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Discussion Forum : General Topics : Bitcoin and End Times Bible Prophecy?

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 Bitcoin and End Times Bible Prophecy?

What is Bitcoin?

Plain and simple Bitcoin is a medium of exchange. Bitcoin has been described by some as a digital crypto currency. And you may ask what is that? as they say, It is a currency that exists in cyberspace—let me give you an example that may help you understand this; many people have credit cards that issue reward points or reward dollars. These rewards are essentially a digital currency—only exist in cyber space--that you can use to purchase goods, services, or even with some companies redeem them for cash. So we are told that essentially Bitcoin is the same type of thing, it is a digital currency, that you can use to purchase goods, services, and redeem for cash.
from: http://endtimesforecaster.blogspot.ca/2014/01/bitcoin-and-end-of-world.html

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Saints,

I am interested in anyone's thoughts on Bitcoin is it bad, mark of the beast, a pre-cursor, harmless like paypal or none of the above? Would be good to hear what the Lord has shown anyone about this or if anyone on SermonIndex even has used it, etc.



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SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2014/5/7 12:07Profile
TMK
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Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 5086
NC, USA

 Re: Bitcoin and End Times Bible Prophecy?

I vote for 1000% not having anything to do with any end times scenario.

Sorry folks but if The Lord tarries do you really think we will still have paper and metal currency in 20 years? Highly doubtful. I very rarely carry cash on me now. Almost always there is no need for it and I sometimes go for weeks without having to use cash. I even give to my church online. Horrors!


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Todd

 2014/5/7 12:57Profile
MaryJane
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Joined: 2006/7/31
Posts: 3057


 Re: Bitcoin and End Times Bible Prophecy?

Greetings Greg

I have talked with other who seem to think bitcoins are a very real currency of the future. Personally I think they could be laying the ground work for a world currency that can be controlled much more easily then what we have now. With the way things work now people can still be paid in cash(under the table) but if in the future all transactions are done in a digital currency with someone monitoring each transaction then it would be very easy to control who can buy and sell. It is possible that currency could become all digital with the world governments coming together, deciding on a value for this currency then issue a number, card, or chip to each person for them to be able to use this currency for all future transactions.

As I said Bitcoins could be laying the ground work and in years to come we could see this kind of situation play out. Right now I do not believe Bitcoins to be stable enough or widely accepted enough by everyone to make that leap but as we are conditioned to become more and more reliant on the internet, and doing things electronically it could happen. I will not say that it is a mark of the beast but as I have said before, we know how the human story ends. The BIBLE tells us that one day the things we hold on to here and now will no longer be, everything that is happening now is all laying the ground work to one day bring these events into reality. When will it happen? I do not know, but I do know we are told in the WORD to live like it is happening today :)

Just my thoughts on this. I will ask some who might know more.

God bless
maryjane

 2014/5/7 13:10Profile
TMK
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 Re:

Where in the bible dies it say that technology must cease? Obviously there are some bad things that technology might develop (cloning, cross species hybrids etc).

There is no future literal mark of the beast because it is a parody of the mark of God which is not a literal mark (see Ex. 13:9)


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Todd

 2014/5/7 14:07Profile
MaryJane
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 Re:

by TMK on 2014/5/7 11:07:06

Where in the bible dies it say that technology must cease? Obviously there are some bad things that technology might develop (cloning, cross species hybrids etc).

There is no future literal mark of the beast because it is a parody of the mark of God which is not a literal mark (see Ex. 13:9)

_____________

Not sure who you are directing your post to or if its just a general question?

Wanted to add that Bitcoins are not regulated at the moment, this does not mean they won't be in the future. Bitcoin mining does require a lot of time and is risky because no one knows what the future really holds for this kind of currency. Right now Bitcoin transactions are made anonymously but if and when they becoming more widely popular that most likely will change.

God bless
maryjane

 2014/5/7 15:03Profile
dolfan
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Joined: 2011/8/23
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 Re: Bitcoin and End Times Bible Prophecy?

Bro. Greg, I don't know if Bitcoin is in any way substantially related to the "mark". I do know that money is already virtual anyway. Bitcoin is simply a private brand of money. When you deposit cash in the bank, the local bank doesn't hold that currency. They hold a percentage of their deposits in hard currency, as required by banking regulations, but the rest ultimately goes into the Federal Reserve Bank and gets recirculated.

Our accounts are digital first. Sometimes, if you are paid by direct deposit, it is purely digital unless you go to an ATM or make a direct cash withdrawal. Our money is all in the ether.

Add to that the fact that our cash money is fiat currency, and then you see that the whole thing is just a house of cards anyway. Whether Bitcoin or dollars, both are digital currencies already. Does this bode for the eventual "mark"?

I am of more than one mind on tribulation/rapture issues, admittedly. I tend to a mid-trib, pre-millennial rapture view in my own mind. But, I also know that for longer than I've been alive, there have many books written and sold on futurism where predictions were made that simply look ridiculous now. Yet, one thing that is consistent over time among futurists (Christian and unsaved alike) is the prediction of a cashless society. And, it seems actually to pretty much have happened already. Who among us might have saved enough cash to buy, say, a computer or TV and when we pull out cash to pay for it didn't get looked at like we are drug dealers? I know it has happened to me more than once. Cash is stigmatized now. It really is on its way out.


If the future includes a true person and power structure that denies buying/selling without a mark of the beast, it seems to me that cash is going to have to be useless. That's just me, though.


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Tim

 2014/5/7 15:15Profile









 Re: Bitcoin and End Times Bible Prophecy?

