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drifter
Member



Joined: 2005/6/6
Posts: 660
Campbell River, B.C.

 Re:

"Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh." Matthew 24:44

Did Jesus say this or didn't He?

You don't have to argue about eschatology, just be ready.


_________________
Nigel Holland

 2014/10/15 16:20Profile
staff
Member



Joined: 2007/2/8
Posts: 1432


 Re:

Hi TMK,
Jesus said that Elijah was coming again after John the Baptist was dead.He said that he would restore all things.
When we study John and Elijah we find that they did the exact same work.So we then can understand what work they did in the past we can also then understand what Elijah is going to do in the future.
By reading Acts 1 properly added to gospel scriptures regarding how the apostles came to Jesus we understand that Pentecost comes from John the Baptist a type of Elijah.
The pattern will repeat itself for a third time in the future and will end with the Rapture,
That is the outline but I think if you study it yourselves you will see the parrellels better rather than me spelling it out dont you think,
Yours Staff

 2014/10/15 16:40Profile
staff
Member



Joined: 2007/2/8
Posts: 1432


 Re:

Hi Drifter,
No we cant just be ready,
Yours Staff

 2014/10/15 16:42Profile
budgie
Member



Joined: 2011/2/25
Posts: 266


 Re: Isnt it sad when we listen to men but not the words of Jesus

Jesus so clearly tells us when He is coming but cannot tell us the day or hour, Jesus even tells us what will happen before He comes.
Is it not true that there are the many doctrines of men that cause division, but Jesus tells us the Truth, I will trust in the words that came out of the mouth of my Lord and saviour.

Mat 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
Mat 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
Mat 24:31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Jesus is true with His words.

Mat 24:36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.

Jesus is clearly talking about the Day of His Coming after the signs in the Heavens.

Paul also states the Truth

1Th 4:14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
1Th 4:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

Paul also clearly states that there is an order to the Resurrection, First Jesus and Jesus only and afterward all of those in Christ at His Coming

1Co 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
1Co 15:23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.

God even said when this First Resurrection of men takes place

Rev 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

I will believe the words of Jesus and God not the ear tickling theories of man

Is it the First Resurrection or isn't it the First Resurrection????

 2014/10/15 18:37Profile
budgie
Member



Joined: 2011/2/25
Posts: 266


 Re: divisions

One thing that is very true is this
It is the theories and doctrines of men that causes destruction and division.

You only need to look at the doctrines of the Sadducees and Pharisees.

Gods Word is Truth and always Glorifies Himself, there is no deception in His Word, sadly it is the theories and doctrines of men that bring division and destruction.

All we have to do is simply believe every Word that comes from the mouth of God because it is true, who are we to think that we have the authority to make or twist Gods Word to fit our theories, who is being Glorified, God or man.

Let us base our lives and beliefs on the Clear Words of God, Jesus and His servants.

God said that the First Resurrection takes place at the Coming of Jesus.

 2014/10/15 18:52Profile
staff
Member



Joined: 2007/2/8
Posts: 1432


 Re:

Hi Budgie,
Jesus said these things below out of his own mouth among which he said Elijah is coming again and will restore all things
-------------------------------------------------------------
I will trust in the words that came out of the mouth of my Lord and saviour
-------------------------------------------------------------
17:11 Jesus replied, “To be sure, Elijah comes and will restore all things. 12 But I tell you, Elijah has already come, and they did not recognize him, but have done to him everything they wished. In the same way the Son of Man is going to suffer at their hands.” 13 Then the disciples understood that he was talking to them about John the Baptist.

I realise these verses are from Paul not Jesus but are still relavent because we are not of the darkness it wont overtake us like a thief in the night

1Now as to the times and the epochs, brethren, you have no need of anything to be written to you. 2For you yourselves know full well that the day of the Lord will come just like a thief in the night. 3While they are saying, “Peace and safety!” then destruction will come upon them suddenly like labor pains upon a woman with child, and they will not escape. 4But you, brethren, are not in darkness, that the day would overtake you like a thief

Yours Staff

 2014/10/15 19:10Profile
KingJimmy
Member



Joined: 2003/5/8
Posts: 4419
Charlotte, NC

 Re:

Staff,

Being deliberately vague and simply saying "be a good Berean" and study what I tell you, and arrive at my conclusions... when it's not even clear what your conclusions are to begin with, is frankly...absurd. Why even post?

I think I'll back out of talking with you on this matter for now.

Grace and peace.


