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 Letter from Stephen Sizer to Jacob Prasch

I thought this was a good letter. Don't know if Jacob responded.

An Open Letter to Jacob Prasch

Dear Jacob,

I have read with sadness your comments about me on your website. In obedience to
our Lord’s instructions in Matthew 18, I am willing to meet with you privately or with a mediator and seek reconciliation as brothers in Christ.

I realise you are disappointed at not being able to debate me on television. I was willing to do so until I read what you had written about me, especially the imprecatory associations with Menelaus. That was also the legal advice I received.

Through an intermediary I merely requested a postponement of the debate. Without knowing my reasons, rather prematurely you wrote, “I have nothing to say to such an utterly contemptible servant of hell, and I am not interested in hearing anything from him. He is of his father the devil.”

In response to my attempt to make contact with you, you wrote, “It is too late for that. That twisted snake should not have agreed to the television debate to begin with if he was going to run scared or back down.”

I suggest this is not especially edifying language and indeed may undermine the credibility of your ministry. I have recently debated both Geoffrey Smith of Christian Friends of Israel and David Pawson both on Premier Radio. Both conversations were constructive and honouring to the Lord.

I readily concede that you will not be happy with my critique of your interpretation of the relationship of Israel and the Church. However, on this occasion, the only one I can think of, I have not slandered you, questioned your motives or denigrated you personally.

Initially you were critical of me for being an Anglican. I am guilty as charged. In my defence I am part of the Fellowship of Confessing Anglicans committed to reforming the church on biblical grounds.

More recently you have criticised me for visiting Iran and for sharing a platform with an IRA member. You are wrong to assume that in doing so I am in agreement with the policies or actions of the Iranian government or the IRA. On the contrary I have made my own views plain through my writings, website and lectures, on the illegitimacy of the use of violence as a means of resolving the Arab-Israeli conflict.

Jesus himself was accused of being “a friend of tax collectors and “sinners.” ’ (Luke 7:34). As one myself, I am grateful to know him as my friend, and desire to share that friendship with those who at present are outside his family, even at the expense of being maligned or misunderstood by others.

As Paul says in Romans 10, “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.” How, then, can they call on the one they have not believed in? And how can they believe in the one of whom they have not heard? And how can they hear without someone preaching to them? And how can they preach unless they are sent?” (Romans 10:13-15)

I believe I have been ‘sent’ as I know you do too. We have clearly been sent to different people. We stand or fall before our Sovereign Lord to whom we are accountable not each other.

Like you, I care passionately for the Jewish people and pray for a secure Israel, as well as the fulfilment of the legitimate aspirations of Palestinians to an independent, sovereign and democratic state. I believe justice for Palestinians will bring peace for Israel, reconciliation with their neighbours and the marginalisation of extremists.

So Jacob, thank you for reading thus far. I repeat, I am willing to meet privately or with a mediator as our Lord instructed. While I may disagree with you theologically in the future, I will continue to pray for you and ask God’s blessing on your ministry.

Yours in Yeshua,
Stephen

 2015/10/29 15:48









 Re: Letter from Stephen Sizer to Jacob Prasch

"Nice" letter from the known anti-semitic, Jew hating and despising "Rev" Stephen Sizer

 2015/10/29 15:54









 Re:

I am just learning about Stephen Sizer. Can you post some references for your point of view. Not saying it's not valid, but if you could help me out that would be great. In his letter he states the following:

"Like you, I care passionately for the Jewish people and pray for a secure Israel, as well as the fulfilment of the legitimate aspirations of Palestinians to an independent, sovereign and democratic state. I believe justice for Palestinians will bring peace for Israel, reconciliation with their neighbours and the marginalisation of extremists."

I would like to know if his views are viewed as anti-semitic because he does not believe in the nation state of Israel having prophectic significance or because he actually is quoted as saying something harmful about jewish people? He said he does "pray for a secure Israel" and in another video, I heard him say that he does not begrudge Israel having a homeland or country of their own. So, if you could help me out and point me to some references that point to true anti-semitism, I would be grateful.

By the way, you don't think Christians are anti-semitic if they don't believe a nation state of Israel is not a valid biblical prophecy, do you?

