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Joined: 2003/6/11
Posts: 9192
Santa Clara, CA

 Re: Improper use of editing

I scanned through this post really quick, I'm just curious about how the thread turned that starts with

Not alone here.

And this has been addressed previously:
[url=]Regarding "Editing"[/url]

This is the post that was originally titled something to the effect of "A thief amongst us..."
And did indeed have to do with tithing.

PJ, This is a improper use of editing.
Greg may very well may have to remove this helpful utility if it is going to be used in this fashion. How can anyone know what is going on in a thread if we are to come along and alter it later, leaving everyone else's replies disjointed?

If you have found that what you wrote is not appropriate, then explain so and recant or explain in a follow up. This is not an arbitrary function to be yielded any way you choose and is not taking into consideration others here.

Also, the penchant around here for thinly disguised and overt cynicism towards one another over difference of opinion is not casually done away with by a wave of the hand or another pronouncement to lighten up, even if it is not said in so many words.

This also applies to the assumptions thrown about by Picky400. This is unnecessary, it is grievous and it must cease!

There has been more than enough patience granted around here for those who want to press their own particular agenda's at everyone else's expense, whether that is intentional or not.

This stubborn refusal to consider others more valuable than themselves. The attempt to bring these issues to light in so many different ways, the divisiveness, the slandering, the lack of respect for those who have much experience in the things of the Lord and even the operator of this website, Greg Gordan, all being disregarded.
Am frankly disgusted with it.

Any number of postings related to this:

Another, and a well stated approach, read TonyS amongst the others, especially:
[url=]Let Us Be Cautious With Our Words[/url]

It has been reiterated over and over again what the thrust of this ministry is and now the tendency to drag it down into the gutter...:

[url=]Community Rules[/url]

Within these guidelines is something that is completely overlooked.

[b] If you're replying to a post, stay on topic as much as possible.
-If you're posting a new topic, do not post something that has been discussed numerous times. Browse the forums first or use the Search function.[/b]

The sense of audacity and self promotion is appalling, no consideration, no contemplating, no searching not only of the forum but of the heart.

Have backed off here for awhile, because these things always cause self examination of my own intents and planks. One is an issue of [b][i]conduct[/i][/b], that which 'we' try and moderate. The other is the issues of the heart.

Have no 'thus saith the Lord' to pronounce.
Have no desires other than to learn and grow in the things of the Lord and this site is [i][b]Rich[/i][/b] in them.

Greg Gordan has poured himself out into all that you see and hear, here. Countless hours, money, sweat and certainly tears over what has been happening around here of late, especially now that he can't give the attention to this site that he once did as he pursues studies in a Bible college.

All this is [b][i]Freely[/i][/b] given.

And to some it seems it's just some place to spout off any old thing that comes to mind.
Prior to this I was not angry, but grieved.
Now I am angry, as if that mattered. But let me just state that if Greg were as involved now as in times past, much of this would never had seen the light of day.

Futile as it seems, this will be posted in the ignored "WARNINGS" thread as well.


Mike Balog

 2005/3/12 11:30Profile

Joined: 2005/1/14
Posts: 2164


Thanks for clearing it up... I had no idea what this thread was about and how it got on titheing. I thought it was going to be about baking a cake? or making mud pies? :-) Maybe a SI pot luck? haha... i dont mean to be offensive in the humor sorry if it did.

Josh Parsley

 2005/3/12 13:25Profile


Oh, I see! We single out Picky400 for one infraction But I guess it's OK for others to come in and post after post to slam and deride the entire body for all the "Sin in their lives". Talk about a double standard! Just shut this whole thing down it's nothing but noise!


 2005/3/12 16:19

Joined: 2005/1/14
Posts: 2164


Did i miss something Picky400? What is going on? I must have misread something...

Josh Parsley

 2005/3/12 16:26Profile

Joined: 2004/2/12
Posts: 4636
Independence, Missouri


The royal law of loving GOd and loving man is the NT answer, but what of the 613 odd laws that RobertW refers to at times, how many of them are still binding?

Hi ZekeO,

That is a hard question because if I say none of them it will sound antinomian- if I sort through them and filter out all the ceremonial stuff I have just given you "some rules".

The Jews compiled the 613 Laws after the time of Jesus. It was simply a way to try and codify all the writings of Moses into 613 laws. There are 365 don'ts and 248 do's. They built upon this with 'fences' around the law in order to keep people from breaking them. This became known as the Talmud. It is all dead religion!

You could find the list on the internet and look through them. It is of limited value- though it is interesting to see what God means by 'loving Him' and our 'loving our neighbor.' The law is good only if it is used lawfully.

What we need to focus on I believe is simply reading God's word and allowing Him to write His word upon our hearts. That is the covenant we are under. If I walk in the Spirit I will not be transgressing the laws of God. If I am "in the flesh" then I have not the Spirit of God. But we are not in the flesh but in the Spirit if so be that the Spirit of Christ dwells in us. We are changed into HIS image from glory to glory by the SPirit of God. in that the law is not something we do, but it is who we are as the workmanship of God. We need to the word of God to get it into our heart; but we must allow the Holy Spirit to write it on our hearts and minds as we meditate upon the word and memorize the word. When the Holy Ghost needs to He will 'check' you and call to remembrance the word He wants to 'pull up' to direct your behavior.

God Bless,


Robert Wurtz II

 2005/3/12 16:53Profile

 Re: Wow....this all started because I just wanted to point out some things to think about

Wow....I NEVER intented this post to get as heavy as it did.....nor have anyone biting I decided to end the whole thing and try and lighten everyone up by making US realize that we are family. It was supposive to show us areas that we are sometimes missing the boat on in our beliefs...not your beliefs nor my beliefs....just in our heart's.....and help in a nice way to help us take an account of walking better with God and allowing him to bless us because of it.

