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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : More random Genesis musings

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 Re:

You can't tell if I am being serious? Why not? Of course, I am!

No coincidences with the Lord or with His Word. It was divinely inspired.


 2015/11/7 21:01
Theophila
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Joined: 2007/1/15
Posts: 365


 Re:

I had originally included the Scripture about training up a child in the way that he should go....then thought the better of it, seeing as I don't yet have adult children.
The paragraph about #5 came immediately after that.

I didn't mean to make it sound like you were judging Jacob as a parent.


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Tolu

 2015/11/7 21:44Profile
Jeremy221
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Joined: 2009/11/7
Posts: 1442


 Re: More random Genesis musings

As far as Lot's wife and daughters look at Jeremiah 31 and 1 Corinthians 7.

 2015/11/7 23:16Profile
TMK
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Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 5343
NC, USA

 Re:

Hey Julius-

I guess I was never that into Bible codes etc- although I do know that certain numbers have significance.

I guess the ones you point out that give me pause are the references to chapters- because of course the original manuscripts had no chapter and verse demarcations.

I had never heard this 5 being a number of grace- thanks for pointing it out.


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Todd

 2015/11/8 7:19Profile









 Re:

Hi TMK,

I'm not into bible codes, either. Don't really know anything about them. These are just easily seen coincidences, maybe divine coincidences but not anything "deep" and "hidden" such as Bible codes.

Five seems to be a number for Grace or Life. Numbers obviously mean something to God such as 3 for the Godhead, and 7 for perfection, 6 for man, etc. Colors are also used by God, such as white for purity.

We live in a physical world and God uses many things in our world to illustrate spiritual truths for us. Numbers, colors, nature, sounds, etc.

Some people even believe the Holy Spirit supervised the chapters and verse numbering. Makes you wonder and I have no way of proving either side. Really have no need to. I just enjoy the "divine" coincidences as they help me to memorize.

 2015/11/8 8:08









 Re:

I was just noticing in the 5th book of the Bible (Deuteronomy) that God extended grace and life to the Edomites and Moabites. He told Israel not to distress them or meddle with them because He is sticking to his promise and the land He gave to Lot's and Esau's descendants so He tells Moses to leave them and their land alone. (Another interesting "coincidence")


"And the LORD spake unto me, saying, Ye have compassed this mountain long enough: turn you northward. And command thou the people, saying, Ye are to pass through the coast of your brethren the children of Esau, which dwell in Seir; and they shall be afraid of you: take ye good heed unto yourselves therefore: Meddle not with them; for I will not give you of their land, no, not so much as a foot breadth; because I have given mount Seir unto Esau for a possession." (Deut 2:2-6)


"And the LORD said unto me, Distress not the Moabites, neither contend with them in battle: for I will not give thee of their land for a possession; because I have given Ar unto the children of Lot for a possession." (Deut 2:9)

"And when thou comest nigh over against the children of Ammon, distress them not, nor meddle with them: for I will not give thee of the land of the children of Ammon any possession; because I have given it unto the children of Lot for a possession." (Deut 2:19)

Surprised to see this? No one merits God's grace, right? But, you can find God extending His grace and mercy to different people groups in the OT.

The Edomites were the descendents of Esau, and the Moabites and Ammonites were descendants of Lot. These people groups were not Canaanites. They were people who had a blood connection to the covenant head, Abraham. But of course, we know that the only blood connection that counts today is the blood of Jesus which is applied to us through faith in Christ. The same faith as the "faith of Abraham".

"But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: WHICH WERE BORN, NOT OF BLOOD, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God." (John 1:12-13)

 2015/11/8 10:57









 Re:

Brother TMK, just found this one.

2Co 11:24 Of the Jews FIVE times received I forty stripes save one.

Amazing! Let that sink in for a while. 39 lashings x 5. Now, that is grace and of course the Lord spared Paul's life. (2 Cor 12:9)

2Co 11:30 If I must needs glory, I will glory of the things which concern mine infirmities.

 2015/11/9 9:06
JFW
Member



Joined: 2011/10/21
Posts: 1234
Dothan, Alabama

 Re: More random Genesis musings

Brother Todd,

Could it be that (righteous) Lot valued the things of God (angels) to whom he played host even above his virgin daughters and tho they (angels) were powerful enough in themselves to handle the mob, Lot offers his "best" to preserve them? Hence his righteousness being displayed in his belief that God could protect/spare them, which He did, as well as the parallel between Ezekiel 9:4 and 2 Peter 2:7-8. This is where the scriptures seem to teach on why Lot was considered righteous before God.

I wonder if we (like Abraham and Lot) value the things of the Lord above our own so much so to offer them up as they did-

It also stuck out that tho these men were very powerful Angels, Lot nonetheless knowingly put himself and his whole house at risk by contending with them to enter his house that he may play host to them and comfort them out of what God had given him. It seems as tho he (Lot) wasn't completely aware these men were angels until after the incident when they revealed that the Lord had sent them to destroy the place.

Another thing that struck me was this act (on God's part) speaks of His integrity as He put eyes on the ground as it were to be witnesses as to why judgement would be passed, again being patient and merciful not wanting any to perish but all to come to repentance. Having said that when I was questioned/pressed on this by some unbelievers, my response was that the judgment itself was an act of Gods mercy as they had gotten so far gone that it would be unmerciful to not only allow it to continue but to allow children to be born into and raised according to these practices being themselves corrupted by the wickedness of them and infecting the surrounding areas like a cancer.


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Fletcher

 2015/11/9 10:33Profile
TMK
Member



Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 5343
NC, USA

 Re:

Fletcher-

You may be right, but that is an exceedingly tough pill to swallow- at least to me. I would have come out with guns blazing (or swords or anything I could get my hands on) before offering up virgin daughters to a depraved mob.

Of course it could just go to show how little females were valued in that culture.


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Todd

 2015/11/9 11:15Profile
JFW
Member



Joined: 2011/10/21
Posts: 1234
Dothan, Alabama

 Re:

Brother Todd,
Yeah I've def considered that especially in light of some other Old Testament passages but..... where this one seems (at least potentially) different is that Lot is characterized by God as righteous whereas in the other passages I'm thinking of they were not considered so at the time.

For me, if God accounts a man righteous and enough so to save him and his family then cultural precedences would be superseded by their faith, would it not?
Now that's not to say they don't mess up and make mistakes ie; Abraham giving Sarah to pharaoh to save his own skin- but even when that happened God nonetheless remained faithful and spared her too.

I don't know for sure and am just putting it out there for consideration...

Btw I do ever so enjoy your musings and the original had questions that cracked me up;) I can appreciate the honesty with which you approach difficult scriptures and I believe God honors that-


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Fletcher

 2015/11/9 11:41Profile





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