I noticed that Stephen Sizer was at a Messianic Jewish Conference in Johannesburg, South Africa and MessianicGoodNews folks were there, too. In fact, I think that is where they are based.

Kevin Daly, who has written many articles for MessianicGoodNews wrote of Jacob's quote below. First Jacob's quote:

Jacob came for a bride from his own people. He desired Rachel, but he did not get Rachel at first, but Leah. After he learned to love Leah as much as he did Rachel, he got Rachel as well. In the beginning Leah had all the babies, her womb was most fruitful. But then Rachel conceives. Israel shall be a fruitful vine. Jesus came for Israel. He wanted to marry Israel, but He did not get Israel. He ends up with the bride He did not desire at first, the Gentile church. After He learns to love the Gentile church, then He gets Israel. In the beginning, the church has all the babies. But in the end, Israel becomes a fruitful vine." (Jacob Prasch)

John Wilkinson, Founder and Director of the Mildmay Mission, also wrote:

“ ... the Jewish nation as such is shunted to a siding until the times of the Gentiles run out, to allow the express train to pass, stopping here and there to pick up the Church, and then the Jewish nation will take her place on the main line of the Divine Plan, stop at all stations and take on the world.” (Israel my Glory, 1893, p.134).

Kevin Daly's response: "In other words what Jesus failed to do by pouring out the Holy Spirit at Pentecost, the Jews will succeed in doing much better once the church is taken out of the way." Gilbert Bilezikian rightly characterises this theology as turning the Church into the 'concubine of Christ'.

Alan Morrison was also there and he has two articles you might find interesting on the Restoration of All Things.

Phase 1: Times of Refreshing – Refining the saints
http://www.messianicgoodnews.org/the-restoration-of-all-things-part-1/

Phase 2: “Cleansing the world – Completion of the Church”
http://www.messianicgoodnews.org/the-restoration-of-all-things-part-2/

 2015/10/29 16:31









 Re: Just a very small sampling of Sizers agenda

http://www.standfirminfaith.com/?/sf/page/31707

http://blog.camera.org/archives/2015/02/church_of_england_lowers_the_b.html

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/religion/11399986/Vicar-who-blamed-Israel-for-911-attacks-is-banned-from-writing-about-the-Middle-East.html

http://roshpinaproject.com/tag/stephen-sizer/

 2015/10/29 16:41









 Re:

Here is the quote by Jacob Prasch, in which he uses the story of Rachel and Leah from Genesis to teach that Jesus did not desire the Church as his bride.

"Jacob came for a bride from his own people. He desired Rachel, but he did not get Rachel at first, but Leah. After he learned to love Leah as much as he did Rachel, he got Rachel as well. In the beginning Leah had all the babies, her womb was most fruitful. But then Rachel conceives. Israel shall be a fruitful vine. Jesus came for Israel. He wanted to marry Israel, but He did not get Israel. He ends up with the bride He did not desire at first, the Gentile church. After He learns to love the Gentile church, then He gets Israel. In the beginning, the church has all the babies. But in the end, Israel becomes a fruitful vine." (Jacob Prasch)

And John Wilkinson, Founder and Director of the Mildmay Mission

“ ... the Jewish nation as such is shunted to a siding until the times of the Gentiles run out, to allow the express train to pass, stopping here and there to pick up the Church, and then the Jewish nation will take her place on the main line of the Divine Plan, stop at all stations and take on the world.” (Israel my Glory, 1893, p.134).

Kevin Daly replies, "In other words what Jesus failed to do by pouring out the Holy Spirit at Pentecost, the Jews will succeed in doing much better once the church is taken out of the way." Gilbert Bilezikian rightly characterises this theology as turning the Church into the 'concubine of Christ'.

David Brickner, revives J.N. Darby’s eccentric dispensational scheme, suggesting the last two thousand years history of the Church is merely ‘a parenthesis’ to God’s future plans for the Jews, who remain his ‘chosen people’. (see Future Hope, p. 18, 130; J. N. Darby, 'The Character of Office in The Present Dispensation' Collected Writings., Eccl. I, Vol. I, p. 94).

Why was Jesus willing to die? The apostle Paul tells us in Ephesians 2 that Jesus died to reconcile both Jews and Gentiles to God the Father.

