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Discussion Forum : Miracles that follow the plow : losing my faith

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Oracio
Member



Joined: 2007/6/26
Posts: 1994
Whittier CA USA

 Re:

TMK wrote:

"I don't think being in the "desert" necessarily has to have anything to do with being disciplined for some struggle with sin. I think a true Christian who is not struggling with sin can be in the desert as well. God may be using it as a trial, but it doesn't mean it is a punishment.

I think we must be careful about making such blanket pronouncements. The original poster did not say he was struggling with sin and that that is the reason for his trial. If he had said so, it would be a different story."

Friend, I will post bible4life's words here again:

"It has now been about 4 years or so since i began to notice my heart was getting hardened towards the Lord and that i no longer was feeling the Holy Spirit lead me anymore. This past year or two i have sought God like i never have before whether its is prayer, reading his word, attending church, etc. I really have sought the Lord, but it seems my heart is only getting worse and more hard. Over the past month or two my faith in Christ has got to the point where i am just doubting him completely and his word, i have doubted before, but my heart always still believed, but now it is like i am really doubting now in my heart not just in my mind. I see myself just getting worse."

One thing is for sure, he admits to struggling with deep unbelief toward God and a hardness of heart toward Him which is getting worse and worse.

I have read other posts from him in the past over the years which indicate a similar thing, a deep struggle with the world the flesh and the devil, being bound by many Satanic attacks and strongholds.

Again, either he is a child of God being disciplined (as we all get disciplined in some way or another), or he is deceived. If he is deceived, smooth words of comfort will not help, they will only help harden and deceive him more in a false assurance, and his blood will God require at our hands.


_________________
Oracio

 2013/9/22 10:17Profile
ginnyrose
Member



Joined: 2004/7/7
Posts: 7440
Mississippi

 Re: losing my faith

In reading your post there is one verse that comes to my mind. Bro. Paul tells us in Heb.12:1: "Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us."

I do not know you personally, but am wondering whether you are arguing with God about something and justifying what you are doing/want to do but God is disapproving. This will place barriers in ones walk with the LORD.

Just a thought.

Hope you will find the peace you yearn for.

ginnyrose


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Sandra Miller

 2013/9/22 11:44Profile
TrueWitness
Member



Joined: 2006/8/10
Posts: 516


 Re: losing my faith

Dear brother John,

You say: "Over the past month or two my faith in Christ has got to the point where i am just doubting him completely and his word, i have doubted before, but my heart always still believed, but now it is like i am really doubting now in my heart not just in my mind."

The word of the Lord for you is 2 Cor. 10:3-5

For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war after the flesh: (For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strongholds;) Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ.

If you are having thoughts that cast into doubt the word of God you must forcefully reject such thoughts! Confess out loud the exact opposite of your doubt and that which is in agreement with the word of God. After reading your pleas on this forum for help with backsliding I tend to think that you are easily swayed by feelings. That is not faith. Faith does not look to feelings or outward circumstances. In fact, faith often stands in direct opposition to feelings and outward circumstances. Also, don't put a time limit on God to work. I've known some people who got an answer to prayer immediately after saying amen and lifting their head and opening their eyes. For each such instance there are several thousand others who had to hold on in faith before they got their breakthrough. Don't despair. But I do want you to confess who you are in Christ. Your behavior is not the basis for your identity. Your identity determines your behavior. You must believe and confess your identity in Christ in order to see a change in your behavior. And I don't mean merely giving mental assent to a teaching or just saying the words like a spell. I mean believing and confessing who you are in Christ in spite of how you might feel or what past behavior is like. Stop being tossed to and fro by the Devil trying to tell you you're a failure. Believe and speak the word of God simply because it's God's word. And don't make faith into a work or struggle. True faith is child-like trust. Nothing complicated, just taking God at his word and resting in it. The devil wants you to think it is a big struggle to get free. It doesn't have to be. Read Bondage Breakers again.

Blessings. I'm praying for you.
TW

 2013/9/22 13:55Profile









 Re:

MrBillPro,

Thank you for your post. Wonderful, healing, hopeful words. God bless you, brother.

"But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us. We are troubled on every side, yet not distressed; we are perplexed, but not in despair; Persecuted, but not forsaken; cast down, but not destroyed; Always bearing about in the body the dying of the Lord Jesus, that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our body. For we which live are alway delivered unto death for Jesus' sake, that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our mortal flesh." 2Co 4:7-11

 2013/9/23 1:44
Oracio
Member



Joined: 2007/6/26
Posts: 1994
Whittier CA USA

 Re:

Hi bible4life, I was able to find another thread which you opened up back in July of this year. In that thread used4him posted the following:

Quote:
"Dear Bible4life:

It is very hard to give advice when the details are very sketchy. I do not remember any of your other posts so forgive me if these questions are unneeded.

1. Have you made Jesus Christ your Lord and Savior? (Romans 10:9&10)
2. Are you getting fellowship with other born again believers who are walking with the Lord? (Hebrews 10:25)
3. Do you have any ongoing unconfessed sin that you are holding on to? (1 John 1:9)
4. Are you reading the bible and have a regular prayer time? (Hebrews 4:12)
5. Have you received the Baptism in the Holy Spirit, and are you walking in that power that He promised to give us?(Acts 1:8)

If you answer no to any of these, then that gives the enemy an advantage to attack you. The choice to do these things is up to you, no one can do them for you."


