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murrcolr
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Joined: 2007/4/25
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 Antichrist and the Revived Islamic Empire

Antichrist and the Revived Islamic Empire

The Bible is abounding with proofs that the Antichrist Empire will consist only of nations that are today, all Islamic.

Ezekiel’s Identification

The Prophet Ezekiel actually lists the nations in the Antichrist’s coalition quite specifically as he prophecies the future attack of the Antichrist Empire against Israel. In the chapter 38 of his book, Ezekiel begins by directly addressing the Antichrist whom the Lord refers to by the unusual name of “Gog.” The name Gog is a specific title particular to a ruler from the land of Magog. It could be likened to the Pharaoh and Egypt.

The word of the LORD came to me: "Son of man, set your face against Gog, of the land of Magog, the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal; prophesy against him and say: 'This is what the Sovereign LORD says: I am against you, O Gog, chief prince of Meshech and Tubal. I will turn you around, put hooks in your jaws and bring you out with your whole army-your horses, your horsemen fully armed, and a great horde with large and small shields, all of them brandishing their swords. Persia, Cush and Put will be with them, all with shields and helmets, also Gomer with all its troops, and Beth Togarmah from the far north with all its troops-the many nations with you." 'Get ready; be prepared, you and all the hordes gathered about you, and take command of them. Ezekiel 38:1-7

Is Gog Antichrist?

The majority position for the past few decades however, is that the invading army of nations described in Ezekiel 38-39 is not the army of Antichrist, but of another army led by another world leader.

There are two specific mentions of Gog and Magog in the bible, Ezekiel and Revelation.

When the thousand years are over, Satan will be released from his prison and will go out to deceive the nations in the four corners of the earth--Gog and Magog--to gather them for battle. In number they are like the sand on the seashore. They marched across the breadth of the earth and surrounded the camp of God's people, the city he loves. But fire came down from heaven and devoured them. And the devil, who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever. Revelation 20:7-10

After the earthly thousand-year reign of Christ, the bible says that yet another army will form to attack the holy city of Jerusalem. The leader of this army is called Gog and his army, Magog. Obviously, the first “Gog and Magog” shares more than a mere name with the second “Gog and Magog.”

In order to estimate who Gog is, we take a look at who Antichrist is. Antichrist, quite simply, is the devil incarnate - or at least the closet thing to it. There are actually passages of Scripture that shift from speaking of Satan to speaking of the Antichrist seamlessly as if they are one and the same. For instance Isaiah 14

Antichrist is Satan’s puppet that he will use to attack Jerusalem. And at least in the Book of Revelation, Gog is also Satan’s puppet that will serve the very same purpose. Even as Satan will raise up a man to carry out his work in the days to come, so will Satan also raise up a man to carry out his final rebellion against God one more time at the end of the Millennium. Both times, the leader of Satan’s rebellion against Jerusalem is referred to as Gog and his army is called Magog.

But if you are not sure, consider this second point. Ezekiel says specifically of Gog that the prophets spoke of Him in times past:

This is what the Sovereign LORD says: Are you not the one I spoke of in former days by my servants the prophets of Israel? At that time they prophesied for years that I would bring you against them. Ezekiel 38:17

The question must be asked then, if Gog and Magog are spoken of by Israel’s former Prophets prior to Ezekiel, then where are all of these references? One will be very hard pressed to find any unless one does some serious stretching of the Scriptures. But if we take the position that Gog is Antichrist, then it is very easy to find numerous passages about Antichrist and his invading Army throughout the prophets.


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Colin Murray

 2014/8/6 20:53Profile
murrcolr
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Joined: 2007/4/25
Posts: 1529
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 Re: Antichrist and the Revived Islamic Empire

Antichrist and the Revived Islamic Empire

Antichrist coalition of nations

Son of man, set your face against Gog, of the land of Magog, the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal; prophesy against him… Ezekiel 38:2

Rosh?

Some Bible translations differ on how to interpret the portion of this verse that says, “the chief prince of.” In Hebrew, the word translated as “chief prince” is “rosh.” The problem is that while rosh most probably means “prince,” or “head,” some argue that it should be treated as a proper noun, referring to the name of a place. Those who feel as though it is a place, use the word “Rosh” to find Russia here as one of the nations. The basis for doing so of course is due primarily to the similar sound of the two words. This opinion is also supported by the fact that Ezekiel specifically says that Gog would come from the North. While indeed, Russia is perfectly north of Israel, the actual interpretation of the word Rosh however is based on a bogus principle. One cannot simply take a word from an ancient Semitic language (in this case, Hebrew) and find a correlation to a modern name from a drastically different language (in this case an early form of Scandinavian) simply because the two words “sound the same.”

