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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : How Can I Be Sure of My Salvation? by John MacArthur

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 Re:

The trouble is, Rookie, such a take excludes from salvation those (including myself) who haven't been lucky enough to have mystical inner witness experience. I, personally, these days simply bank on the promises of God in scripture, whether I feel saved or not.

 2014/6/29 11:25
rookie
Member



Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4790


 Re:

Butters wrote:
these days simply bank on the promises of God in scripture, whether I feel saved or not.


The promises that are in Scripture are certainly true. And those promises through the Word of God, work to bring about a changed life. As the pastor of this thread points to the outworking of the Holy Spirit in those who are being saved according to 1 John, so we too should recognized a power that is outside ourselves that works to reveal the condition of our hearts as we encounter life day to day.

An example of this "relationship" with the Word of God is given to us ...

Psa 119:123
My eyes fail from seeking Your salvation
And Your righteous word.

Psa 119:124
Deal with Your servant according to Your mercy,
And teach me Your statutes.

Psa 119:125
I am Your servant;
Give me understanding,
That I may know Your testimonies.


Salvation comes through understanding how the Word of God both written and spoken becomes the yoke which Jesus speaks of.


_________________
Jeff Marshalek

 2014/6/29 12:55Profile
Sidewalk
Member



Joined: 2011/11/11
Posts: 703
San Diego

 Re: Continuing a great discussion

Rookie!

I love your forum name.... 4500+ posts...!!?

Butters-

You do well to believe the promises of God unto your salvation, and as you walk in these you will be an influence to others that they too might see your faith and seek your God on their own. It is supposed to be this way, it is not that you wait around, looking at your watch, when is God going to speak to me?

The first thing you should do, in my opinion, is to ask God for a revelation of Himself.

"OK God, your Word has convinced my head, I believe Jesus is Your Son and my Savior, put your Spirit in my heart that I might know you with more than just my head!"

Surprisingly, few actually pray a prayer like that. I can only tell you that I have prayed like that, actually I pray that a lot anyway, I read a passage of Scripture and just ask God to show me what it means- what amazing things come to me from just that!

Hearing from God does not have to be all that mystical. For example, when you hear a story of how someone came to know Christ and tears of joy well up in your eyes, you are experiencing the Holy Spirit within you. He is there, confirming Himself with this kind of witness all the time- enjoy it, thank Him for it!

I strongly suggest you be very direct with God, tell Him you want to hear His voice in your spirit. But be ready for some profound rebukes as well as the encouragement! Most of my best stories of hearing from God are rooted in rebukes that exposed my sin filled attitudes! He loves me that much!

And report back! When you hear from Him, the Body is edified!

May His love fill you to the point where you cry out "Stop, I can't take any more!"

Now that is a mystical experience!


_________________
Tom Cameron

 2014/6/29 14:48Profile
murrcolr
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Joined: 2007/4/25
Posts: 1529
Scotland, UK

 Re:

Quote: i think muurcol might be saying the flesh pre conversion cant turn from sin

Well yes and no… Repent means: to turn from sin and dedicate oneself to the amendment of one's life.

For example; a sinner who is addicted to drugs, could stop taking drugs, a sinner who is a thief could stop stealing, if they choose to reform and amend there life, however they would still remain a sinner.

So the free gift of God can’t be earned through reforming and amending their life.

The Holy Spirit must first convict the sinner of his sins, the sinner at that time has a choice he can decides to nothing and remains a sinner or he turns to Christ as your saviour by faith.

For me repentance is: God convicts of sin and you respond to Christ as your saviour by faith.

Quote: Repentance should be a character quality, a pillar of the great virtue of humility, ready to be called upon instantly when one is caught by the Holy Spirit in some compromise. A constantly repentant heart is eager to keep the books clear, to prevent that root of bitterness a chance to burrow and spread poison.

I could pull up quotes from Catholic’s, Mormon’s and LDS that would all say the same basic thing as that statement above.

I find religion bases relationship to God on personal discipline rather than the sacrifice of Christ. Religion also rejects Jesus Christ as the ground of hope, it depends on reformation, sorrow and or any thing else, but it leads to no reliance on Jesus Christ.

One who has turned to Christ should be known by his Christlikeness, not his repentant lifestyle. All that is real in that Christian, all that is holy, heavenly, pure, abiding, and saving, is of Christ Jesus.


_________________
Colin Murray

 2014/6/29 16:09Profile
murrcolr
Member



Joined: 2007/4/25
Posts: 1529
Scotland, UK

 Re:

How Can I Be Sure of My Salvation?

