for the least. The unbelievers ministered to important people. Their hearts are revealed. One group looked like Jesus. The other looked like the Pharisees--serving others only when it gained them glory.


To directly answer you, TMK. There is not an amount of time. It is a matter of the heart. A true believer will seek to be pure inwardly and outwardly. An unbeliever focuses on the outward only.


Sree, I would also like to add to your comment that IF a believer does continue to rebel, that God will discipline them, even to death, as seen in 1st Corinthians.

 2017/8/8 21:28Profile
proudpapa
Member



Joined: 2012/5/13
Posts: 2936


 Re:

RE : /// Great Scriptures you posted, but one scripture doesn't contradict another. All Scripture is given by inspiration of God. Thanks for your input.///

Yes, I agree it did not contradict the Scriptures you posted, it defined what those Scriptures where implying.

Which makes the Writings of John consistent with the writings of Paul.

add : We are not justified by the law



 2017/8/8 21:31Profile
Man0fG0d
Member



Joined: 2012/5/27
Posts: 174


 Re:

JFW, here ya go

1 John 5:16-18 KJV
If any man see his brother sin a sin which is not unto death, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it. [17] All unrighteousness is sin: and there is a sin not unto death. [18] We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

I don't want this discussion to go astray from the OP.

1 John 2:4 KJV
He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

The Scripture still stands.

Romans 6:1-5,7-16 KJV
What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? [2] God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein? [3] Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death? [4] Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. [5] For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection: [7] For he that is dead is freed from sin. [8] Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him: [9] Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him. [10] For in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God. [11] Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord. [12] Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof. [13] Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God. [14] For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace. [15] What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid. [16] Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?



Thanks for your input.


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Elijah

 2017/8/8 21:48Profile
Sree
Member



Joined: 2011/8/20
Posts: 1762


 Re:

Quote:

Sree-
That sounds wonderful but totally ignores reality. Christians are not always in a perfect state of mind so that they will do all things perfectly at the perfect time. Again I am no proponent of hyper grace but I am a proponent of plain old grace, which is pretty amazing. Nor am I a proponent of OSAS but I certainly don't think a person can lose their salvation because they had a bad day. Please.



I am definitely not OSAS, I believe it is lie of the devil. A doctrine that has sent many to hell!

The problem is people who proclaim the truth that I do here are considered to be proclaiming spiritual perfection and lacking eternal security. Both are lie. I have more eternal security than anyone who believes in false doctrine like OSAS. One does not need to believe in lies to hold eternal security. Even after holding on to complete Bible (not picking and choosing favourite verses), I can have higher Biblical eternal security.

Also I do not believe that we are already perfect. No we are. Even the Apostle Paul acknowledges that he is not perfect but pressing on to Perfection (christlikeness).

Quote:

That sounds wonderful but totally ignores reality.



I am not against reality. If we ignore reality then we become hypocrites. Jesus hated and spoke against the sin of hypocrisy. But reality should not be used to trust in God's promises and his word. His word is clear that if we do not repent and cleanse ourself regularly then we are not abiding in Christ. We cannot reduce the scriptural standard based on reality.
Let God alone be true and every man with reality be a liar. Including you and I!


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Sreeram

 2017/8/8 21:50Profile
Man0fG0d
Member



Joined: 2012/5/27
Posts: 174


 Re:

Amen proudpapa.

Havok, Great thought. Its true we will not be judged by our accomplishments, but by our obedience or lack thereof to God.

Matthew 7:21 KJV
Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.


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Elijah

 2017/8/8 21:54Profile
dohzman
Member



Joined: 2004/10/13
Posts: 2132


 Re: havok20x

well put. God bless Bro. DMiller


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D.Miller

 2017/8/8 22:15Profile





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