SermonIndex Audio Sermons
Promoting Authentic Biblical Christianity.
Looking for free sermon messages?
Sermon Podcast | Audio | Video

Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : Two converted Jewish scholars exposing polluted teachings about grace ...

Print Thread (PDF)

Goto page ( Previous Page 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 Next Page )
PosterThread









 Re:

Quote:
by arkp on 2014/1/3 0:45:03 or sidewalk

We obtain revelation knowledge through His Spirit the mysteries hidden in his word, and understanding through Theology.



Some clarification please on what this exactly means: "understanding through Theology".

Thank you.

 2014/1/3 1:04
Sree
Member



Joined: 2011/8/20
Posts: 1621


 Re:

To me to preach that God forgives our future sins in Christ is unbiblical. There is no single verse to support it. I have read some posts here were some scriptural references were put to support this, but they are clearly not saying what they intended to say. To me it is like extending a promise that is not given in scripture by using our intelligence. It is like adding to God's word which is equally a dangerous sin as removing something.

Why do I believe we should not preach this? It is because the Bible does not talk about it. It is true that when Jesus died on the cross all my sins were put on him. They were my future sins at that time, because I was not even born when he died. So it is true that Jesus died for our future sins as well. But it will be applicable only when we repent or turn away completely from it after every act of known sin. Whether this repentance will happen automatically by his grace or needs human desire for Godly life, repentance is needed for Forgiveness. There is no forgiveness without repentance, no matter which stage of Christian walk I am in.

Forgiveness of sins is like healing a snake bite, where sin is snake. People who boast that our future sins are also forgiven and preach it are those who consider God only as a doctor who can heal snake bite. But people who preach overcoming life and true grace are those who consider God as someone more than a doctor who can give you power to have dominion over the snake so that it can never bite you. Those who experienced such power will no longer be willing to reduce God's majesty by saying he has forgiven your future sins already. They will boast on his power to give us dominion over sin.


_________________
Sreeram

 2014/1/3 1:51Profile









 We are saved from sin.

Titus 3:3-8, "It wasn’t so long ago that we ourselves were stupid and stubborn, dupes of sin, ordered every which way by our glands, going around with a chip on our shoulder, hated and hating back. But when God, our kind and loving Savior God, stepped in, he saved us from all that. It was all his doing; we had nothing to do with it. He gave us a good bath, and we came out of it new people, washed inside and out by the Holy Spirit. Our Savior Jesus poured out new life so generously. God’s gift has restored our relationship with him and given us back our lives. And there’s more life to come—an eternity of life! You can count on this."

The Message

 2014/1/3 9:42









 Re:

Quote:
by Sree on 2014/1/3 1:51:41

To me to preach that God forgives our future sins in Christ is unbiblical. There is no single verse to support it. I have read some posts here were some scriptural references were put to support this, but they are clearly not saying what they intended to say. To me it is like extending a promise that is not given in scripture by using our intelligence. It is like adding to God's word which is equally a dangerous sin as removing something.

Why do I believe we should not preach this? It is because the Bible does not talk about it. It is true that when Jesus died on the cross all my sins were put on him. They were my future sins at that time, because I was not even born when he died. So it is true that Jesus died for our future sins as well. But it will be applicable only when we repent or turn away completely from it after every act of known sin. Whether this repentance will happen automatically by his grace or needs human desire for Godly life, repentance is needed for Forgiveness. There is no forgiveness without repentance, no matter which stage of Christian walk I am in.

Forgiveness of sins is like healing a snake bite, where sin is snake. People who boast that our future sins are also forgiven and preach it are those who consider God only as a doctor who can heal snake bite. But people who preach overcoming life and true grace are those who consider God as someone more than a doctor who can give you power to have dominion over the snake so that it can never bite you. Those who experienced such power will no longer be willing to reduce God's majesty by saying he has forgiven your future sins already. They will boast on his power to give us dominion over sin.



I agree with you Sree. Furthermore, what would be the motivation of an individual to 1) preach the forgiveness of all future sins and 2) to want to be assured that all future sins are forgiven?

Doesn't this negate all the severe warnings to the Church in the Scriptures. What is the point to all the warnings?

 2014/1/3 10:09
jujashan4
Member



Joined: 2009/1/11
Posts: 77


 Re:

Peter saith unto him, Thou shalt never wash my feet. Jesus answered him, If I wash thee not, thou hast no part with me.  Simon Peter saith unto him, Lord, not my feet only, but also my hands and my head.  Jesus saith to him, He that is washed needeth not save to wash his feet, but is clean every whit: and ye are clean,

Do you see what he's saying?


_________________
Andrew Wales

 2014/1/3 11:30Profile









 Re:

1Jn 2:23 Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father: (but) he that acknowledgeth the Son hath the Father also.

We know that "acknowledging the Son" is not a one time occurrence, only. Because of the next verse we know that "acknowledging the Son" is a continual way of life each and everyday in all we do, think and say.

1Jn 2:24 Let that therefore abide in you, which ye have heard from the beginning. If that which ye have heard from the beginning shall remain in you, ye also shall continue in the Son, and in the Father.

If a man lives the life of 1 Jn 2:24, then any talk about future sins being forgiven is a moot point and only tends towards theological squabbling. But if a man does not live the life of 1 Jn 2:24, then it would be very important to him to convince himself that regardless of the way he lives (not "continuing in the Son"), all future sins are forgiven.

