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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : The double promise of Ezekiel: a new heart AND a new spirit

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Joined: 2006/9/16
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 Re:

/I am not against Israel as a nation or Jewish people as a people. But I do not see God as having any "favorites" any longer except those who are in Christ Jesus./

I won't labor the point much longer here but those portrayed in Ezekiel 36:26 who have received a new heart and new spirit are those also who have the Spirit within (verse 36:27). To have the Spirit within with a accompanying new heart and new spirit means one belongs to Christ Jesus which means more than natural birth is needed to inherit the promises.

/As others have pointed out Gods promise is not a special land or special blessing available due to natural birth, but there is a heavenly land and a spiritual inheritance available to all those who belong to God through Christ Jesus./

The promise of a Savior to come to bless all families of the earth was made side by side with a promise of a eternal land inheritance. Along with a Savior, the everlasting covenant has always included a land promise. The Savior now in the heavenly "land" who is Lord over all of our spirtitual inheritance in the heavenlies is also going to return to EARTH.

22 “Therefore say to the house of Israel, ‘Thus says the Lord God, “It is not for your sake, O house of Israel, that I am about to act, but for My holy name, which you have profaned among the nations where you went.

23 I will vindicate the holiness of My great name which has been profaned among the nations, which you have profaned in their midst. Then the nations will know that I am the Lord,” declares the Lord God, “when I prove Myself holy among you in their sight.

24 For I will take you from the nations, gather you from all the lands and bring you into your own land.

25 Then I will sprinkle clean water on you, and you will be clean; I will cleanse you from all your filthiness and from all your idols.

26 Moreover, I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit within you; and I will remove the heart of stone from your flesh and give you a heart of flesh.

27 I will put My Spirit within you and cause you to walk in My statutes, and you will be careful to observe My ordinances.

28 You will live in the land that I gave to your forefathers; so you will be My people, and I will be your God.

29 Moreover, I will save you from all your uncleanness; and I will call for the grain and multiply it, and I will not bring a famine on you.

30 I will multiply the fruit of the tree and the produce of the field, so that you will not receive again the disgrace of famine among the nations.

31 Then you will remember your evil ways and your deeds that were not good, and you will loathe yourselves in your own sight for your iniquities and your abominations.

32 I am not doing this for your sake,” declares the Lord God, “let it be known to you. Be ashamed and confounded for your ways, O house of Israel!”

It's undeniable I believe from these verses that a nation will be regathered from the nations and brought back to their own land and given a new heart and spirit and the Spirit of Christ placed within them. THEN, they will live in the land God gave to their forefathers. The promise of a new heart and new spirit should not be lost and separated fronm the overall context of Ezekiel's writings which also concern a certain people living in a land on the earth. If the playing field has been leveled and all are equal it shouldn't bother believers if fellow believers in Christ weil one day live in a particular land under the rule of their and our own Messiah. When one member is honored all are honored. Since they will have the Spirit within (Ezekiel 36:27) they will therefore be TRUE SPIRITUAL ISRAEL living in the land just as those today who have the Spirit within are true spiritual Israel. If we have the privilege of a new heart and spiri and the Spirit within now it should not bother the all are now equal believing body that they will have it then.

Thank you for your OP. I just don't believe the true context of the new heart and new spirit being given is always remembered. This context is what I have tried to point out.

Thank you and blessings bro.


_________________
David Winter

 2016/10/19 9:15Profile









 Re:

David, I am not sure why you are trying to bring land or Israel into AB Simpsons message here? Why is this so important to you? Are you Jewish or are you a messianic Jew or into Jewish roots theology/practices ? I am not attacking you but I am interested to know what is driving you to steer this ship in that direction?

The other matters you brought up are a completely different subject matter and while they are important to some people I really could not care less what happens to this world and who gets what piece of dirt. Jesus is all I care about and the inheritance that My Father has for me and all those in Christ is to become like Him. These are the true riches, the true inheritance and nothing else compares.

 2016/10/19 10:13
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Joined: 2006/9/16
Posts: 1983


 Re:

/but I am interested to know what is driving you to steer this ship in that direction?/

The total context of the verses that Simpson crafted his message from. Praise the Lord for what he wrote. Praise Him exceedingly. Those passages from Ezekiel are one of my favortie set of scriptures and it's been my experience that many make reference to them but many times skip over the context of who they are specifically speaking of. I just thought I might point out the context of the verses. A people regathered from the nations and brought again to their "own land" are those to be given a new heart and spirit and the Spirit within.

/I really could not care less what happens to this world and who gets what piece of dirt./

Well, Jesus will return to this world and to the people and nation He ascended from. It seems hard to not care about this and this world since it it this world He will return to.

Anyway, I just am struck by the context of Ezekiel's words. Havinga new heart and spirit and the Spirit within and living in a land afterwards are foremost in his inspired words. I am willing to let it lie though and am not a messianic Jew nor part of any Hebrews roots movement. Thank the Lord for everything Simpson wrote of.


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David Winter

 2016/10/19 10:51Profile









 Re:

Thanks for clearing that up brother...I have seen too many good men get embroiled in that Hebrews roots stuff only to have their focus removed from Christ and sadly they and their innocent families get tripped up pretty badly.