The Hebrew word “rosh” is used well over five hundred other times in the Bible and is each time interpreted as meaning “head, chief, top, best” or something similar. It is the same Rosh that we find in Rosh Hashana – “The Chief day of the Year” - the Jewish New Year.

Satan’s Coalition Of The Willing

Meshek and Tubal

Many very well-known prophecy teachers base their opinions primarily on the fact that the Scofield Study Bible identifies these two “nations” as correlating to the modern Russian cities of Moscow and Tobolsk. The problem again, is that the basis of this interpretation comes primarily from the similar sound of the words: Meshek – Moscow, and Tubal – Tobolsk. Unless one can legitimately trace the roots of a particular word back to its Hebrew origin, then the argument is based on very weak evidence.

Mark Hitchcock concludes that: A closer study of these names reveals that Meschech and Tubal are the ancient Moschi/Mushki and Tubalu/Tibareni peoples who dwelled in the area around, primarily south of, the Black and Caspian Seas in Ezekiel’s day. These nations today are in the modern country of Turkey, possibly parts of southern Russia and northern Iran.

Meschek was located near what was known as Phrygia, in central and western Asia Minor, while Tubal was located in eastern Asia Minor. So with Meshek and Tubal, we are dealing with portions of modern Turkey. Today this region is predominantly Islamic.
Magog

Regarding the identity of Magog, there is some difference of opinion among Bible teachers and historians. Referring to the Magogites, the Matthew Henry Complete Commentary on the Whole Bible speaks of this diversity of opinion:

Some think they find them [Gog and Magog] afar off, in Scythia, Tartary, and (Southern) Russia. Others think they find them nearer the land of Israel, in Syria, and Asia the Less (Turkey).

Those who argue for a Scythian connection find their best argument in a reference from the ancient Jewish historian Josephus, who wrote, “Magog founded the Magogians, thus named after him, but who by the Greeks are called Sythians.”

Walid Shoebat points out that: The Schaff-Herzog Encyclopedia of Religious Knowledge, citing ancient Assyrian writings, places the location of Magog in the land mass between ancient Armenia and Media - in short, the Republics south of Russia and north of Israel, comprised of Azerbajian, Afghanistan, Turkestan, Chechnya, Turkey, Iran and Dagestan.

Thus, while the specific nations that comprise Magog may be partially in question, the same general area is agreed upon. We are dealing with Asia Minor, and possibly parts of central Asia – some of the southern regions of the former Soviet Union. Today, Islam dominates this entire region.

What if we take the alternative interpretation made by some Bible scholars, that Magog is speaking of Syria? Even if this were the case, we still have an Islamic nation.

But here is the real key to identifying Magog: By identifying Meshech and Tubal – which we have already done. The reason for this is the wording of Ezekiel: “Gog, of the land of Magog, the chief (or head) of Meshech and Tubal.” Magog, is the “head” of land of Meshech and Tubal. We have already seen that Meschech and Tubal are located in modern day Turkey. Thus it would be foolish to assume that Magog as their “head” is in some other distant region or nation. While it seems more likely that Magog is either a portion of Turkey or a conglomerate of the former Soviet Turkic “istans”, whether it be these or Syria, we are definitely dealing with an Islamic entity.


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Colin Murray

 2014/8/6 21:16Profile
murrcolr
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 Re:

Antichrist and the Revived Islamic Empire

Antichrist coalition of nations (continued)

Persia

Persia is very easy to identify. Essentially, Persia is modern day Iran. In fact Iran was still called Persia until 1935. Obviously Iran is a predominantly Muslim nation. While there are some wonderful signs of change in Iran due to a growing dissatisfaction with Islam among Iran’s massive youth population, it does not seem likely that a majority of Iranians will leave behind its Islamic roots anytime soon.

Cush

Cush is also relatively easy to identify. Some Bible translations merely interpret Cush as Ethiopia, though this is not accurate. The Cush of Ezekiel’s day was far more northwest than the Ethiopia of today. In Scripture, Cush was often associated with Egypt and was a border nation to her:

Egypt will become a desolate wasteland. Then they will know that I am the LORD. Because you said, "The Nile is mine; I made it," therefore I am against you and against your streams, and I will make the land of Egypt a ruin and a desolate waste from Migdol (Northern Egypt) to Aswan (Today in southern Egypt), as far as the border of Cush. Ezekiel 29:9-10

Put

Biblically, Put (or Phut) is the region west of Egypt. Today this is the nation of Libya. The Septuagint translates the word Put here as Libue. Most modern scholars seem to agree with this interpretation. Shoebat however includes Algeria, Morroco and Tunis along with Libya. Either way, we again have another region or nation that is entirely Islamic.

