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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : On the Calvinism / Arminianism Debate - Chris White

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Joined: 2011/11/11
Posts: 706
San Diego

 Re: Amen!

Thank you again, Just-in!

Noah, you are right, parents do pass sin to their children in the teaching of their lives. Children watch hypocrisy and become hypocrits, they watch lust and become concupiscent, selfishness to selfishness, violence to violence, on and on. They train their children to loathe that which is good and right, and encourage the descent into sinful ways. And generations are stained with sins of fathers multiplied on their sons.

(Some come into regret too late, and some have the incredible joy of seeing their prodigals return, and watch in amazement as new choices in repentance turn sinful children into servants of Almighty God.)

But none of that stands as a valid excuse before the throne of God, because as Just-in has noted- it is all chosen. Easy, slimey, lust gratifying choices that take a man- or woman- to Hell as Satan savors the deceitful victories.

Choose this day- who ya gonna serve??

Tom Cameron

 2013/11/12 0:32Profile


And it is hard to overcome. because Satan doesn't want you to be free, and if you do overcome, its a powerful message that most people don't hear.

I like Zac Poonen a lot for this reason. I feel like I'm not getting my ears tickled and that I am getting the true Gospel and the true Jesus from a man that has a victorious life in Him

 2013/11/12 0:37


I have been hesitating to wade into this discussion, and I don't mean for my comments to be received as a wish for debate.

I just want to respond very briefly to the following quote and the thinking of Chris White,

///Often the time that is spent trying to persuade another brother of a doctrinal point of view could much more wisely be spent sharing the Gospel with those who aren't yet saved. The author of the video discusses that and also the fact that one day (maybe sooner than we think) we could be in concentration camps together where we will then see the vanity and futility of some of our previous divisions.///

The consequences of holding either to Arminianism or Calvinism or something in between are immense. They say that doctrine has legs, and the debate has waged for centuries because that fact is understood. It does matter very deeply what we believe about election and free will (vs. free agecny) and depravity and perseverance of the saints. If they didn't matter they wouldn't be addressed in God's Word. The secret things belong to Lord our God, but the revealed things to us and to our children.

I do love the spirit though of what is being said on this thread, and we would do well to earnestly pray for greater unity amongst brethren - but let us pray for that unity that is like the unity between Father, Son and Holy Spirit, a unity in truth.

 2013/11/12 11:32


Being away from SI for some years and having become convinced during that period of reformed theology I was just doing a bit of digging about the history of SI on this discussion and discovered the following by post by Greg Gordon in another thread on this debate:

///We do not judge or condemn anyone who believes or disbelieves in reformed theology on these forums but we ask because of the divisive nature of this topic that it not be argued and discussed on the forums. There are many other discussion forums in the internet to discuss these things.

A goal of SermonIndex is to Focus on Christ, His person and scriptures alone and not on all the "ism"s men make from them. On this website we have asked and continue to ask people not to contribute or start divisive threads on the subject of calvinism or arminism. Of course we can talk about other scripture topics that are covered in these systems but we encourage the saints not to address these systems because they do bring division.

One of the purposes of these forums is to bring unity to the body of Christ and let believers to come together from all different backgrounds to encourage each other and edify and uplift each other. And also to learn from each other.

here is a note from the about us page:

Q. Does SermonIndex have a certain denominational emphasis?
Answer. No. SermonIndex desires to be a expression of the apostolic church found in Scriptures (Book Of Acts). It is a inter-denominational ministry with 100's of different denominations and ministries involved. Revival, Holiness, Authenticity, and a genuine experience of Biblical Christianity is core the values of this ministry. We believe that the Church of Jesus Christ is larger than any one denomination or group, and that Christ has His love slaves in many different sections of the visible church in many different parts of the world.

I am locking this thread and ask similar threads on these subjects would not be opened on these forums.///

So, I want to first apologize for wading into a debate/discussion that the moderator's have asked people not to have (see my previous post).

Second, I would like to ask why - if this subject is an untouchable - has SI posted Dave Hunt's sermon series "What Love is This?" in which Dave Hunt takes on reformed theology (in what seems to me a most uninformed way)? The series doesn't seem (to me) to contribute to the theme of revival, and you can't get much more polemic than he gets. Perhaps Greg or another moderator can help me out. I think I can understand the reason for asking that the debate be avoided, but it seems inconsistent to have at the same time that particular sermon series.

Thanks for your help on this,

 2013/11/12 15:41


Yes, Stephen, we should not contend for isms or doctrines of men. Notice, now that the thread has gotten quickly away from comparing Calvinism with Arminiaism and we are just discussing the Word. Maybe the title should be changed. I do agree, that no one seems energetic about discussing doctrines of isms.

 2013/11/12 19:25

Joined: 2004/11/21
Posts: 362
Tulsa OK


I have learned one thing about theology that it counts only when it helps a christian to walk in godliness and exhorts to pursue practical holiness, in other words when it teaches us how to be christlike. True theology comes from the heart and glorifies God and it seeks salvation to the uttermost for the sains of God who has been redeemed by Christ and his work on the cross.

I believe in a theology that tells me that salvation is by grace thru faith and that its a gift from God that we dont deserve, that all our self-righteousness leads only to hell, that only Christ saves from sin and its consequences. I believe that those who are called, choses, and faithful are the true christians who will inherit heaven and all that the Father has preserved for those who love and obey him.

I believe that any christian teaching that does not exault Christ and his Cross in the gosple and that does not set forth in a clear way the term on discipleship is lacking in apostolic doctrine. I also believe that repentance, faith and holiness are essential requirements in the life of the true believer.

It does not bother me if someone is calvinist or arminian as long as he has been regenerated and sanctified by the Spirit and seeks with all his heart to live and walk in the Spirit, I will even have fellowship with a roman catholic who has the genuine marks of the Spirit of God in his life and loves Jesus. Oh yes I know very well how much astray roman catholicism has gone from God and the Bible but when I read about christian martyrs in China whether catholics or protestants witnessing and giving their lives for Jesus it makes me not dare prejudice but be inspired by their heroic lifestyle and devotion. In heaven many christians would be surprized to see so many arminians, calvinists or even catholics and people that they did not expect at all to be there.


 2013/11/12 20:59Profile

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