To which you replied:
Quote:
"Hey, brother many of my posts seem sketchy to a lot it is probably because I have so much to say and background to my problems that I do not write on here which can make things kind of confusing for some and I am not the best at explaining things in writing. I have had many posts over the past 4 years on this site. I have never seemed to get much better and I think many on the site have grown tiresome of me, but I am tire of struggling to. But here I will respond to your questions.
1.I think its hard to say that for me, because I have tried believing and surrendering my life to him, but I don't have the power to make him Lord of my life and Savior.I had a born again experience in 2003 where Jesus healed me an my eyes and heart were opened to the truths of scripture and Jesus and I began to hear the Holy Spirit speak to me and convict me. During this time without much knowledge in the Christian life I fell into sexual sin for 3 and a half years without fully repenting of it until 2007 when I got married with her who is now my wife of 6 years. At the time I knew I had to stop living that way because the Lord allowed me to be tormented by evil spirits as I continued to live that lifestyle. But, when I got married until now it has seemed I have got closer to God then ever before in prayer and reading scripture and going to church and the things of God in general and I still have notice my heart continues to get hardened and that it seems my eyes seem to not see clearly like I use to, the closer I have got to God it seems the further He has got from me. You would think the opposite would happen, but with me I have only grown further away and my heart keeps getting worse it seems in wickedness and sin and at times I have grown to fall back into the world. Also I have confessed every sin known possible to me and even tried believing I was forgiven, but it still doesn't seem to change anything. I have a had a couple situations where the Lord has answered my prayer, but it just experiencing him like I use to, where I felt lead by his Holy Spirit and I didnt need anyone else to tell me anything but Him, I really was lead by Christ and was filled with his love and loved righteousness. I was Christ consciousness at all times everywhere I was at, and I was in prayer or in talking conversation with God throughout the day and I just felt this closeness to the Lord always. I was not scared of anything, but I have lost that faith I once had and it has seemed I been a lost puppy on this site and to every Christian around because I do not here from the Holy Spirit like I once did. I am not a liar and I am not deceiving anyone, but I am honestly someone who has sought God and have wept many times crying out to him all day some days and overcome by great fears and attacked constantly by demonic spirits for the past 6 years and I have had fears that overwhelmed me not knowing if God has left me forever and that I was going to spend an eternity separated from him. I have not been able to help my situation, for most it is not like this for everyone, but for me 6 years of struggling. I want to be delivered, but I haven't. To answer the other questions I have been attending church down the street for the past 10 months straight, only missed one sunday unwantingly. For the past year I would say I have read the scriptures probably almost everyday, maybe about 3/4 of the time I have read the word or some kind of Christian book. I have tried to keep daily devotions with the Lord reading scripture and prayer. I fellowship with believers over the phone daily with friends in Indiana and mostly at my church and sometimes with otthers brothers occasionally maybe one a month. I hope this helps"



There are a few things that came to mind from reading your post. You stated that you had a born again experience back in 2003. Yet you also stated that after that, for the next 3 and half years, you continued to live habitually in fornication without any repentance until 2007 when you got married. Based on that, it seems highly probable that you were not truly born again in 2003. I say that because although true believers may and do fall into sin at times, they cannot and do not make a practice of habitual, unrepentant sin; Eph.5:5-6 says, "For this you know, that no fornicator, unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and God. 6 Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of these things the wrath of God comes upon the sons of disobedience."

You wrote, "I think its hard to say that for me, because I have tried believing and surrendering my life to him, but I don't have the power to make him Lord of my life and Savior."

Based on that it sounds like you may have never fully surrendered your heart and life to the Lord in repentance and faith in Christ.

You wrote, "I was Christ consciousness at all times everywhere I was at, and I was in prayer or in talking conversation with God throughout the day and I just felt this closeness to the Lord always. I was not scared of anything, but I have lost that faith I once had and it has seemed I been a lost puppy on this site and to every Christian around because I do not here from the Holy Spirit like I once did."

Friend, it is very possible to have a certain kind of powerful encounter and experience with God, without it being true conversion. That happens all the time unfortunately. I say that from experience, having had a false conversion myself many years ago. I know many others who have also had those kinds of experiences.

Like I stated before, I do not fully know your heart, only God does. But the best advice I can give you is to repent and believe on the Lord Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. He offers His mercy to all and says He will by no means cast out any who come to Him. I will share a few scriptures which came to mind. God bless:

"For thus says the High and Lofty One Who inhabits eternity, whose name is Holy: "I dwell in the high and holy place, With him who has a contrite and humble spirit, To revive the spirit of the humble, And to revive the heart of the contrite ones."-Isa. 57:15

"The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit, A broken and a contrite heart-- These, O God, You will not despise."-Psalm 51:17

"But on this one will I look: On him who is poor and of a contrite spirit, And who trembles at My word."-Isa.66:2

"Faithful are the wounds of a friend, But the kisses of an enemy are deceitful."-Prov.27:6


_________________
Oracio

 2013/9/23 14:31Profile
MrBillPro
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3202
Texas

 Re:

Quote:
just-in
MrBillPro,
Thank you for your post. Wonderful, healing, hopeful words. God bless you, brother.