"His purpose was to create in himself one new humanity out of the two, thus making peace, and in this one body to reconcile both of them to God through the cross, by which he put to death their hostility. He came and preached peace to you who were far away and peace to those who were near. For through him we both have access to the Father by one Spirit." (Ephesians 2:15-18)

The Lord Jesus has broken down the barrier between Jews and Gentiles who recognise him as their Lord and Saviour. It is tragic when some of his followers, it seems want to focus on that barrier or even rebuild it.

 2015/10/29 17:16









 Re: By Saying that Jews were behind 9/11, Stephen Sizer hurts more than the Jewish Community!

Here is more about the guy you quoted and approved of

Bt Olivier Jack Melnick

Reverend Stephen Sizer, vicar of the Anglican Parish of Christ Church in England is notorious for his disdain for Israel and the Jewish people. He has been a longtime supporter of the “Palestinian” agenda, has visited Iran on occasions and recently even claimed that Christian Zionists are the same as members of the Islamic State and Al Qaeda.

Sizer wasn’t always such a virulent anti-Zionist. He actually started as a Christian Zionist and dispensationalist. It was in 1990 that during a visit to Israel and some meetings with Palestinian Christians, he engaged on a road that would eventually lead him to thoroughly change his views on Israel. This radical change prompted him to publish his doctoral thesis in his 2004 book: Christian Zionism: Roadmap to Armageddon ? [1] [2].

Recently, Sizer reached a new low in his anti-Zionist rhetoric when he posted a link to an article claiming that September 11, 2001 was part of a Jewish conspiracy.[3] His conspiracy theory belongs with New Mexico’s area 51 and the Loch Ness monster, and I would gladly put it in its place in the pantheon of lies, except that it this case, it hurts people.

There are three groups of people hurt by such a statement, outside of Sizer’s reputation, of course, but that one was already pretty tarnished.

First, it hurts Christians in general because Rev. Sizer is considered to be an Evangelical and that Christianity already has a tremendous amount of baggage when it comes to Judeo/Christian relations. Many Jewish people consider Christians to be anti-Semitic by default and Stephen Sizer’s recent endorsement certainly would validate their position. Of course, it remains to be seen if a person having such a hatred of the Jewish people and such a distorted understanding of Israel can be called a believer. I am not saying that Rev. Sizer isn’t a Christian but a reading of Psalm 83 might convince some that he also hates God (Psalm 83:1-5). Fortunately, not all followers of Yeshua the Messiah of Israel will agree with Sizer, yet his influence is still growing in a postmodern world where truth and logic are no longer required.

Incidentally, in 2011, Sizer had been accused of anti-Semitism by the Board of Deputies of British Jews, was investigated, but he was exonerated. In a letter published on his blog, he said: “I care passionately about the safety of the Jewish people and the right of Israel to exist within internationally agreed borders. I have always opposed racism, anti-Semitism and Holocaust denial as well as Islamophobia and the denial of the Palestinian right to self-determination and will continue to do so.” [4]

If indeed Rev. Sizer opposes anti-Semitism, maybe it would be wise for him to define what he means by that term, because accusing the Jewish people of conspiring together in the events of 9/11 is libelous, irrational and unfounded. If what he means by anti-Semitism fits one of the many definitions similar to mine[5], then he is delusional at best.

But Sizer’s view and its defense also hurt Christ Church of England in particular. The lack of a firm biblical position by Christ Church against Sizer’s diatribes would speak tons regarding their own views on Israel and the Jews. As it turns out, they decided to investigate him again [6]. The outcome will determine if that anti-Semitic statement was serious enough to lead to disciplinary action.

Finally, such a statement also hurts the Jewish people, as it fuels the fire of anti-Semitism. We know from the state of the world in general and the events of the last few weeks in France in particular, that anti-Semitism needs no fuel to advance on its destructive path.

Many Christians or even pseudo-Christians will see a validation in Sizer’s position. They will easily justify their own anti-Semitism by seeing Sizer as a Christian role model who knows more than them, thus, must be in the right. This is a problem that we could trace back to the second century Church Fathers.

Stephen Sizer poses a great danger to both Christians and Jews. One would certainly hope that a statement claiming that the Jews were behind 9/11 would be immediately dismissed as an irrational hoax, but then again the early 19th century pamphlet: The Protocol of the Learned Elders of Zion, which was a hoax, is still being published and circulated in 2015 [7].