Btw, I was not referring to the people of this world, just the dirt...the stuff we walk on lol. Jesus has no need for it and never should anyone else who is in Him. Again you keep driving the narrative towards including this rock and who gets which bit at the end of days, that should not concern us one wit brother, seriously. I don't care who gets the dirt...they can have it all lol. As I said before I don't care for any of that stuff and the subject matter is irrelevant to my life, all I care about is Lord and how to please Him. I can't remember who said it but I recall a quote once along the lines of "I would not mind if I had to spend all eternity in hell as long as the Lord was there with me".

 2016/10/19 11:12
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Joined: 2006/9/16
Posts: 1983


 Re:

/Btw, I was not referring to the people of this world, just the dirt...the stuff we walk on lol. Jesus has no need for it and never should anyone else who is in Him./

If Jesus has no need for it why do the scriptures present the fact that upon the return of the Messiah that the earth and nature will be renewed and become free from its bondage and brought into glorious liberty? Why will Christ rule over the earth if He has no need for it? Why has the Kingdom of God become so divorced from the earth in the view of many when Christ will return to the earth?

/Again you keep driving the narrative towards including this rock and who gets which bit at the end of days, that should not concern us one wit brother, seriously./

Respectfully, I couldn't disagree more that it shouldn't concern any of us. It concerned God enough to inspire Ezekiel to speak and write of it. I don't want to turn a blind eye to that part of scripture. God drove the narrative. The subject matter is spoken of extensively throughout scripturer and has always been part and parcel of the blessed hope of the church.

I think I'll hush now. I've said enough.

Thank you.


_________________
David Winter

 2016/10/19 11:32Profile









 Re:

Its all good David you can have all the dirt you want then when the Lord returns...go for it brother!

 2016/10/19 20:10









 Re:

Yes when he returns to........... Jerusalem, the mount of olives of all places. What a coincidence.

Zechariah 14

3 Then the Lord will go forth and and fight against those nations, as when He fights on a day of battle.

4 In that day His feet will stand on the Mount of Olives, which is in front of Jerusalem on the east; and the Mount of Olives will be split in its middle from east to west by a very large valley, so that half of the mountain will move toward the north and the other half toward the south.

 2016/10/19 20:51









 Re:

Every thread on SI doesn't have to turn into a discussion about end times and Israel. I was hoping we could have a healthy and edifying discussion of the subject matter of Simpsons message.

Here is more of what he said:

"This is the meaning of Christianity; it is the breath of a new nature; it is the translation of the soul into a higher universe and a loftier scale of being, even introducing it into the family of God Himself and making it a part of the Divine nature. This is indeed a stupendous mystery, and a bestowment whose glory may well fill our hearts with everlasting wonder, as we cry with the adoring apostle, "Behold what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God!"

Not by adoption merely are we thus admitted to the Father's house, but by actual birth; from the very bosom of the Holy Ghost, as from a heavenly mother, has our new spirit been born; just as literally as Jesus Christ Himself was born of the eternal Spirit in the bosom of Mary. So it might be said of every newborn soul: "The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee; therefore, that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God." Beloved, do we thus live in the Spirit? This is everlasting life."

 2016/10/19 22:59









 Re:

And then the passage which led up to the "double promise" quote. I found this particular section very intriguing and his words are probably very troubling to some. What do you think? Do you agree with what AB Simpson is saying below?

"To live in the Spirit is also to be baptized of the Holy Ghost, and have the Spirit as a Divine person living in us. There is something higher than the new birth, namely, the entering in of the Comforter, in His personal fullness and glory, to dwell in the consecrated heart and abide there for ever. Jesus was born of the Spirit in Bethlehem, but He was baptized of the Spirit thirty years later on the banks of the Jordan; and this made all the difference which we trace between His quiet years at Nazareth and His public ministry in Galilee and Judea. From that time there were two persons united in the ministry of Jesus of Nazareth. The Holy Ghost, as a Divine person, was united with the person of Jesus Christ, and was the source of His power and the inspiration of His teaching; and He constantly represented Himself as speaking the words and doing the works which the Spirit in Him prompted.

And so there is in the believer's life a similar experience, when the soul truly converted to God yields itself wholly to His control and becomes the living temple of the Almighty Spirit, who henceforth dwells in us, and walks in us, giving us not only a new nature, which we receive in regeneration, but a Divine Guest, a Presence to dwell in that new nature as its controlling guide and Almighty strength.

Then is fulfilled the double promise of Ezekiel..."

The full sermon is here: http://www.sermonindex.net/modules/articles/index.php?view=article&aid=40102

 2016/10/19 23:55
AbideinHim
Member



Joined: 2006/11/26
Posts: 3466
Louisiana

 Re: The double promise of Ezekiel: a new heart AND a new spirit

This post is filled with such glorious and awesome truths of the new birth and the indwelling of the Holy Spirit, it is hard for me to understand why we have to have a theological debate on what it is saying.

Praise God that the Holy Spirit is dwelling within us. He wants total control of our being. A. B. Simpson says it so well.
"When the soul truly converted to God yields itself wholly to His control and becomes the living temple of the Almighty Spirit, who henceforth dwells in us, and walks in us, giving us not only a new nature, which we receive in regeneration, but a Divine Guest, a Presence to dwell in that new nature as its controlling guide and Almighty strength."


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Mike

 2016/10/20 9:07Profile





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