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Jimmy H

 2014/10/15 19:43Profile
staff
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Joined: 2007/2/8
Posts: 1432


 Re:

Hi KingJimmy'
I think that its only fair that if you are going to comment on the subject that you should be prepared to do a little leg work to see if it is scriptural thats what I am saying.
In The Past this is what Elijah did and it will happen in the same Pattern in the future.This is how God restores the Church to be ready when he comes whether pre or post trib.
Here is the meat on the bones sort to speak

Elijah Appears Mysteriously
John the Baptist appears Mysteriously
All Israel goes out to see Elijah
All Judea and Surrounds go out to see John
Elijah introduces 3:5 yrs of Drought
John introduces 3: 5 yrs of Jesus
Elijah deals with an antichrist figure in Ahab
John deals with an antichrist figure in Herod
Elijah deals with an evil woman called Jezebel that wants his head
John deals with an evil woman that wants his head
Elijah Confronts false Prophets
John Confronts the Pharisee and Sadducee
Elijah Prepares the Sacrifice
Their is wood- where the sacrifice is laid -
12 portions of Water-The water is poured over the sacrifice and the stones
12 Stones(tribes) are put in order
John Prepares the Sacrifice Jesus who he called the lamb of God by baptising
Their is Wood the Cross where the sacrifice is laid
Their are 12 stones the apostles who John makes ready or puts in order
The water is poured over the apostles and Jesus
Elijah's Sacrifice a bullock(representing burden) is at evening time
John the Baptist's sacrifice Jesus who burdened our sins at evening time
Elijah's Sacrifice was totally acceptable to the Father and is consumed by licking representing a tongue
John's Sacrifice Jesus is totally acceptable to God and Tongues appear at Pentecost.

So we can see that Elijah restored the altar of the Lord putting everything in order and in its rightful place and then Fire Fell from heaven
We can see John the Baptist restored the Altar of Lord putting everything in order except that Judas one of the stones was missing and Peter had to rectify that on the day of Pentecost. The qualification to become one of the twelve was that that person had to be baptised by John the Baptist then Fire Fell from heaven
Essentially Mount Carmel is a prophesy of Jesus Sacrifice for sin ending with Pentecost
Glory be to God for his word
Yours Staff

 2014/10/15 19:53Profile
KingJimmy
Member



Joined: 2003/5/8
Posts: 4419
Charlotte, NC

 Re:

Staff,

In all due respect, if you are going to assert there are parallels, the burden of proof is upon you to show the parallels, not upon me to find them... especially since I claimed I'm already exceptionally familiar with the stories and claim not to see what you say is there.

Thank you for finally showing some of what you are talking about, and some of the parallels you see. I still don't see how you get a pre trib rapture out of the entire deal. If you wish to show that, feel free, I will read it.

But so far I see the list you have made to involve a far bit of stretching. The first half is actually not too bad. At best though, it shows that the Bible is fond of certain themes and patterns and numbers. These aren't exactly true types. Rather, they are more like common themes.

There is always people coming out of nowhere to confront false prophets, idols, or enemies, make sacrifices, with hints of death and resurrection, and doing things in 3, 6, 7, 12, 40, or some other multiplier.

Blessings.


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Jimmy H

 2014/10/15 20:38Profile
budgie
Member



Joined: 2011/2/25
Posts: 266


 Re: to staff member

Thank you for your analogies
insightful
I would like to discuss with you what is in 1 Thess 4:13 to 18 as to what Paul states, I think that every person who would study these verses would come to the conclusion that the Rapture (caught up)takes place after the resurrection of the dead, that being the case the main event that must happen is the resurrection.
Paul states that all those that have died in Christ are sleeping with Him.
1Th 4:14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
Paul also states
1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
I ask you this one question

If the dead in Christ are with Jesus and Jesus is bringing them with Him then who are the Dead in Christ that He is raising from the dead.

My answer is this, when Jesus died and left His body He was very active and speaking to many, He had a mouth, He was away from His body for three days yet he fulfilled all of the functions outside of that body.
After three days He came back to that body, it states that He was raised from the dead, His earthly body had been changed to immortal, His body was not on the slab and it was not in the tomb, it was His old mortal body raised immortal.
It would have made no difference whether His body was dead for 3 days or 3 years or 100 years, God would have raised that body immortal.
So was the immortal Body of Jesus from Heaven or was it made on earth?, I would suggest it is both it was the reward in Heaven to be given to Him on earth, His body had the scars.
I suggest it will be the same for us, the dead are alive and resting in Christ and will come with Him to enter into their immortal bodies that will be raised from the dead at His coming, finally we will be clothed in Immortality.
Jesus did it that way so why not the same for us.

 2014/10/15 23:30Profile





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