If you are in the Son and continuing in the Son, then there is no concern about future sins.

Do you see now why people are concerned about whether their future sins are forgiven or not? It is because of a life not lived presently "in the Son".

 2014/1/3 11:53
ZekeO
Member



Joined: 2004/7/4
Posts: 1014
Pietermaritzburg, South Africa

 Re:

Quote:
any doctrine that does not lead you to put to death the deeds of the flesh does not glorify Christ.

Any doctrine that takes Christianity and makes it about themselves has missed the good news.


_________________
Zeke Oosthuis

 2014/1/3 12:32Profile
twayneb
Member



Joined: 2009/4/5
Posts: 1930
Joplin, Missouri

 Re:

Quote:
I agree with you Sree. Furthermore, what would be the motivation of an individual to 1) preach the forgiveness of all future sins and 2) to want to be assured that all future sins are forgiven?



This is, as far as I have experienced, the most common train of thought brought forth by those who do not believe that the forgiveness extended to us at salvation also extends to the future. But this train of thought would only apply, in my opinion, to a person who was trying to obtain a fire escape and live by the rules so to speak just enough in order to avoid hell. But that very train of thought ignores spiritual regeneration and the change of lifestyle that is a result of that regeneration. It is as if salvation is simply a change of lifestyle, and that a fear of penalty is the only thing that would serve to keep a person on the straight and narrow. But that is the very bondage that Christ set us free from.

Quote:
Heb 2:14-15 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil; And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.



The law was carnal in that it was composed of external ordinances (see Colossians) that were imposed with the threat of penalty, including physical death, for infractions against the law. It was designed to keep the soul and body (mind, will, emotions, and physical members) in check until the time of reformation.

Quote:
Heb 9:9 Which was a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience;
Heb 9:10 Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation.



You see, the new covenant is not about a new and better way to avoid individual acts of sin, and a new way to atone for those sins each time they are committed. It is not the law with improvements. It is about regeneration of the spirit. It is about the enmity between us and God being dealt with in the person of Jesus Christ. It is not that God simply forgave sins that are past through Christ and that future failures must be individually confessed, repented of, and atonement procured. Sin itself has been dealt with. My spirit has been regenerated. I have been perfected forever.

Quote:
Heb 10:14-18 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified. Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before,
This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them; And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more. Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin.



Payment has been made for my sins...all of them. Where that payment has been made, no more offering is necessary. My spirit is now perfected forever. I have been made righteous, just as righteous as Jesus is righteous. This is exactly what Paul tells us in his letter to the Corinthians

Quote:
2Co 5:17-21 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new. And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation; To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation. Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God. For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.



I do not refrain from sin because I fear penalty. I refrain from sin because I am no longer a sinner. This is why we must learn to walk in the spirit and not in the flesh. My flesh still desires sinful things at times. My mind still desires sinful things at times. But I am crucified with Christ. I put to death the lusts of the mind and the flesh. I mortify my members which are on earth and find my life and my motivation through walking in the Spirit.

This is why it should grieve a believer when he or she sins. I really believe that no man who sins and then says, "It really does not matter if I sin. I am forgiven. I can do what I want with my flesh.", has been born again, or understands what is means to be born again. In fact, I believe it was the Nicolaitans who believed that they could be spiritually right with God and then pursue the lusts of the flesh with impunity. Their heresy was firmly denounced.

Sin is deadly. If we persist, it hardens our heart toward God. We become spiritually insensitive. We cease to be able to hear God's voice. We deaden ourselves. And the end result can be that, because we have been polluting our conscience, we come to a place of rejecting God and denouncing our own salvation. If we are to be saved in the end, we must hold fast our confidence. We must endure to the end. Allowing Satan a foothold in our lives through continuing in sin is deadly. We do need to live a repentant lifestyle, one in which we continually turn away from any known or revealed sin in our lives. But we need to understand that it is not any individual action of sin that results in loss of salvation.

I think it would be very fruitful to carefully study the book of Hebrews, especially chapter 10, when considering this topic.



_________________
Travis

 2014/1/3 17:38Profile









 Re:

twayne,

That train of thought reveals someone who is caught up in works rather than enjoying a fellowship and relationship with the Father, through the Son and by the Holy Spirit.

For one that is walking in Christ, this train of thought never enters his mind. Being in Christ, continuing in Christ, abiding in Christ offers the kind of incredible security that one does not even think about whether his sin tomorrow will be forgiven or not. His mind is on the Son, not himself. He is fellow-shipping with the Son and enjoying the Father's love. It just isn't the mindset of one "in Christ".

It belongs to the realm of the theologian.

 2014/1/3 18:13
jujashan4
Member



Joined: 2009/1/11
Posts: 77


 Re:

Peter saith unto him, Thou shalt never wash my feet. Jesus answered him, If I wash thee not, thou hast no part with me.  Simon Peter saith unto him, Lord, not my feet only, but also my hands and my head.  Jesus saith to him, He that is washed needeth not save to wash his feet, but is clean every whit: and ye are clean,

Do you see what he's saying?


_________________
Andrew Wales

 2014/1/3 22:50Profile





©2002-2019 SermonIndex.net
Promoting Genuine Biblical Revival.
Privacy Policy