Prompted by his diocese, Sizer retracted his support of that statement about Israel’s involvement in the terrorist attack of 9/11 within a few days and posted an apology on his blog: “I very much regret and apologise for the distress caused by the reposting on Facebook of a link to an article about 9/11 from Wikispooks. It was particularly insensitive in that last week coincided with Holocaust Memorial Day. I removed the link as soon as I received adverse feedback, and realised that offence had been caused. I have never believed Israel or any other country was complicit in the terrorist atrocity of 9/11, and my sharing of this material was ill-considered and misguided. At the request of the Diocese, I will be suspending my use of all social media and blogs with immediate effect and until further notice.”[8]

At the moment, it is unclear if the apology was a result of his diocese investigation, but what remains without a doubt, is that even with that apology, Sizer remains an ardent anti-Israel activist at best, and an anti-Semite at worst. As a matter of fact, in the 2004 version of his book “Christian Zionism”, he makes a very similar statement on page 251, where he actually accuses Israel of “complicity in the 9/11 tragedy”.[9]

Sizer might have published an apology but he appears less as having the contrite heart of a Christian in the wrong and more as a Christian figure who got caught with his hand in the anti-Jewish “cookie jar”.

The chocking weed of anti-Semitism is a diehard plant that just got watered a bit more by Stephen Sizer.

Christians should know better.

Christian Zionists will know better!

 2015/10/29 17:40









 Re:

I didn't say I approve of him. It is not for me to approve of men. I only posted two articles that were only theological (not political) in nature that I agreed with.

 2015/10/29 18:01









 Re:

Whew! That is some pretty bad stuff, Enue.

But, let's not assume "guilt by association" of everyone that believes all the promises to Abraham were fulfilled in Christ. I can only speak for myself as I am not anti-semitic or anti-palestinian. I am not anti-anything and won't let others label me. I am pro-Christ.

Now the LORD had said UNTO ABRAM, Get THEE out of thy country, and from thy kindred, and from thy father's house, unto a land that I will shew THEE: And I will make of THEE a great nation, and I will bless THEE, and make thy name great; and thou shalt be a blessing: And I will bless them that bless THEE, and curse him that curseth THEE: and in THEE shall all families of the earth be blessed. (Gen 12:1-3)

And all the families of the earth are blessed in Abraham through Christ.
(In these 3 verses, God is talking only to Abraham, "thee" is singular.)

Who is Abraham's seed?
Now to Abraham and his seed WERE THE PROMISES MADE. HE SAITH NOT, AND TO SEEDS, as of many; BUT AS OF ONE, AND TO THY SEED WHICH IS CHRIST. (Gal 3:16)

And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and HEIRS ACCORDING TO THE PROMISE. (Gal 3:29)

There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: FOR YE ARE ALL ONE IN CHRIST JESUS. (Gal 3:28)


These all died in faith, NOT HAVING RECEIVED THE PROMISES, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were STRANGERS AND PILGRIMS ON THE EARTH. For they that say such things declare plainly that they seek a country. (Heb 11:13-14)

Those who died in faith confessed they were strangers and pilgrims on earth implying they sought a country, it just wasn't on earth.

BUT NOW THEY DESIRE A BETTER COUNTRY, THAT IS, AN HEAVENLY: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city. (Heb 11:16)

Sometimes I wonder if the UN and Britain did a grave disservice to the Jewish people and should have left well enough alone and let the Jewish people remain as "strangers and pilgrims" in this world. I wonder if dispersed amongst all the countries as they were, if many more of them would have found the Lord. We may have really hurt them thinking we were helping them. Of course, I don't know what the UN's motive was, but it is rarely a good one.

Orthodox Jews are against Zionism, which I find very interesting. My question, is why didn't the UN and Britain respect the wishes of the religious Jews and instead they went ahead and set up a secular nation? How can Orthodox Jews be anti-semitic? You would think they know better than the godless UN or godless Britain. Do you think Religious Jews in Israel are traitorous? How could religious Jews be traitorous to a secular nation?