I Never thought it would go to a "Tithing" heated debate. If tithing is not your cup of tea...try some delicious cake.....but leave the mud pie for the kids to play with and enjoy. And originally....also the topic was also about the lack of Prayer and missing out on the blessings there....yet that got overlooked completely somehow.

So to end the chances of sinning and biting one another over personal beliefs and thoughts....I decided to pull it all off and stop the whole thing. It needed to be done and done immediately....making sure that no more sinning and biting got another chance to lash out. Leaving it all up would of gave the Devil a foot hold that was originally NEVER meant to be.

I think that the old scripture...when you go to present your gift at the altar and remember that "Someone has aught against you"....not that you did anything wrong...but there is hard feelings ....going to them to make a clear path of understanding and family-hood is a must before coming back to offer your gift. Family is more important than gifts and definitely more important than differences of beliefs and thoughts.

I do not know the "rules" of this sight....I just know common sense....if what you are doing is causing a Brother or Sister to sin...and you can stop it or calm the waters...then you should do so and do it immediately. Your intentions might never have been to start something...but have you ever been baking a cake and your brother comes in and wants some or to lick the frosting bowl? You forget the arguments that you had on the way to school or about how to feed the dog.

Stop the train of thoughts and the arguing and focus on something good. That was my intent and I'm finding my whole benefit of this sight is fastly sliding down hill. I do not need to get bit by someone claiming to be my brother or sister...I have enough problems trying not to sin each day....and walking among the definite Devil's people.

So....with that....I'll stick to my one post if that and use the downloads. This post and the lashing really makes me wonder how much we really do love our family members. But if you are anywhere near Detroit....I make a mean Cake with great frosting!!!! Let me know and you can come over and stay over if you desire.

But no mud pies are coming in the door!!! They stay in the play ground across the street!!! I'm sorry to have cause all this was Never meant to be. All I can say is ... WOW.

Sorry Disgusted and everyone else....I need to back off and out except the downloads for now if not permantly. Way too much heat and lashing in here.

 2005/3/12 20:50

Joined: 2002/12/11
Posts: 37106
"Pilgrim and Sojourner." - 1 Peter 2:11


Greg may very well may have to remove this helpful utility if it is going to be used in this fashion. How can anyone know what is going on in a thread if we are to come along and alter it later, leaving everyone else's replies disjointed?

Mike you are right on with these comments and yes its something that might have to happen if people continue to mis-use the privledge of editing. Either I will have to approve them in the backend which could take A LONG TIME or more probably I will just take out that feature.

PJ and others please take heed to these things.

SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2005/3/12 20:57Profile

 Re: An Email to answer my thoughts -- posted

Hello Greg and Mike

Just wanted to let you know that after sleeping and praying on what took place on yesterday.... I just wanted to let you know that I am sorry for jumping all over you. Please forgive me.

You just hit me right after I was through posting after your Moderator had went off on me publicly without the proper manners of questioning me privately first (it hurt and I found it a little childish and rude).

A Suggestion if I may......When someone first joins....why not have an automatic email and welcome screen to them explaining the rules of posting and editing to them? This way they do not make a simple mistake and loose face publicly on the forum from you and/or your moderators. You might think that it's posted someone on that website....but don't you think it would cause a lot less trouble to just make is simple for them? And won't it be more loving to first go privately to your brother and/or sister and bring a matter to them first before taking it to the church publicly and shame them?

Just a thought.....cause it sure was not good style to jump publicly on me by either of you two without a personal questioning in private about it. It was a classic bad management style which all management books will show you.

I had absolutely NO idea that what I was doing (with the best intentions at heart which I explained in 2 of my posts yesterday and thought it might of been wise for you to read the most recently posted ones before jumping on me too) was something so wrong in the eyes of everyone involved on the site. Never knew it until it was publicly plastered all over.

But you know what is funny......I was really losing a lot of precious time trying to help others on the sight and taking away time from working on my book. And the Holy Spirit was pointing that out the morning of all the problems. So I guess it really was God's doing to get me off of it. And besides.....hardly can one find the fruits of the Holy Spirit on there in correcting or trying to show differences of beliefs....more like a cat fight ready to jump in. At least that is how the last posts before the blow up felt. And I learned a very valuable out about the love of money and so called "Christians".....they will stomp you down to justify their keeping of their precious money and will ignore anything on Prayer when you offer the two topics together. And don't ever expect the fruits of the Holy Spirit from this gang on here when discussing money and giving to God to show up. Maybe the wise here have experienced it and just clicked it away knowing that the newbie was about to get his initiation.

Now with all that said......I DO LOVE THE SIGHT FOR THE DOWNLOADS AND FIND THEM EXTREMELY WORTHWHILE. So my hat is off to you on that. So I shall look to the good and stay completely away from the bad.

So good luck with your schooling......and hope my suggestions will save you and others any more problems in the future. And again .... sorry for causing so much problems out of ignorance.

 2005/3/13 5:58

Joined: 2003/5/24
Posts: 138
Chicago IL USA


Matthew 18:15-17
“Moreover if your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault between you and him alone. If he hears you, you have gained your brother. 16 But if he will not hear, take with you one or two more, that by the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.’ 17 And if he refuses to hear them, tell it to the church. But if he refuses even to hear the church, let him be to you like a heathen and a tax collector.
The New King James Version.

PS [b]between you and him [/b]

PPS. I will Miss Prayer4am GOD be with you brother.


 2005/3/13 19:00Profile

Joined: 2005/1/14
Posts: 2164


Why does it say Anonymous?

Josh Parsley

 2005/3/13 21:24Profile

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