Gomer

Gomer, it seems to be almost universally agreed upon among scholars, “refers to the Celtic Cimmerians of Crim-Tartary.” 8 Regarding the identification of Gomer, Baptist Pastor Fred Zaspel, accurately points out that:

Gomer is well known to the ancient world as Gimarrai of north central Asia Minor [Cappadocia]. These people are also known as the Cimmerians. This seems to be the simplest, most obvious interpretation.

So Gomer is Gimarra is Cimmeria is Cappadocia. Cappadocia is simply central Turkey. Again, another Islamic region.

Togarmah

Zaspel again sums up the identity of Togormah quite well:

Togarmah was a descendant of Noah through Japheth then Gomer (Gen.10:1-3). He is know to Assyrian records as Tilgarimmu… Tilgarimmu was a city state in Eastern Anatolia (Asia Minor, modern Turkey), more specifically, as Ryrie states, "the southeastern part of Turkey near the Syrian border." This identification is generally acknowledged by all.

Once more then we have another region that is in present day Turkey.

Assessing the Eight Nations

The final assessment we have five of the eight nations mentioned by Ezekiel occupying modern Turkey and possibly some of the southern Russian regions near the Caucasus Mountains as well as some of the Turkic nations of Central Asia. Obviously, the Lord directed Ezekiel to significantly highlight Turkey. The other three nations mentioned: Libya, Sudan and Iran, together with Turkey form a perfect circle around Israel. Turkey covers Israel’s entire northern horizon, while Iran is east of Israel, Sudan is South, and Libya is to the west. Israel finds herself surrounded on all four corners by the Islamic nations of the Antichrist Empire.


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Colin Murray

 2014/8/6 21:28Profile
murrcolr
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 Re:

Antichrist and the Revived Islamic Empire

What Is The Seventh And The Eight Empire?

Beyond the above identification of the nations of Ezekiel 38, the Book of Revelation also confirms the notion that indeed the region of Turkey will be the head of the future Antichrist Empire. Let’s examine these passages from the Book of Revelation:

There I saw… a scarlet beast that was covered with blasphemous names and had seven heads and ten horns. Revelation 17:3

The seven heads are seven empires that have existed throughout history that all have been foreshadows of the final empire that is to come. As usual, whenever a prophecy is given in the Bible that may be difficult in its symbolism, the Bible clarifies the symbolism and explains the passage for us:

This calls for a mind with wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains on which the woman sits. They are also seven kings. Five have fallen, one is, the other has not yet come; but when he does come, he must remain for a little while. The beast who once was, and now is not, is an eighth king. He belongs to the seven and is going to his destruction. Revelation 17:9-11

Now the seven heads are called seven mountains. The Bible often uses mountains as a symbol representing a kingdom or an empire. But most importantly this passage gives us insight into the fact that before Jesus returns, there will actually have been a total of eight “Beast” empires. The eighth empire will be ruled by the Antichrist. How can this passage help us gain insight into the identification of the final Antichrist Empire? First, we see that at the time that it was written to John, five of the empires had already fallen. This is seen in the phrase, “five have been.” These empires are generally accepted by Bible teachers as being the following:

The Egyptian Empire

The Assyrian Empire

The Babylonian Empire

The Persian Empire

The Greek Empire

After these five, the angel tells John that one empire “is.” At the time that John wrote the Book of Revelation, Rome “was.” It ruled the Middle East, Northern Africa and much of Europe. Thus the sixth empire was the Roman Empire. The next empire, of course, is the seventh, and then the eighth will be the empire of the Antichrist. So the seventh empire is the empire that we need to identify. Because according to the verse above, it is the eighth empire that will be a resurrection or a revived version of the seventh empire:

“The beast who once was, and is not, is an eighth king.”

Let me just paraphrase this portion for clarity:

“The seventh beast (empire) that existed, but then did not exist, will come back as an eighth empire.”

So if we are now waiting for the final eighth empire, then what was the seventh? What empire followed Rome?

The most common belief however, held almost universally by Bible teachers, is that the Antichrist Empire will be a revived Roman Empire. There are however some glaring problems with this theory: Firstly, Rome was the sixth empire. If Rome was the sixth, and will also be the last, then what happened to the seventh? This theory has a gaping hole. Is Rome the sixth, seventh and the eighth empires? Neither Scripture nor history nor common sense supports this. Secondly, every one of the previous six empires ruled the Middle East, including Jerusalem. This is very important. We must always remember that the Bible is thoroughly Jerusalem centric. It is not America centric, nor is it Western centric. In the biblical view of things, Jerusalem is the center of the earth. This point cannot be underscored enough. Any theory that revolves around a revived Roman Empire based in Europe - for instance on the European Common Market - is a foreign concept to the Bible. Unless the empire rules over or directly affects Jerusalem, it is actually a bit irrelevant to biblical mind-set.