Quote: The trouble is, Rookie, such a take excludes from salvation those (including myself) who haven't been lucky enough to have mystical inner witness experience. I, personally, these days simply bank on the promises of God in scripture, whether I feel saved or not.

Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God 1 John 5:1

Are you born of God Butters?


_________________
Colin Murray

 2014/6/29 16:18Profile









 Re:

Thanks Sidewalk.

That was helpful.

 2014/6/29 18:44
brothagary
Member



Joined: 2011/10/23
Posts: 1861


 Re:

hi murcol that sort of makes scence but not realy ,after reading paul in romons ,he says we wants to do good but it is the evil that he ends up doing ,,and that was the delema of the natural carnal man ,,,,so what you said realy doesnt line up with what paul said ,,,a sinner might be able to reframe from a few vices ,,,but that is not repentence and a turing a way from sin ,,,,,that is the difference between bible believebornagaing christanity ,,,and judasim and islam and most of the other religeones ,,they say like pelagiues that man can renpent with out the new birth ,,where is the bible says i will put a new heart and a new spirit in you and i will put the fear of god in you then you will obey and keeep my will

 2014/6/29 20:24Profile









 coming to SI

is getting to be such a disheartening and grievous experience, within the last two years.

John MacArthur has done much harm with his 'strange fire" show.

 2014/6/29 20:37
murrcolr
Member



Joined: 2007/4/25
Posts: 1529
Scotland, UK

 Re:

Quote: hi murcol that sort of makes scence but not realy ,after reading paul in romons ,he says we wants to do good but it is the evil that he ends up doing ,,and that was the delema of the natural carnal man.

Well that's moving onto a different subject, the battle between the Spirit and the flesh for dominance after conversion.

Quote: he says we wants to do good but it is the evil that he ends up doing

Compare what Paul says in Romans 7:15 to Gal 5:16

Quote: that is the difference between bible believebornagaing christanity ,,,and judasim and islam and most of the other religeones ,,they say like pelagiues that man can renpent with out the new birth.

An example would be the Pharisees; Jesus said to them; "For you are like whitewashed tombs, which outwardly appear beautiful, but within are full of dead people’s bones and all uncleanness"

All that I saying is that from the signs it may appear that they have a "form of godliness" it may look like they have "repented" of their sins.

Look at what Christ says "Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord shall enter the kingdom of heaven" Saying you have submitted to the Lordship of Christ is not enough, having a form of Godliness in not enough, having the appearance that you have repented is not enough.

What's the requirement "doing the will of the Father"

That starts at conversion and it not a work one can see, as it is a work that begins on the inside, (It will work it's way out) he gives us a new spirit, that's why John says "Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God"






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Colin Murray

 2014/6/30 5:25Profile
brothagary
Member



Joined: 2011/10/23
Posts: 1861


 Re:

i dont think it maters wheather after read romons 7 i think it is ,,that one takes the view that it is post or preconversion ,,if it is post conversion that only proves after conversion he wanst to do godd but still did eveil ,,the imlication would be he inhertide the will to do good after conversion ,,and before that he did not have the will even to do good ,,so evil .carnal or the natural tendnece to rebel was who he was ,,he could not reform his life and stop sinning and doing evil ,,we could not even will to do good


if one takes romons 7 as a before conversion experence ,then he is still faced with the bibical facts he could not perfom the good but the law of eveil in his members drove him to sin ,,,so he sould not stop sinning in that state either






you said ..All that I saying is that from the signs it may appear that they have a "form of godliness" it may look like they have "repented" of their sins.



i agree with that i dont know why you would say that ,,becasue that was my point before conversion ,,one could not truly stop sinning and jesus pointed it out to them


you said ............What's the requirement "doing the will of the Father"

That starts at conversion and it not a work one can see, as it is a work that begins on the inside, (It will work it's way out) he gives us a new spirit, that's why John says "Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God"
,,,,this is what i was saying i agree with that that was my point ,,,gods will is that we stop living in sin repent ,,,stop sining ,,and as you just said that starts at conversion not before ,,,,,,,,that is what i said i thought you ment in the beginning ,,and you said sort of , and then you said a sinner could stop sinning and reform his life ,,,i dont what going we may have misunder stood one another ,,,,,my point was that the nature man can not please god that in his flesh he cant stop sinning till he is givern a new heart to want to

.

 2014/6/30 6:45Profile





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