Neturei Karta oppose the so-called "State of Israel" not because it operates secularly, but because the entire concept of a sovereign Jewish state is contrary to Jewish Law. Is a sovereign Jewish State contrary to Christian law? We don't have Christian Law, we just have Christ. So, why did Britain butt in against the desires of the religious Jews living in Palestine prior to 1948? These are earnest questions, I don't know why.

From this page: (very, very interesting).
http://www.nkusa.org/AboutUs/index.cfm

All the great rabbis who in accordance with Jewish Law opposed Zionism at its inception did not do so merely due to consideration of the secular lifestyles of the then Zionist leaders or even for their opposition to Torah heritage and rejection of its values and practices, but due to the fact that the entire concept of a Jewish state is in direct conflict with a number of Judaism's fundamentals.

Condemnation of and segregation from anything connected to or affiliated with the so-called modern day "State of Israel" is based on the Talmud, the key fundamental doctrine of the Oral Tradition handed down by G-d to Moses on Mt. Sinai. The Talmud in Tractate Kesubos (p. 111a), teaches that Jews shall not use human force to bring about the establishment of a Jewish state before the coming of the universally accepted Moshiach (Messiah from the House of David). Furthermore it states that we are forbidden to rebel against the nations and that we should remain loyal citizens and we shall not attempt to leave the exile which G-d sent us into, ahead of time.

Jews are not allowed to dominate, kill, harm or demean another people and are not allowed to have anything to do with the Zionist enterprise, their political meddling and their wars.

Neturei Karta forbid any participation with the so-called "State of Israel" or any of its subsidiaries. Neturei Karta followers do not participate in "Israeli" elections nor do they accept any aid from "Bituach Le'Umi" (Social Security), and the educational institutions of the Neturei Karta reject any form of financial support from the so-called "Va'ad HaYeshivos" (equiv. to Department of Education).

The Zionist state employs a set of chief rabbis and uses religious parties to ornament their state with a clerical image. They study the Torah with commentaries altered to clothe the words with nationalistic nuances. Our rabbis have countless times proclaimed that it matters little which individuals or parties govern in the Zionist state because the very establishment and existence of the state itself is to be condemned and to be deplored.

The true Jews remain faithful to Jewish belief and are not contaminated with Zionism.

The true Jews are against dispossessing the Arabs of their land and homes. According to the Torah, the land should be returned to them.

Neturei Karta deplore the systematic uprooting of ancient Jewish communities by the Zionists, the shedding of Jewish and non-Jewish blood for the sake of Zionist sovereignty and the Neturei Karta favor a peaceful transition from the present Zionist rule to a non-Zionist entity.

According to Judaic Law the Torah has the last word. There is no such thing as a majority of Jews who happen to be Jewish by birth who can alter Torah Law in any way. In fact even the greatest rabbi or as Maimonides writes, "even the greatest prophet" [referring actually to an authentic prophet], has no right to distort or amend even one letter of the Torah.

Rabbi Blau stated shortly before his death that the acceptance by the United Nations of the Zionist state as a member state constituted a grave injustice to the Jewish people. Neturei Karta hope that this great error will be corrected at the earliest opportunity. The Neturei Karta regret that the Zionist state has usurped the holy name of Israel and that the Zionists so often pretend to speak in the name of the Jewish people and assume the right to act on our behalf. Only those rabbis who have not been affected or influenced by the poison of Zionism, can be considered the spiritual leaders of today's Jewry.

The world must know that the Zionists have illegitimately seized the name Israel and have no right to speak in the name of the Jewish people!

http://www.nkusa.org/activities/demonstrations/independenceday.cfm

Some interesting signs in this demonstration:
http://www.nkusa.org/activities/Demonstrations/20150810.cfm

One reads: "Support to Israel is not supporting Jews or Judaism"

State of Israel does not support World Jewry.

Judaism Rejects Zionism

Fascinating, I never saw this.

 2015/10/29 19:02









 Re:

Hey Rev.,

Do you call religious Jews who are against Zionism, anti-semites?

For instance, are these guys, anti-semites or just anti-zionism? Listen to his reasons.

https://youtu.be/ucd0Lc9qx5w

Listen carefully to this Jewish Rabbi.

He'd be a great street preacher!


 2015/10/29 23:38









 Re:

Your hatred of Jewish people is showing Mr Julius and you covering up with religion is sad.

 2015/10/30 11:24





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