And the third crucial point is that if we look at the first six empires, each succeeding empire either destroyed or absorbed the empire that preceded it. There is a very natural sucession. If we look at each empire, we see that they all fulfill these two characteristics: they ruled over Jerusalem and they defeated or absorbed their predecessor. The Egyptian Empire ruled all of Egypt and Israel as well. But the Assyrian Empire defeated the Egyptian Empire and likewise ruled over a vast portion of the Middle East, including Israel. After this, the Babylonian Empire defeated the Assyrian Empire and became even larger than its predecessor, again, ruling over Israel. Such is the pattern with each successive empire: The Medo/Persian Empire succeeded the Babylonian Empire only to be succeeded by the Greek Empire. The Greek Empire was in turn suceeded by the Roman Empire. Which leads us to the seventh empire. Who overcame the Roman Empire? In order to answer this question, we need to briefly review the fall of the Roman Empire. What exactly happened?

In 395 A.D., The Roman Empire was divided into two portions; the eastern and the western portions. The Eastern portion became known as the Byzantine Empire. In 410 A.D. the western capital city of Rome fell to invading Germanic tribes known as the Visigoths or Barbarians. The western/European half of the Empire including its capital had fallen but the Roman Empire nevertheless continued. How so? It simply shifted its capital and its throne from Rome to Constantinople – a thousand miles east. The western European portion of the Roman Empire fell but the Eastern Byzantine portion of the Roman Empire lived on for nearly another thousand years with Constantinople as its capital. The Roman Empire didn’t actually completely fall until the eastern portion of the Empire finally fell to the Turks in 1453 A.D. Likewise it was the Islamic Caliphate of Umar Ibn al-Khattab that took Jerusalem in 637. Thus we see that it was the various manifestations of Islamic Empire culminating with the Ottoman Empire that suceeded the Roman Empire and ruled over the entire Middle East, beginning with Jerusalem for over thirteen hundred years. The Turkish Empire existed right up until 1909.

Thus we see that the only empire that fulfills the patterns necessary to be considered the seventh empire is the Turkish/Ottoman Empire. This of course corresponds perfectly with Ezekiel’s list of nations with such a heavy emphasis on Turkey.


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Colin Murray

 2014/8/6 21:42Profile
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 Re:

its hard to argue the logic involved in those post

did you right that your self colin

 2014/8/7 3:46Profile
murrcolr
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Joined: 2007/4/25
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 Re:

Gary - I didn't write this, for the sake of time I used someone else's writing and shortened it to make it more readable.

I have personally searched all the points mentioned in these post, personally for me the journey to towards an Islamic antichrist began in 2002 when in Saudi, when I read a Islamic gospel tract.

In it I saw Islam denies God is our Father, the Sonship of Jesus and that and calls Jesus a prophet not the Christ...

1 John 2:22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.

It was with these thoughts in my mind, I started my research and it began to come together for me.


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Colin Murray

 2014/8/7 9:37Profile
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 Re:

Islam is just one more illegitimate child of the Roman Catholic church, "Mystery, Babylon the Great, the Mother of Harlots and Abominations of the Earth."

"Then said I, Wisdom is better than strength: nevertheless the poor man's wisdom is despised, and his words are not heard." Ecclesiastes 9:16


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Nigel Holland

 2014/8/7 13:28Profile
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Rev17:3 So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns.

Who is is this woman, and who is the beast with the 7 heads and ten horns?

Well in Rev 17:9-13 we are told, the seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth. Is that the 7 hills that the Rome is built on, I doubt it is. Why because it states later:

There are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space. The seven mountains are seven kings who ruled empires on the earth. But yet there is a eight king who will come for a short time.

Then we have the ten horns: the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast. A Kingdom is for a King, a Kingdom is a nation ruled by a King, so we have ten nations ruled by ten kings.

These ten King give there power to the beast: v 13. The beast doesn't have a empire like the seven Kings (Mountains) in the past... his rise to power will be fast.

Getting back to the Mother of Harlots, she has been riding on the back of the beast for centuries, she has been at work through all the empires intoxicating Kings and peoples who have drank of her idolatry and is still at work on the earth today, doing all the same things.

The Great Harlot is a spiritual force: Many people like to identify this great harlot with the Roman Catholic Church, but false religion is not limited to any one church or religion.

To finish; Rome has many Babylonian traits, that must be readily admitted, whoever to say that the sudden fall of the Great Babylon Whore is simply the fall of Romanism, or the utter destruction of the city of Rome, must be emphatically denied.


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Colin Murray

 2014/8/7 21:18Profile





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