Thank you, sometimes in these situations, our personal testimonies are the best thing we can offer to help someone else. I know! I have been there done that, were you could preach me a hundred sermons, and quote me a thousand scriptures, but someones personal testimony encouraged me the most.Personal testimony is the most effective tool we possess, our testimony requires no scripture and no need to be a Bible scholar. Every one knows himself or herself better than anyone else, it simply requires that we share the knowledge of ourself. We share our personal relationship with Jesus, and the road we traveled to get there. People can argue/debate scripture and theologies all day, but they cannot argue/debate the valid facts of our own personal life!
God Bless!
Mr. Bill


_________________
Mr. Bill

 2013/9/23 15:47Profile
bible4life
Member



Joined: 2009/1/21
Posts: 1558
Locport, Illinois

 Re:

Hey guys, deeply appreciate your prayers and concern. Oracio I do appreciate what you said a lot. I have been questioning and asking the Lord about my salvation for some time now, I kind feel as if the reason i am getting worse and not better is because i feel like i had my chance some time ago and i blew it living in sin the way i did and i feel because i did that the Holy Spirit is not coming back and the more i see myself seek God and i am only getting worse makes me to believe that i am in the boat of those in second peter and hebrews ch. 6. It terrifies me and along with that fear i struggle with wicked thoughts in my heart towards others and demonic attacks to my body and mind. I really feel hopeless. To everyone else , yes i have talked to my pastor and some church members about this and they prayed with me and sat down and talked with me and been given a pretty good book on assurance, etc. But, i really still have no peace about it at all. My heart is not right i just know it. To the other brother i could pick that book up for pretty cheap at christian store, but thank you for the offer. I just dont want the Lord to leave me and i want to be saved, but i guess this is something the Lord has to do Himself for it to all make sense. I again deeply appreciate your concern, what i am going through is scary for me. Thanks again


_________________
John Beechy

 2013/9/23 23:30Profile
Oracio
Member



Joined: 2007/6/26
Posts: 1994
Whittier CA USA

 Re:

bible4life, I'm glad to hear that you were not offended by my posts.

Regarding the passages you mentioned about final apostasy (which I believe is the same as the blasphemy of the Holy Spirit) or the point of no return, I honestly do not believe you are at that point at all. I believe that someone who is at that point has no concern at all for their salvation.

But yes, it is something you will have to work out between you and God. Will continue to pray. God bless.


_________________
Oracio

 2013/9/23 23:46Profile
TrueWitness
Member



Joined: 2006/8/10
Posts: 516


 Re:

In bible4life's last post he says:

I kind FEEL as if the reason i am getting worse and not better is because I FEEL like i had my chance some time ago and i blew it living in sin the way i did and I FEEL because i did that the Holy Spirit is not coming back and the more i see myself seek God and i am ONLY GETTING WORSE MAKES ME TO BELIEVE that i am in the boat of those in second peter and hebrews ch. 6.

Words capitalized are emphasis by TW. He did not capitalize them in his original post.

Dear brother, again I want to show you that you are not rooted in God's truth concerning your salvation and position in Christ. You obviously are basing everything on your circumstances and experiences and the feelings that come from them. Now you feel as though God has abandoned and given up on you because you sinned. This is not conviction of the Holy Spirit. This is condemnation from Satan. The devil knows that the best way to separate a saint from God is to afflict his conscience. Don't take the bait. If you were really unrepentant, you would not be in distress about your relationship with God. You need to resist and cast down all thoughts of condemnation and "it's too late, I'm too bad for God" type thoughts! Otherwise it will be a self-fulfilling prophecy. Fear and despair is faith (but of a negative and bad outcome). It will be according to your faith. Stop looking at the past or your own goodness (or lack thereof). Christ himself has made us acceptable to God.

 2013/9/24 14:43Profile
Sree
Member



Joined: 2011/8/20
Posts: 1700


 Re: Bible4Life

I see a need for salvation in your life. But the reason why you are tormented by Sin without any trace of victory could be much simpler than what you are thinking.


I personally believe that this is your problem. Are you honest about your condition? It is easy to be open in a forum with a fake name where no body knows who you are. But in reality are you covering your sins and acting holy? I am not saying you need to confess to everyone, but you should not act holy or perfect. The Pharisees have no hope of salvation period. Many times they came to Jesus and also believed in him and followed him. But never got saved. Why? Because they were not true about their condition. Are you giving an impression to your wife or Children that you are holy when you are being tormented? I would suggest to share with your closed ones that you are struggling. Do not need to say everything but at least you are struggling and you need prayers. I do it all the time when I find struggles in my life. My wife prays with me.

I don't want anyone to think anything more than what I am before God.


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Sreeram

 2013/9/25 1:27Profile





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