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ZekeO
Member



Joined: 2004/7/4
Posts: 1014
Pietermaritzburg, South Africa

 The requirements of true Jews

I asked the on another thread what is binding for us true Jews of the heart. I was pondering on the whole thing about tithes and offerings and different responses to that. I would like to broaden the scope a little bit.

This morning I read the following verse:

The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman's garment: for all that do so [are] abomination unto the LORD thy God. Deut 22:5 KJV

Now in the NT the only reference I can read is that woman and men should dress with modesty. Generally we percieve cross dressers with a bit of... well thats up to you how you view them. But there is no scriptural teaching in the NT that is against such a practice, just modesty. So where does the sense arise that it is not alright to do that.

RobertW mentioned that the Holy Spirit would convict and challenge us when we are out of line with his will, I agree more than a hundred percent with that, but if there is no clear law forbidding that behaviour how does one know that what you are feeling is from the Holy Spirit. I have used this particular verse of scripture and by no means want to focus in just this particular aspect.


Sooooo, what is it, where do we start in application and where do we end?

Comments of all shapes and sizes are welcome.


_________________
Zeke Oosthuis

 2005/3/13 13:42Profile
Eli_Barnabas
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Joined: 2005/2/16
Posts: 621
Cache Valley, Utah

 Re: The requirements of true Jews

Quote:
...for us true Jews...

?


_________________
Eli Brayley

 2005/3/14 10:59Profile
philologos
Member



Joined: 2003/7/18
Posts: 6566
Reading, UK

 Re: The requirements of true Jews

robert, can I borrow your helmet? :-)


_________________
Ron Bailey

 2005/3/14 11:06Profile
philologos
Member



Joined: 2003/7/18
Posts: 6566
Reading, UK

 Re: The requirements of true Jews

Quote:
I agree more than a hundred percent with that, but if there is no clear law forbidding that behaviour how does one know that what you are feeling is from the Holy Spirit. I have used this particular verse of scripture and by no means want to focus in just this particular aspect.

Your particular example has some relevence to your broader question. The OT gives meticulous outward detail as to what was necessary to please God. The New Testament is seldom concerned with the outward detail but from time to time you see the underlying principle of the Old Testament detail; Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, [u]nor effeminate[/u], nor homosexuals, (1Co 6:9 NASB)The Old Testament period of Israel is referred to by Paul as a time of childhood. You have to spell out every detail to children. (just you wait!) But you don't have to spell out the details to full grown sons.


_________________
Ron Bailey

 2005/3/14 11:13Profile
ZekeO
Member



Joined: 2004/7/4
Posts: 1014
Pietermaritzburg, South Africa

 Building the foundation

Quote:

philologos wrote:
The Old Testament period of Israel is referred to by Paul as a time of childhood. You have to spell out every detail to children. But you don't have to spell out the details to full grown sons.



Do you have this scripture in mind:

What I am saying is that as long as the heir is a child, he is no different from a slave, although he owns the whole estate. 2He is subject to guardians and trustees until the time set by his father. 3So also, when we were children, we were in slavery under the basic principles of the world. 4But when the time had fully come, God sent his Son, born of a woman, born under law, 5to redeem those under law, that we might receive the full rights of sons. 6Because you are sons, God sent the Spirit of his Son into our hearts, the Spirit who calls out, "Abba,A Father." 7So you are no longer a slave, but a son; and since you are a son, God has made you also an heir. Gal 4:1-7


_________________
Zeke Oosthuis

 2005/3/14 14:06Profile









 Re:

Eli he is referring to:

Rom 2:29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly;, and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

 2005/3/24 21:16









 Re: Building the foundation

Zek, I believe he was referring to:

Gal 3:25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

The schoolmaster was being under the law.

 2005/3/24 21:20
philologos
Member



Joined: 2003/7/18
Posts: 6566
Reading, UK

 Re: Building the foundation

Quote:
Do you have this scripture in mind:

What I am saying is that as long as the heir is a child, he is no different from a slave, although he owns the whole estate. 2He is subject to guardians and trustees until the time set by his father. 3So also, when we were children, we were in slavery under the basic principles of the world...



the very one!


_________________
Ron Bailey

 2005/3/26 3:28Profile
eagleswings
Member



Joined: 2003/12/30
Posts: 297
Connecticut, USA

 Re:



Zeke,

Quote:

“So where does the sense arise that it is not alright to do that.

“…how does one know that what you are feeling is from the Holy Spirit?”



The answer lies here:
[i]The anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.[/i] 1 John 2:27

We need not that any man teach us, but we may point out to one another various elements that we may have overlooked. For example. what Ron wrote:

“from time to time you see the underlying principle of the Old Testament detail;

‘Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor [u]effeminate[/u], nor homosexuals’.” (1Co 6:9 NASB)


Put this together with the old testament prohibition of cross-dressing. You just know it. That’s because we really have received an “anointing” That anointing is the Presence of the Holy Spirit Whom He has placed in us.

Don’t undervalue the voice of His speaking, That anointing is the bottom line. We can’t prove our conclusions to anyone else, and in this relativistic world which prides itself so much on its “open-mindedness”, the world will always hurl the charge of “Christo-Fascism” against us. At that point, keep your mouth shut. There’s no place in Christ’s economy for in-your-face "evangelism". (e.g.“God hates fags.”)

Ark Katz wrote somewhere something like, “Men needn’t accept our opinions, but they will be judged by our convictions.” And again, something like, “The greatest obsession of all is the need to make oneself understood.”


Roger












_________________
Roger P.

 2005/3/26 7:20Profile





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