Quote:
One of the most frustration things people face in this fast technological age is security and privacy. Cyper-thieves are increasingly finding cleaver ways to breach security systems to steal personal ID information and empty our bank accounts. Government and big companies are creating ingenious software either to track our whereabouts or spy on our purchasing habits to sell us more worthless products. The Mark of the beast (666) will require a single sign-on entry chip (fingerprint, iris, voice, DNA, micro implant) eliminating passwords to access all goods and services in the future via our banking or phone systems. If the powers-that-be will only accept the “Mark of Beast” controlling all the communication systems through electronic means and computers, the perplexing question would be how do you access the Bitcoin system if the filtering interface Servers will deny you connection access? “Who told you to escape the pending wrath to come?” There is no escaping “the Mark of the Beast” Either you accept the atoning grace the Master (Christ Jesus) is freely extending to you for the remission of your sins; and him as your Lord and Savior and the eternal life to come, or you accept Satan and his Beast and his World System to come. As simple as that! Resistance is futile!



I thought the above anonymous post on William Frederick's blog from which the OP is taken, pretty well spells out in clear and easy to understand terms why this Bitcoin system is irrelevant.

There are some instructional videos which explain the Bitcoin system here:

http://www.khanacademy.org/economics-finance-domain/core-finance/money-and-banking/bitcoin/v/bitcoin-overview

The chap who is giving these training or learning videos uses a term which I will draw attention to. He says that in order to understand the Bitcoin system a person has to essentially suspend belief for a while. By which he means that a person has to suspend the ordinary ability to believe in something by simply following a rational known process. So that for example we know what "C" is because "A" leads to "B" which lead to "C". Clearly this process requires a prior understanding of the alphabet. In this ordinary way, to understand "C" we simply need to know what "A" and "B" is. In other words we need to know the alphabet.

Bitcoin is based on perverse logic and as such cannot be understood by a simple linear system of logic.

Apart from that fact there is a much more accessible reality which we can grasp from this system which is called Bitcoin.

The underlying idea behind this system of cryptographic electronic transactions derives its meaning from the open source community of code writers. The appeal of open source projects is that anyone can contribute. Apart from a core number of developers the overarching controlling mechanism is the code itself. From this repository of core code, in this case it is the Github repository, the technologies which run on the peer to peer network protocol form the security platform through which the Bitcoin system runs and functions. Its appeal is precisely that it is the peer members, of the physical network running the Bitcoin software or code itself, which collectively agree, process and therefore facilitate transactions. This means that there is no centralised banking system. There is no one peer (computer) which controls the whole process.

On the face of it this is its appeal for the author of the OP, who is generally in support of this system. In most conspiracy theories of the end time it is the banks who are the bad guys and therefore it is the banks who will effectively facilitate the mark of the beast. Or at least the centralised banks are presented as the backbone on which the mark of the beast derives its power. Clearly this power is the power to control buying and selling. What this system of Bitcoin, does is take away that centralised power. Therein lies its appeal.

I have to say that this is a deception because it relies on a fundamental acceptance that it is a system which will control people at the end of the age. The thing that will keep believers out of the means to buy and sell will not be computers or systems or anything else, it will be faith. It is belief in Christ which will keep believers out of the end time system (whatever it is) and not the system itself. No matter how sophisticated systems become they are all nevertheless vulnerable to abuse by code breakers. We always tend to view the mark of the beast in its negative connotation as a mechanism of control. And I agree this is the way Revelation presents it in obverse terms. However, just because there is a controlling mechanism, does not mean that those who do not participate in that mechanism are themselves controlled. We could simply look at things from a slight different angle and see our faith as an opportunity to live by faith instead of always focussing on and obsessing on the mark of the beast.

 2014/5/7 16:26
sermonindex
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 Re:

Quote:
We always tend to view the mark of the beast in its negative connotation as a mechanism of control.



Agreed brother, another aspect that is not emphasized on is the worship aspect of the antichrist that "control" will be the demanding of worship, perhaps the worship itself is the mark, the buying and selling is just the consequence or add-on.

It seems one who will not worship the antichrist will be at hard-straits to fit into any method and utility of a society that does, let alone buying and selling.


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SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2014/5/7 16:34Profile
proudpapa
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 Re: Bitcoin and End Times Bible Prophecy?

RE: ///I am interested in anyone's thoughts on Bitcoin is it bad, mark of the beast, a pre-cursor, harmless like paypal or none of the above? Would be good to hear what the Lord has shown anyone about this or if anyone on SermonIndex even has used it, etc.///

I do not know anything about this bitcoin, But I do appreciate bringing this to everyones attention and the openess of such a possability unvailing its self.


I recall Art Katz saying that he threw his credit cards away even though he never abused them, he felt convicted that they where leading to worship of the beast system.

It might be that many of these these things are training grounds trying to program us to become more and more reliant on the system, so as when the actual mark does start to become mandetory most peoples will already be to reliant (worship) on the system to refuse it. .

edit add : I just now read dolfan and Mary Janes post, very well said.





 2014/5/7 19:21Profile
Onesetfree
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Joined: 2011/11/18
Posts: 31
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 Re:

Interesting thoughts...it amazes me we live in a world where we can tap our debit or credit cards and purchase items. We can board a plane with our iPhones, and pay for coffee and other items by tapping our smart phones. We can lend people money on Facebook through an app or scan it over to their phone and of course we are in a global financial crisis. We have on-star and they can shut off our vehicles at any moment, our phones and other devices are on GPS and many cannot be turned off as they use hidden apps and services, we have cameras on every street and inside every building. Our devices in our homes now are smart devices and can all be operated through App's and last of all - digital finger prints and rental scans are common place security features. Now I am not saying anything about global currency or other possible theories on end times but one cannot ignore these things or bit coins. I am just glad I serve the King of Kings and can trust Him in all this crazy technology. Thanks for the thread and the input here, good replys!


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Steve

 2014/5/7 22:56Profile





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